vibratory tumbler

[phabib]

I was recently able to pick up a vibratory tumber and some media and having never used one I thought I'd ask for some advice.

This is a small tub type tumbler with variable speed.  The tub is about 23Lx8Wx6D.  You can see the media go around in a circle and shake like crazy.  It does not use a motor, it uses some electromagnets to vibrate the tub and comes with a 10A fuse so I'm sure there is some real power behind it.  It came with a tubfull of ceramic rods that have embedded abrasive flecks in it.  The rods are about 3/4" long by 3/16 across and are cut at an angle on the ends.

I've seen suggestions to run it was some water with dishwasher detergent or simple green it.  I also so some commercial descaling/anti rust proprietary mixes online.  I'm not sure if its worth spending the money on the fancy liquids.

Any experience with what works best and what the differences in characteristics are between the rods, or pyramids, or triangles, or other fancy shapes of media?  What would be a good thing to use for descaling vs. for polishing?  I'm mostly thinking of this as a way to keep my son away from wire wheels without me having to do it for him.

Oh yeah, this thing is beyond noisy.  It will make a great end of the day start it up before leaving the garage kind of tool.

Thanks.

[the iron dwarf]

dry they make a lot of dust when descaling or derusting

[Kozzy]

Mine also sounds like a freight train so I generally run it as little as possible and off hours.  

I have triangles and they cause me some problems--jam really well into 1" bores on parts.  One of these days I'll change to smaller rods or cones.  I found that the action of the triangles is so mild that at best, I get a little bit of clean-up but almost no breakdown of sharp edges or deburring action from them.  They are more of a polishing media and if the part is not already good and smooth, it isn't going to get much better.

I also have some media that looks exactly like Hershey's kisses chocolates--and those are much coarser and aggressive.  I use them almost exclusively because I get a better finished result in terms of deburring.  They still don't really break sharp edges much but they do show a surfacing effect on the parts.

I run wet.  When I bought it used, it came with a 5 gallon bucket marked by the former owner "deburring soap".  Although I am not sure of brand or anything, I can tell that it's really heavy on anti-foaming agents.  Might even be something like clothes washer soap (about that thick).  I generally run just wet enough that everything is fluidized and well wetted but not underwater.

It generates enough "mud" from the breakdown of those "kisses" that I flush it regularly.  

[Alan Evans]

I found that the time spent rinsing and drying after tumbling meant that the saving of time over phospheric acid pickling and wire brushing did not justify either the noise or the maintenance of the media. Mine was a big spring mounted rubber lined trough with a 3 phase motor with eccentric weights bolted underneath.

I ended up moving away from wet processes and now usually finish by shot blasting and then wire brush burnishing if required.

Tumbling silver I used to do successfully. The media was just offcuts of silver and washing up liquid. It was the problem of cleaning the media slurry off the mild steel and then drying and finishing it before it got a bloom of rust that I struggled with. But then I did not have the correct ceramic media or solutions...or the water supply...or the particle filtering settlement tank drainage system. Not really a fair test I suppose!

 Alan

p.s. the stainless steel pins they use for polishing cartridge brass might be a way forward and would certainly generate less slurry. A trough full of stainless steel offcuts and a few SS nuts and bolts could be an answer.  Alan 

[Glenn]

The tumbler I used was a 55 gallon drum on a frame with wheels to support the drum. A very large belt went around the drum and the pulley of the motor. Tumbling media was any small bits of metal or rusty nails. It made a LOT of noise and made a lot of dust.

Another blacksmith suggested adding a small amount of sand containing some boiled linseed oil. The end result was much less dust and the finished product had a light oil finish when done. An added bonus were the clean (like new) nails that could now be used for other projects. Change the sand when it gets dirty.

You can use a large truck tire as a tumbler. Much less noise. (grin)

[phabib]

One encouraging thing about this tumbler is that it has a 1 hour timer on the panel.  Makes me think the maker didn't think I'd have to run it overnight to get results.  The manufacturer's address on the label is just a few miles down the road, but they seem to have disappeared into the Valley's industrial past.  When the turn the intensity know all the way, you can see the media buzzing and shaking and watch it move around the tub at an inch or two a second.  That's got to do some work.

