offgrid Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 New guy from 9800' Colorado. Recently picked up a Peter Wright Anvil, welded up a stand based on designs I've seen here... Now in the planning stage of a forge/burner. Have a interested Bushcraft sized knives and Axes. Want to be able to weld. Considering a 20lb propane tank size forge. Any help will be appreciated regarding burner design. Thanks, Kevin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 I've tested Stephen Gensheimer's burner at 5000' with great results. I need to haul it up to 10000 and try it there (parking lot of the Magdalena Ridge Observatory) I think with a blown burner you wouldn't worry about altitude till you got up to supercharger heights. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted June 14, 2017 Share Posted June 14, 2017 Welcome aboard Kevin, glad to have you. No problem, it's just a matter of tuning the fuel air ratio to the altitude. What kind of burner are you thinking about making or buying? If you follow the general method and manner of gas forge making you'll want the equivalent of two, 3/4" NA burners. the 3/4" is the inside diameter of the mixing tube. Gun (blown) burners need tuning every time you change the output so operating elevation doesn't matter. The gas forge and burner sections of Iforge are pretty extensive and there are two current threads on the subjects now: "Burners 101" and "Forges 101." A little reading will help a lot, once you have a handle on the why fors of the things it makes asking questions much easier and more profitable. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offgrid Posted June 14, 2017 Author Share Posted June 14, 2017 Thanks for the replies. Will build the burner(s), open to any design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted June 15, 2017 Share Posted June 15, 2017 Elevation was a concern in naturally aspirated burners in the past. Since the introduction of inline MIG tips and capillary tubes (to replace side holes) as gas jets, it is hard to find a weak enough burner for elevation to matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted June 15, 2017 Share Posted June 15, 2017 How good are your shop skills and how well equipped is your shop? Burner builds run the full gamut from, HOLY MACKEREL is that all there is to it!?! To needs a machine shop and laser measuring devices. Gun (blow) burners are pretty straight forward to make and work well but you're tied to electricity and to change the heat output you need to tune the fuel air input. neither is a big deal but they are considerations. Naturally aspirated burners are by nature harder to build but once made and tuned they're not tied to electricity and you can change heat output by changing the propane input. The propane shooting down the mixing tube draws combustion air in a reasonably flat curve and so maintains the fuel air ratio. There's also a lot of variation in complexity and efficiency in either type. It's a good subject to spend time reading about and a really GOOD idea to ignore what you see on YouTube. Iforge has an extensive gas burner and forge section and more than a couple guys who build the things. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mtnstream Posted June 15, 2017 Share Posted June 15, 2017 My DIY propane forge is just a single burner (naturally aspirated) and does fine at 7400'....soon moving to 8600'. I think the interior size of the forge is what makes the difference, irrespective of altitude. One of my very early attempts was square and too large (2 sq ft). The one I use now is a half circle and less than a sq foot. Heats up just fine at altitude. Read the forge and burner build sections on this forum, lots of good information here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikey98118 Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 On 6/15/2017 at 11:46 AM, Frosty said: It's a good subject to spend time reading about and a really GOOD idea to ignore what you see on YouTube. I have seen everything from quit good to bad information about forges on YouTube. Unfortunately burners there, mostly run the gamut from hilarious to outright dreadful. that should have read "quite" not quit. If you want to play around with axes, try looking into buying or building an oval forge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 There is good information on Youtube but have to have a good enough base of knowledge to tell the good from the . . . family forum restraint from invectives, bad and criminally dangerous foolishness. I think Youtube should be used as a living example of, "A little knowledge is dangerous." Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.C. Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 Just my 2¢, I use a single frosty t burner at 7000 feet in Wyoming in a similar sized forge as your looking to build. It was pretty simple to tune, and I get welding heat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker S Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 I’m trying to get into forging and I have a forge built and just trying to get the burner to work. I have about a 16 in pipe with one layer of kale wool and some fire brick on the bottom. When I try to start the burner they either don’t stay on or they don’t burn very good. I’m about 6700 feet what can I do to get them working good. I have already tried drilling holes in the burner pipe to let air in below the welding tip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 So you are burning hydrogen in a blown burner? Can you give us DETAILS on the burner from the inside of the forge to the gas supply? This is like saying "My vehicle is running rough, how do I fix it?" without telling us if it's diesel, gas, carbureted, fuel injection, recently in a flood, etc... 6700' is not that high, I've successively run a NA burner on propane over 7000' and have always wanted to get permission to try one out at 10000'; I can see the Magdalena Ridge Observatory from my front yard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George N. M. Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 Welcome aboard from 7500' in SE Wyoming. Glad to have you. I don't think your problems are due to altitude. I run my modified sandia forge at 7500' at about 11 pounds psi and it is just fine. I can't suggest or diagnose your problem since I am pretty much a plug and play guy when it comes to propane forges. Listen to what Mikey and Frosty have to say and said on this thread previously. BTW, if you put your general location in your profile it will help with the answers we give. A surprising number of answers are depenant on geography. We don't know if you are at 6700' in the Rockies, Alps, or Himalayas. If you are in Colorado or southern Wyoming I strongly suggest that you look up Rocky Mountain Smiths and join. They are a good bunch and have good events. "By hammer and hand all arts do stand." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 Welcome from the Ozark mountains. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swedefiddle Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 Good Mourning "S" Welcome from the Left Coast of a big Island called Norse Hamericca. We have no idea of what you are trying to make work. I just received a couple 'Propane Injectors' from the UK. Connect the Propane or Natural Gas (not mine) as per which one you order and they work fantastic, right out of the box. Yes they are adjustable and are not expensive. We cannot see into the grey matter between your ears. Whatever you are trying to make work. Keep trying combinations until you get it to work. Neil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted July 7, 2022 Share Posted July 7, 2022 Welcome aboard Walker, glad to have you. If you put your general location in the header you'll have the chance of meeting up with members living within visiting distance. From your description it's clear what your problem is. You've made a number of mistakes I'll be more than happy to help you solve. Unfortunately you'll have to tell me more about your burner like what kind it is and details about how you built it. Details like a parts list, dimensions, etc. We can correct your forge concepts as we progress with the burner. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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