Coffee can forge for getting started again

[JHCC]

Hi, all. As noted elsewhere, I'm restarting my old blacksmithing hobby as something to do with my son. The modus operandi at this point is to start with what's left of my old setup (my old anvil and some hammers) and making, modifying, and MacGuyvering everything else. Cheap is good; free is better.
 

So, I looked around at what I've got to actually heat the metal and decided to make an adobe-lined coffee can forge to use with an existing propane torch. This post is to document the process and record the mistakes for me to fix next time!

So, I have plenty of clay here in NE Ohio. Here's my son grinding up some dried lumps of clay I'd set aside for a pottery project that never materialized.

I didn't have any sand, but I do have some sandstone that crushes easily.

I figured that I could cut a hole in the bottom of the can for longer stock and make an adobe plug to close it off if necessary. Here is the bottom marked for that hole.

Here's the side marked for the burner hole.

And the other side marked for the holes to mount it to the base.

Holes punched for bolt holes. Used a big nail I had sitting around.

The hole cut in the bottom. I don't have tinsnips, so I bashed out the hole with a cold chisel. Bubba looks through the hole.

[Frosty]

A hard lined bean can forge doesn't get very hot for the fuel burned and won't last long. If you call around HVAC and commercial furnace companies you can often get Kaowool or the equivalent for a song or nothing from their trimmings and scrap. You can make a couple bean can forges for $10.00 worth at full retail.

A little kiln wash will help protect the ceramic wool from welding fluxes and poking. No matter what though, forge liners are wear items, they don't last forever and if you use adobe not long at all. Heat checking will break it right up.

Frosty The Lucky.

[JHCC]

Side hole bashed out as well.

[ThomasPowers]

No, you need an insulative refractory if you are going to do much good with a propane torch.  Why document on the net doing it wrong?

[JHCC]

So here are all the holes.

A salvaged brake disc for a base.

And some toilet bolts to attach it.

Of course, it's not a project until someone bleeds...

Everything bolted together and ready for adobe.

Half sand, half clay, enough water to make a pretty stiff mud.

And adobe in. The white plastic thingy is a drinking cup that will act as a core to keep the adobe from slumping while it dries. The WD-40 can is similarly intended to form the hole for the burner. I'll let it dry for a couple of days, and see how things are going.

[JHCC]

Frosty and ThomasPowers:

Thanks for the input. I certainly don't intend for this to be a permanent forge; just something to get started. If/when the adobe craps out on me, I will hopefully had time to scrounge some proper materials. The advantage of this particular setup is that it's entirely made from things I had on hand that didn't cost me anything. My wife can tell you precisely how cheap I am!

As for why documenting this on the net? Well, it's fun, I've already gotten some good advice about the next version, and it gives you the opportunity to warn other newbies about not repeating my foolish mistakes. You're welcome!

[ThomasPowers]

Cheap?  As in "I want to spend US$120 extra in fuel to save $12 for an insulative refractory" cheap?

Shoot you could have filled it with wood ashes with a skim coat of clay and saved fuel.

On almost any type of forge the fuel cost ends up being the heavy hitter. I have a forge that I have put over $1000 in fuel through; of course it's taken me over 25 years to do so... Would you trade in your vehicle for one that got 4 miles to the gallon just because it was free?

Also that side hole  when I made a torch powered forge my side hole was slightly bigger than my torch tip---under 1/2 ".  Makes me wonder if you are trying to use a weed burner and scale your work to death

[JHCC]

Would you trade in your vehicle for one that got 4 miles to the gallon just because it was free?

Of course not. However, if I had no car at all but did have a can of gas sitting around and someone gave me a beater that I could drive for a while, sure, why not?

Similarly, the torch -- a general purpose Harbor Freight torch I already had -- isn't perfect and probably will cause some scaling, but it will work a lot better than putting the iron out in the sun and waiting for it to heat up enough to forge, which AT THE MOMENT is my only other option.