[Alan Evans]

My understanding is that the workpiece is tumbled through the media in both...the effect is the same, but the cause is either...

Tumbler = rotary action. The vessel is often facetted and has a sealing lid if rotated horizontally, as in pebble polishing for lapidary or Glen's description above. Can be open and at an angle like a concrete mixer, which can be used as they are or improved with a rubber lined tub. My jewellery tumbler was simply a Ø100mm (Ø4") plastic hand cream pot attached to the platter of an old record player turntable which was propped up at a 30˚ angle.

Rumbler = Vibratory action. Open trough or vessel where the vibrations cause the media and workpiece to rotate.

I am interested by the use of oil in the media in Glen's description. It appears counter intuitive from the point of view of wanting to abrade rather than lubricate which is almost diametrically opposite. But the increased length of time required to abrade which is not labour intensive may well be compensated for by the reduced amount of slurry clean off and finishing afterward, which is labour intensive.

The oil may not be good for the rubber lining...or is it just mineral oil that rots rubber?

Alan

[nuge]

I use two big Thumler vibratory machines and tumble dry and have used a variety of media.  The two I like best are carbon steel ballcones and porcelain balls.  I like the finish of the steel a bit better and the ease of cleanup of the ceramic is nice as I have to wash (simply running a wet cycle or two with some simple green and water) and rinse after five to six cycles.  It's not a tough process and I very much prefer the work to my alternative finish which is an angle grinder mounted wire brush.  Cleaning the carbon steel is just more finicky trying to avoid rust.  Working this system in the winter gets harder as I don't always have the heated space ( tumbling requires some room) and water supply readily available so I tend to finish in large batches if possible.  I am always looking for some stainless media but that stuff is expensive at retail.

 I have heard that in barrel type tumblers you can suck out a lot of the scale dust with a vacuum while the machine is running and the particles are airborne.  Seems like the best way if it works.  

[rockstar.esq]

My experience with tumblers is primarily brass polishing for reloading.  The focus there isn't deburring but it is polishing and cleaning.  Crushed walnut media is really popular and also, really expensive.  For cleaning and polishing, it's hard to beat plain uncooked rice.  If you're in a hurry, use minute rice! Tossing in a damp paper towel tends to trap the grit in the paper and keeps the dust down.  Small quantities of brasso or something similar leave the cases gleaming.  Some folks substituted a dryer sheet for the paper towel and got similar results.

I am curious if anybody's used abrasive impregnated rubber as tumbling media?  That cratex stuff is really abrasive and you can get a beautiful finish with it.  Rubber's a natural noise reducer as well.

At a minimum, I wonder if rubber balls would mitigate noise when mixed with other media like ceramic.

 

 

[Frosty]

A few years ago I made a tumbler from a 55gl drum with a locking lid. I welded a 2" lifting lug in it and mounted it on a tipping drum stand with the motor on a hinge board underneath it and driven by belt around the drum and pully on the motor. Simple and works nicely at about 40rpm. However, bouncing almost anything in a steel drum WILL wear holes in it pretty quickly while being LOUD. I put this one together right after finding a gallon can of bed liner paint at a yard sale. A Rhino Liner kind of product meant for patching truck beds, etc. It really REALLY quietened it down and better still armored the inside wonderfully. It served me well for several years before the accident with no apparent wear. The media I used was pinch offs and other steel bits and gravel, I'd toss in a shovel full every now and then.

Frosty The Lucky.

[yesteryearforge]

My tumbler is a cheap plastic drum cement mixer from tractor supply .

I added 3 pieces of sheet metal vanes to do the tumbling.

My media is used carbide inserts and silica sand

The plastic drum is a lot quieter than the metal drums  and has held up well so far.

Plus it is easy to clean out ( just pull the lever and dump like a load of cement )