watermelon Posted December 16, 2017 Share Posted December 16, 2017 i have aquired a blower from a central heating boiler. i dont know the cfm but it looks like it will have enough power. however my knowledge of electronics is very lacking, and i am not sure how to wire it up to power. does it need a transformer or can it be wired directly to the mains? cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Cochran Posted December 16, 2017 Share Posted December 16, 2017 Looks like a simple thing but I don’t know enough about that blower to say for sure. Most of the motors I’ve dealt with that looked like that was directly connected to mains power by way of a switch. Brown and blue wires would be your power and the green is ground. Did you try searching any of the numbers on the sticker? You might want to pay attention to the fact the sticker says 230v. That’s not something for just anyone to mess with and it could get you seriously hurt or killed in a hurry messing with that kind of electricity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watermelon Posted December 16, 2017 Author Share Posted December 16, 2017 yeah i searched the serial number which identifies the fan model. sadly not really any info just suppliers. i also concur that motors of this style i have seen have been wired directly. i dont want to blow the motor trying without knowing. i have messed around with quite alot of basic electronics and i know how to be safe, but i appreciate the concern. i will probably have to put a housing over the motor if i end up using the fan. yeah i searched the serial number which identifies the fan model. sadly not really any info just suppliers. i also concur that motors of this style i have seen have been wired directly. i dont want to blow the motor trying without knowing. 230v 50hz is mains here in the uk, does that mean the motor can be direct wired with no transformer? i have messed around with quite alot of basic electronics and i know how to be safe, but i appreciate the concern. i will probably have to put a housing over the motor if i end up using the fan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Cochran Posted December 16, 2017 Share Posted December 16, 2017 You have a few options as far as I can see it. 1) Put a plug on it and stick it in the wall and hope nothing bad happens. 2) Wait on someone to tell you for sure it’ll be ok or it’ll blow up. 3) Find a blower you know how to wire up. I know what I’d do but what I’d do isn’t appropriate for all people. Just because I am “comfortable” with my hands in a live breaker box with 220 doesn’t mean I’m going to suggest and/or condone anyone else doing the same. I’ve seen “professional” electricians that make me nervous the way they fumble around in those boxes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc1 Posted December 16, 2017 Share Posted December 16, 2017 7 hours ago, watermelon said: i have aquired a blower from a central heating boiler. i dont know the cfm but it looks like it will have enough power. however my knowledge of electronics is very lacking, and i am not sure how to wire it up to power. does it need a transformer or can it be wired directly to the mains? cheers! That is a mains blower but designed for a different country not US. Of course I don't know where you are so if you are in UK or Australia you are fine. If you are in Australia, remember that it is illegal to do any electrical work by yourself. That blower is for a 50 HZ network and in the US you have 60HZ. Generally small motors like that will work on both frequency with some limitations overheating and underperforming, however since you are going the other way, and the speed will be limited by the load, it may work OK on 60HZ. Of course suggestions to plug it in, is wrong unless you have a 220V 60Hz powerpoint in the house/workshop. No motor wired for 230 will run on 110V and don't even try. You could buy a step up transformer though ... always assuming you are in the US. Just to clarify, 220V 230V or 240V is more or less the same. 110V 120V is more or less the same. 110v and 220V is not the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watermelon Posted December 16, 2017 Author Share Posted December 16, 2017 i dont really see what there is to be scared of. im not going to touch live parts and all connections will be solid. electriciry is safe as long as you are careful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted December 16, 2017 Share Posted December 16, 2017 Welcome aboard Watermelon, glad to have you. If you'll put your general location in the header you might be surprised how many of the Iforge gang live within visiting distance. I'm thinking you could really use a visit from an electrician member right about now. If you're handling electricity and don't see anything to be scared of you need professional assistance. You may not get shocked but its entirely possible to burn the house/shop/etc. down with a little tiny bit of cross wiring. Breakers/fuses/CFIs or not. In the Boy Scouts we learned to light a fire with a flash light battery and that's not enough wattage to feel let alone blow a circuit breaker. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy k Posted December 16, 2017 Share Posted December 16, 2017 Why not just ask your local electrician - as they would know more than asking on a blacksmithing forum(no offence to the electricians on here), and they would know more about your local power supply requirements, codes etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watermelon Posted December 16, 2017 Author Share Posted December 16, 2017 i really do understand your concern but i am going to do things safely. i am going to run it with an RCD, all wires will be soldered, secured, and shrink wrapped. i have some brackets to mount the fan to a log so it wont move around. theres not really any chance of cross wiring. if it works out being useful i would build a housing of some type. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Sells Posted December 16, 2017 Share Posted December 16, 2017 no chance of cross wiring but had to post this thread to ask ?????. OK not even going to try.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watermelon Posted December 16, 2017 Author Share Posted December 16, 2017 you guys are getting way to hung up on this. look im even doing the research by asking here. my issue is whether this motor needs a transformer or if it can just run on mains. i dont have any experience with motors. if it needs a transformer i will have to go down a diffrent line if enquiry. if it runs on main its just two connections over an inch apart. where is cross wiring going to happen? