Steel Dragon Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 I am new here and have a few couple general questions about anvils. I have read that the working face is not parallel to the bottom of the foot, could someone explain this in detail? Why do anvils not have holes through the feet for mounting? Thank you in advance Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 Anvils used to be freehanded under open die steam hammers (and even earlier under water powered tilt hammers) they were not drop forged in closed dies; so every one was hand forged, every one is slightly different. Are your hand forged items perfectly parallel? Try it with 8' tongs attached to your work piece and someone swinging a sledge at your command 10 feet away; how parallel are you getting things? Anvils are used in a "loose" system, the height, orientation and "levelness" can all be changed by the smith to suit their style of working and what they are doing---we are not working on surface plates with micrometers! The smith can modify his hammer strike in MANY ways to provide the impact he thinks the piece needs. Precision costs money; are you willing to pay US$5000 extra for an anvil that it good to a tenth if one that's +/- 1/8" will do the job for everyone else? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobody Special Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 They also have been used, used, and used. My go-to anvil turns 200 this year, There tends to be wear, tear, and compression, especially over the sweet spot that means not only can it be non-parallel, it may be swaybacked (an extremely useful condition by the way). It was not unheard of at all for a smith to turn their anvils on different angles to work with the various shapes, say using the side as a swage. As to the feet - Screws, although around, didn't really become a cheap fastener until the mid to late 1800s. Some anvils, especially 20th century anvils made from cast iron or cast steel do have mounting holes, but many saw no reason to change. A large staple over the feet can be made in a couple of minutes, comes out easily, and costs nothing but a small piece of scrap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steel Dragon Posted March 31, 2016 Author Share Posted March 31, 2016 Thank you for the response I had read a post about anvils not being parallel that gave me the impression it was intentional, your answers make prefect sense True, screws are relatively "new" in the big scheme of things, I didn't think about that. My wife and I have talked about our interest in blacksmithing for years, now that the kids are on there own, we are pursuing a new hobby From what I have read I'm going to take some heat for this, but my first project is going to be casting a steel anvil. I am planning on documenting the whole process in a thread start to finish, design through machining Thanks again Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 *MUCH* more expensive than getting an anvil pretty much any other way. Have you talked with any of the people who have already went this route? What alloy are you planning to use? What heat treat? Hardness of the face? What style? (cf: NIMBA cast steel anvils for an example of a differing style than the typical london pattern, also the rathole ones, the H13 colonial style anvils Jymm Hoffman has cast---hoffmansforge.com; etc.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steel Dragon Posted March 31, 2016 Author Share Posted March 31, 2016 I am fortunate to be a patternmaker and to be involved day to day with a steel and iron foundry If I don't put a price on my time this anvil will be cheaper than buying a used one 8630 is the alloy I am leaning towards, H13 is an option but proper heat treatment could be an issue and an added expense. I still have more research to do as far as heat treatment and face hardness I am still deciding on the style, I am leaning towards a hybrid of the traditional London and Nimba. I've sketched out a few but haven't fully committed to a design. I am open to any and all suggestions Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kozzy Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 I took the link from another post on IFI so I assume it's "passable" even though it points to another site: http://www.bladesmithsforum.com/index.php?showtopic=27056 There is a long write up of suggestions as someone else develops and designs a cast anvil (happens to be the same anvil I obtained) Might contain some issues and suggestions that help in the design of yours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steel Dragon Posted March 31, 2016 Author Share Posted March 31, 2016 What a great link! Thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobody Special Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 If you have a good deal of experience and access to a foundry, it should help things considerably. There are large number of people that come to the site with no casting experience and visions of producing cheap anvils by casting them in their backyard, sometimes accompanied w questions about coffee can furnaces and fire extinguisher crucibles. Then they usually get upset when people suggest that their method might not be safe, easy, or cheap and go away mad. If and when you do, would you mind documenting it and posting? The rat hole anvils are H13, I believe, and they are "flipping sweet". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matei campan Posted March 31, 2016 Share Posted March 31, 2016 a southern German pattern double horn would be my favourite. if you ever start working on a double horn anvil, it would be very hard to go back on a London pattern (which is a good complement, though), the opposite move is very easy. there are some French anvils with very interesting features, especially in the transition from the round horn to the face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbo7 Posted April 1, 2016 Share Posted April 1, 2016 Mate if your going to cast an anvil please answer the most often asked question on here about anvils... By putting the YOM on it! Also give it a bit of style with church windows. Hope it goes well for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steel Dragon Posted April 1, 2016 Author Share Posted April 1, 2016 Yes, it definitely needs to have some "style". That's going to be the hardest part, adding sexiness without impeding function Once I have a design on the screen, I will start another thread to document the whole process Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted April 1, 2016 Share Posted April 1, 2016 Remember if it's to be custom make it suit what *you* do. If you do a lot of ornamental work turning cams like on the new farrier anvils might be a big help. If you are forging out 5# billets of high alloy pattern welded steel a massive sweet spot and little overhang in heel might be a plus. Signed and dated is a given. I just wish I could have asked Gaudi to design an anvil for me.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironmutt Posted April 7, 2016 Share Posted April 7, 2016 we have a local foundry here and i have often wondered about having an anvil cast but figured it would be cost prohibitive even if i made the prototype for them to make the mold from . i will def be following you post to see how it turns out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted April 7, 2016 Share Posted April 7, 2016 3 hours ago, ironmutt said: we have a local foundry here and i have often wondered about having an anvil cast but figured it would be cost prohibitive even if i made the prototype for them to make the mold from . i will def be following you post to see how it turns out In your case you can probably get one poured from the end of a melt, there is usually quite a bit from the bottom of the crucible and or melter that goes back in the pot so to speak. If you come up with the pattern the guys ramming up or investing the molds might amenable to molding it up for a little consideration. The actual iron price wouldn't be a lot compared to making the mold. Still probably a lot easier and cheaper to find a used one but it IS fun to think about. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gote Posted April 7, 2016 Share Posted April 7, 2016 I agree nearly 100% with Matei. The difference is that I prefer is the Swedish position of the square hole. It is on the side of the square horn. What I percieve as weaknesses of the Lodon pattern are that the hardy hole sits far away from the bulk of the anvil and that the geometrical shape makes it noisy. The noisness may be less pronounced if the anvil is made with a joint between two materials but an all steel cast anvil will have next to no internal damping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRS Posted April 7, 2016 Share Posted April 7, 2016 And I agree with gote, but the holes can be too close to the body. round and square hole on my anvil sit exactly centred above the end of the feet, I would prefer clearance under the holes. Not long ago I have seen a anvil the same pattern as mine with a notch cut into the feet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gote Posted April 8, 2016 Share Posted April 8, 2016 My holes go clear of the feet exactly. Fortunately I have nevver been forced to turn the anvil on tits side to be able to get something out of the hole. (110 kg) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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