Here's the deal: I joke about it, but I am on an extremely tight budget, and I don't have a penny to spare on anything. If a flawed design and crappy execution POS forge gets me and my son (an autistic twelve-year-old with a short attention span) working some metal while I work on scrounging better materials or scraping together the cash for a better setup, great. Frankly, I'd rather be doing something than doing nothing, even if it's not up to anyone else's (perfectly reasonable) standards.

(And another thing: Bubba and I had an absolute blast working together on this. Even if the forge is a total failure as a forge, the project has already been a total success.)

Edited August 7, 2015 by JHCC

[Buzzkill]

You probably already know this, but that mix will soak up a lot of heat and transfer it to the outside of the can.  Not only will you burn significantly more fuel, you may have trouble reaching forging temperatures unless you have a really hot torch. If you were dead set on using that mix you should have added something to introduce air pockets to help with insulating properties.  Perlite is very cheap and would fit the bill.  Even sawdust would help as it would burn after firing  and create air pockets in your lining.  As Thomas pointed out, wood ashes with a clay coating would also have given you a lot better insulation to hold the heat in your forge.

 

Anyway, good luck and I hope it works out for you.

[JHCC]

Thanks, Buzzkill. I'm hoping to scrounge some better material soon, but it I can't, I'll keep the perlite/sawdust/wood ashes idea as a backup.

[Dave Budd]

When I started reading this thread, I was expecting you to go down the solid fuel route based on the use of the clay. Why not make Mark 2 a charcoal burning forge instead? You can make the forge body, lining, air supply and fuel for free that way! Making the charcoal will presumably also appeal to the young'un too    

[JHCC]

I had thought about that, but I've never forged with gas and wanted to give it a try. I'll probably end up making a T burner around the same time that I change the lining.

Or I'll tear the whole thing apart and use the brake disc as the foundation for some kind of open hearth forge. Who knows?

Edited August 7, 2015 by JHCC

[JHCC]

Further thought: on observing how long the adobe is taking to dry (not surprising, since there's no air circulation), I've decided to go a totally different route. I have an old metal bucket kicking around somewhere, and I think I will line that with ash and clay (as Dave Budd suggests) to make an open-hearth charcoal forge. I've got both a shopvac and a leaf blower that I can use for forcing air, so let's see how that works.

[jcornell]

Here's home-made forge #4 - I built two out of insulating fire brick and two out of coffee cans.  This one is lined with one inch of superwool (like kaowool but water soluble for safety).  It's coated inside with a mix of rigidizer, zircopax and kaolin.

Also pictured are two home-built burners, one a wye burner (based on the z-burner) and the other a version of a nano-mongo burner.

Cheap to build, works well, reaches welding heat.  My son managed to make a 19" super-bowie in this forge, which is kind of pushing the envelope, but it tells you that it's more than just a toy forge.

[ThomasPowers]

A hair dryer puts out too much air for a charcoal forge so plan a way to restrict your air input.  When I used a shop vac into a close to 3' long trench forge dug in the back yard I had the tuyere pipe and blower pipe offset and adjust air input by how far apart and how coaxial they were.

Heres the deal: with the same cost and using found materials you can build a great forge or a poor one; I'd suggest going for the great one you will enjoy using it more.

BTW you can cook over the charcoal forge too; so making a marshmallow roaster/hot dog roaster and then testing them out can be a good project.  I like to take old election signs---we have ones made from unplated steel wire bent into a square U out here and many get left in the public rightaway for months after an election.  For a short toasting fork take 1 leg; slightly longer one leg and the top; or large the whole thing.  Heat the corners and straighten on the anvil using a chunk of wood as the hammer. Let cool, then heat the center of the piece and bend it back on itself.  Leave a 4" section of the doubled over end and then heat below that and stick it in a vise and twist. Continue heating and twisting until you get 4" or so from the oen end and then open it up and forge the tines.  Adjust to suit yourself---I open the handle and true up the tines against a piece of sq tubing.

