Heat Treating a Frizzen

[Will W.]

Hey all. 

I realize theres a gunsmithing section of this forum, but thats a very low traffic section near the bottom, as such i thought i could receive more information by placing this thread in General HT. 

Traditionally, the frizzen of a flintlock was case hardened, to provide a sufficient surface for the flint to create sparks from. My question; could you simply through harden a piece of, say, 1095 and do a low temper at 350-400° F? 

While i am no expert, i imagine frizzens were typically case hardened because it was simply easier, given the materials of the time. When demand for rifles was high, using high carbon blister steel would likely be too time consuming and expensive, and also a waste of good quality steel that could be used elsewhere, such as in the springs or barrels. 

Nowadays, we have easy access to high carbon steel, so it would seem logical to through harden a piece of that instead of going through the process of case hardening.

But could one expect similar results?

Thanks. 

 

[Steve Sells]

 

12 minutes ago, Will W. said:

Hey all. 

I realize theres a gunsmithing section of this forum, but thats a very low traffic section near the bottom, as such i thought i could receive more information

Wrong, it goes in gun smithing, the only reason there arent posts there is  because you didnt make any there, and to complain because that subject is posted  lower on the page is lame. there are many topics and not all of them can be  at the top.  We have subjects to keep organised. Posting because you think another area is more busy is just wrong

[CMS3900]

 

Your idea to use 1095 will work.  Some guys take and forge weld a piece of high carbon onto wrought for the frizzen.  I would check out the american longrifle forums as I know there are a few topics on this subject.

Cranky much Steve?

 

[TwistedCustoms]

I think the answer to your question  can be found by looking at CVA and other repro manufactures. I have several Thompson Center which I regard as at lest one step above CVA and the other imports and even TC doesn't really case harden anything. They, like all the others put a "case hardened patina" on some parts for aesthetics but all the trigger/hammer parts are good ole hc.

[BIGGUNDOCTOR]

As to the gunsmithing post being at the bottom. I click on the "unread content" tab and I see every new post made from the last time I checked in no matter what topic.

[Steve Sells]

50 minutes ago, CMS3900 said:

Cranky much Steve?

When a post starts off  "I know there is a place for this but I am putting it else where anyway"  YES

45,000 people posting here and to intentionally not post in the proper place is rude. and I have delt with enough  people playing games this week already

[ThomasPowers]

I do the same as BigGunDr and so see all new posts where ever they are.  Forge welding a thin HC layer would certainly be a tour de force if you are a good forge welder, otherwise probably more a tour de farce.

Trying to get good sparks with a thin cross section, using HC and tempering appropriately would probably work best.

[Will W.]

8 hours ago, Steve Sells said:

 

Wrong, it goes in gun smithing, the only reason there arent posts there is  because you didnt make any there, and to complain because that subject is posted  lower on the page is lame. there are many topics and not all of them can be  at the top.  We have subjects to keep organised. Posting because you think another area is more busy is just wrong

True enough, i concede your point. 

Thank you for the information gentleman. I do not plan to make a flintlock (yet) but it is worthwhile information nontheless. 

Never tried welding high carbon to wrought. I bet that would be interesting! Lol. 

[ThomasPowers]

So common in days gone by that one of the medieval knife categorizations is based on it.  "Knives and Scabbards, Musuem of London shows 7 different methods of combining iron and steel in edged tools.

Now for smithing you may be more familiar with wrought iron anvils with steel faces forge welded on...

[Will W.]

I know that it is a common method, or was perhaps, i meant from my experience it would be interesting, having never tried it. May have to give it a try sometime.

[Steve Sells]

start with heating the wrought side face down in the fire protecting the high carbon section, meaning allow the heat to get to the HC ONLY by going through the WI first,  this helps prevent burning the HC sections

[Will W.]

That makes sense, it would likely also help bring the wrought to the higher temperature needed to weld. Thank you for the tip. 

[Frosty]

HC has a MUCH lower welding (melting) temp than wrought which is the reason for Steve's suggested method.

Frosty The Lucky.