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watermelon Posted December 16, 2017 Author Share Posted December 16, 2017 2 hours ago, Marc1 said: That is a mains blower but designed for a different country not US. Of course I don't know where you are so if you are in UK or Australia you are fine. If you are in Australia, remember that it is illegal to do any electrical work by yourself. That blower is for a 50 HZ network and in the US you have 60HZ. Generally small motors like that will work on both frequency with some limitations overheating and underperforming, however since you are going the other way, and the speed will be limited by the load, it may work OK on 60HZ. Of course suggestions to plug it in, is wrong unless you have a 220V 60Hz powerpoint in the house/workshop. No motor wired for 230 will run on 110V and don't even try. You could buy a step up transformer though ... always assuming you are in the US. Just to clarify, 220V 230V or 240V is more or less the same. 110V 120V is more or less the same. 110v and 220V is not the same. hi marc, yeah im in the uk, we have 230v 50hz mains here. thanks for the info Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc1 Posted December 16, 2017 Share Posted December 16, 2017 If you are in the UK, it's just a plug and play then. Not sure you are allowed to do it yourself in UK though ... actually I think you can just like in NZ. So no issues with the frequency. You have 240V 50Hz nominal 230V. Your colour code is Brown = active ... blue = neutral, green is earth. Your wall socket has 3 holes. The top is the earth, the right side as you look at the wall is the line or active (some people say "live") and the left is Neutral. If you go and buy a plug, you guys use "G" type plugs that have a fuse inside. When you open the plug you must make sure to have the brown wire from your load attached to the side where the fuse is, (right) and the left is for your blue wire, neutral, and the green is your earth and goes to the big pin at the top. The connections are marked inside. Here is a video that tells you how to do it. This is a video for the UK and for G type powerpoint and plugs and does not apply to the US nor Australia. In Australia the powerpoints look like yours but upside down so the earth is below, the active is on the left on the wall and neutral on the right. US is different again. ://plumbing-n-electric.wonderhowto.com/how-to/wire-type-g-electrical-plug-294855/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timgunn1962 Posted December 16, 2017 Share Posted December 16, 2017 OK. Knowing you are in the UK makes things relatively easy. No transformer needed. Brown Live, Blue Neutral, Green/Yellow Protective Earth. You can wire with a normal 13A plug and pretty much any mains-rated 3-core cable (0.75 to 1.5 square millimetre will be fine). You'll probably need to buy some receptacles (aka female spade connectors) to fit on the spade connections on the motor. Buy from somewhere that sells electrical stuff, rather than automotive bits. There are 4.8 mm and 6.4mm spade widths. Those look like 6.4mm/1/4". They are by far the most common size so if there's not an option, it's pretty safe to assume they'll be the right ones. The red-insulated ones fit wires up to 1.5mm sq and will be the ones you want. Use a purpose-designed crimping tool, the cheap ones are fine for occasional use. I'd fit a 3A fuse in the plug, as the fan is only rated 82W, so should only pull about a third of an Amp. Only run it from an RCD-protected socket. If you are in a property with old wiring that does not include RCD protection, Screwfix and Toolstation sell 13A RCD plugs and lots of places sell RCD adaptors. Use one; there's a decent chance it'll save a life, probably yours. It's a shaded-pole motor and they tend to run hot. You'll probably need to sort out the broken fan on the motor shaft if you are intending to run it for very long. I don't know what was on the front of the casing originally, but it's a pretty safe bet the inlet was a lot smaller than the big hole that's there now. You'll likely need to close it down to a smaller entry with a cover plate. The outer edge of the impeller is visible and it'll leak out lots of air as it is now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc1 Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 You can probably buy a plug already wired with a meter or so of cable and spade connectors attached from your local electrical wholesaler. That little fan surely need replacing. It would be interesting to make one out of aluminium and balancing it properly. If you have the original covers for front and back, you could do without the fan and drill a hole in the casing to use some of the air from the blower to cool the motor. A bit hit and miss though to guess the volume of air required and so the right size hole. If you don't have the covers, I think you are in for more work than it's worth to get that thing working again ... unless you enjoy shaping sheet metal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted December 17, 2017 Share Posted December 17, 2017 1 hour ago, watermelon said: hi marc, yeah im in the uk, As you see a lot of answers are location dependent. As Frosty suggested edit your profile to show your location and we won't have to ask you all the time and we won't remember your location after leaving this thread. BTW: welcome to the forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watermelon Posted December 18, 2017 Author Share Posted December 18, 2017 On 16/12/2017 at 11:54 PM, timgunn1962 said: It's a shaded-pole motor and they tend to run hot. You'll probably need to sort out the broken fan on the motor shaft if you are intending to run it for very long. I don't know what was on the front of the casing originally, but it's a pretty safe bet the inlet was a lot smaller than the big hole that's there now. You'll likely need to close it down to a smaller entry with a cover plate. The outer edge of the impeller is visible and it'll leak out lots of air as it is now. yeah it is a shame the fan got broken. im hoping it is not going to be a problem, i think it will be ok because it used to be running in an elnclosed box inside the boiler, where there is little air circulation. i will be running it in the open air with more air moving around it. i will test it to see how it does. i wish i still had the cover plate. i have no idea what size the hole needs to be. i could make somthing out of plastic or ali, but i dont know how to test it other than just feeling the output with my hand. thanks for all your advice guys! much appreciated. i have mounted the fan, wired it all up, and tested it. it worked fine. its all safe with rcd, earthed cable, and insulated crimped spade ends. i want to add a foot switch when i find a suitable one. an electrician friend down the pub said i can easily fit a speed controller. would this be a dimmer type switch, or a specific "speed controller"? anyone have a rough idea as to the tyere diameter i should go for? my intuition says just use one the sameish size as the fan output. is there any befenfit to reducing it down? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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