Edited August 7, 2015 by ThomasPowers

[JHCC]

 

A hair dryer puts out too much air for a charcoal forge so plan a way to restrict your air input.  When I used a shop vac into a close to 3' long trench forge dug in the back yard I had the tuyere pipe and blower pipe offset and adjust air input by how far apart and how coaxial they were.

The leaf blower I have in mind has a damper on its air intake. I've always thought it was pretty useless for a leaf blower, but I suspect it will work well for regulating airflow for the forge. 

(Sorry I was a little grumpy yesterday, by the way. Nothing personal; I do appreciate the advice.)

[JHCC]

The charcoal forge project is documented here. Frosty's busting my chops already.

[ThomasPowers]

Shoot a lot of us were born grumpy;  I worked from 8am to 9:30 pm yesterday standing on a concrete floor most of it with a high of 102 and the factory doesn't cool it down much on the line.... I'm surprised you didn't slap me with a 3 day old fish!  I've done the toasting forks with a cub scout den, adults up past 80, and with folks with various physical and mental problems.  Welders gloves help with those who have trouble taking care of avoiding the hot pieces as they get twisted.

[JHCC]

Okay, the universe has come back to spank me for talking trash about being cheap. I stopped at a local antique shop to see if they had a cheap washtub for a Tim Lively-type forge, and wouldn't you know that they had practically the twin of my old farm forge. A quick phone conference with the wife about the possibility of putting it on a credit card (given that we're trying not to add to the overall debt), and it's mine. Things were helped by the fact that apparently my daughter also wants to learn to blacksmith, not just my son.

[ThomasPowers]

I've seen a number of highly skilled Women smiths demo'ing at various conference---encourage her!  (and try to get her interested in welding too---good skills to have in their future lives!)

Give serious thought to going to Quad-State in late September in Troy OH; the whole family can camp onsite and the tool sales will blow the most generous budget---had a fellow down here in NM and the first Quad-State he went to he bought 30 anvils and had to buy a bigger trailer to get them back home...

Edited August 9, 2015 by ThomasPowers

[JHCC]

Give serious thought to going to Quad-State in late September in Troy OH; the whole family can camp onsite and the tool sales will blow the most generous budget---had a fellow down here in NM and the first Quad-State he went to he bought 30 anvils and had to buy a bigger trailer to get them back home...

You want me to live, right? Ain't no way I could get away with that!

(Although, if you add up how much we've spent on my wife's china collection....)

[ThomasPowers]

nasty nasty forbiddens, we hates them my precious!

[ThomasPowers]

When I was looking for a wife I wanted one that had a passion about a craft, but not about blacksmithing.  As such she would understand why 9 postvises were 1 too few or why a 500# anvil was necessary even though I had a 400# one. *AND* she would not be wanting to use my stuff when I was wanting to use it.  So I ceded her the house for the most part and tripping over spinning wheels and *always* having a high fiber diet is a regular part of life;  She visits the smithy at least once a year though a decent middle school pitcher could hit it from the house and we've done all right as a "steel/wool" couple for 31 years now.  Shoot there is even a fiber conference near in time and location to Quad-State to make trips out there more likely!  (Wool Gathering, near Yellow Springs)

[JHCC]

I met my wife in 8th grade and started blacksmithing in 10th grade. This is the decorative fork I made for her for her Sweet Sixteen, just over 30 years ago.

 

Edited August 9, 2015 by JHCC

[Mikey98118]

JHCC,

I think you read your way well past Super Mongo"; that has more in common with a generation five Mikey burner. BTW, if you move the contact tip up within a 1/4" to 3/8" behind the forward edge of your air openings, you'll hit the sweet spot and see an immediate performance increase from that burner. The photo doesn't show whether or not the beveled the insid of you air openings on their dorward edges; that makes a big difference too.

Mikey

That should read "...you beveled..."