dognose Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Having a problem with the working end of my tools not seeming hard enough. When I push a file accross the end, it wants to bite more than skip, and when put into hot work use, they don't seem to hold their edge for too long. A few more details; I let the tool soak in my forge at an orange, non magnetic temp before plunging into a water quench and use a map gas torch on the non business end to run the colors before quenching again. I have been told that placing the tool in a 400 degree oven for 1 hour afterwards helps, but I didn't think it was necessary. Is this a question of letting the color band run up too far or not enough, or am I missing something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 I assume you are testing for hardes after quench to veraffy proper hardening? The data sheet sais to temper at 350-500 for R50-60. As you want to be on the High end heat treat on the cool end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Hale Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 I am not sure how I could let the steel slowly heat to a specific temp, 1200f in a forge and then raise to 1600f. Colors to me are not good enough as ambient light is such a big factor. http://www.suppliersonline.com/propertypages/S2.asp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Might try the iPhone app. If you can get it 1200 + a tad and hold it their, say of to the side wile your working on other projects (assuming solid fuel) or throughtle back you're gasser, then bring it up to 1600. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Hale Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Have you tried that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rthibeau Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 S series steels are hard to do properly in a home forge setup. For chisels and punches H-13 is a better choice......heat it, forge it, let it air cool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 This is a hot cut yes? Driving it into hot steel is going to screw with the heat treat anyway so why temper? I really prefer H series steels for hot tools but spring or an old axle work well. I leave tools like hardies and hot cuts as quenched, only running a temper on the struck end. Of course that's just me, I could be wrong. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted October 16, 2013 Share Posted October 16, 2013 Nope, like RB I use H13 for critical tools, or experiment with older tools I'm reworking till I get it right. I've head good stuff about it and just keep forgetting to down load it. If nothing else it would help "calabrate the eyeball" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dognose Posted October 16, 2013 Author Share Posted October 16, 2013 I realize there are better steels for my purpose, it's just that I was able to pick up dozens of used 5/8" x 18" Hilti jackhammer bits from Home Depot for $20. The best advice I've gotten so far is (I phoned a lifeline), after the first quench (before running the colors) clamp the working end in a vice (to keep it cool as possible) and heat from the struck end up and quench again. Afterwards, just try and keep the working end quenched when working hot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charles R. Stevens Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 The reason I use H13 is I learned to forge it in shoeing school. I have a pritchel that I'm going to compleatly reforde the next time I break the tip off. It's gotten aufly short in the last 10 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Miller Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 S2 is not a hot working steel that could be part of the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike-hr Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 How do you 'know' that hilti jackhammer bits are S-2?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Miller Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 A lot of jack hammer bits are 1045 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dognose Posted October 17, 2013 Author Share Posted October 17, 2013 How do you 'know' that hilti jackhammer bits are S-2?? I had a couple of very knowledgable blacksmiths spark test them. The 5/8" one's were S2, the 3/4" ones were 1045. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIGGUNDOCTOR Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 I would contact Hilti, and ask them. Spark testing is pretty iffy nowadays with all of the modern alloys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fe-Wood Posted October 17, 2013 Share Posted October 17, 2013 Have you tried to use it "as forged"? Like others have said, its not the best for hot work. Forging and letting air cool after re heating the whole tool for a bit may work as well as trying to do a controlled heat treat. Just a thought- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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