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I Forge Iron

? on borax


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20 mule team borax is not soap. There is a hand cleaner called Boraxo that has soap and borax in it, that is what everyone is referring to when they say don't use soap. 20 mule team is pure borax and is good flux material, it's all I ever use.

Woody

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Anti-Borax used to be a company that manufactured fluxes. Don't know the entire timeline but over the years most or all of the name brand fluxes have come to be owned by one company Superior Flux & MFG. Co.
For a beginner I would recommend EZ Weld, or perhaps their Stableweld (which I have never seen but sounds interesting).

I use EZ weld for some things, borax for others and some stuff called Black Magic (made by a blacksmith) for others.

Boraxo is a soap. 20 Mule team borax is not a soap but a water conditioner. It was used as a laundry aid, increasing the effectiveness of soap in hard water when soap was used to wash clothes. Its use for this purpose has largely become obsolete with the introduction of detergents (as opposed to soap) for laundry products (many of which contains some borax).

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Thanks everyone for your responses. This helps out alot. I never realized that 20 mule team brand could be used. I have a gas forge, will this hinder the moisture evaporation as Torin and Rick stated? I adjusted my forge( previous posting) and it gets to a good heat for welding now.

Skunkriv- thanks for the link to Superior. I couldn't remember the manuf. names at all. Thanks again everyone.

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EZ Weld contains iron shavings. This can help in tacking the weld. This is also why I don't use it on some welds because all those filings can be difficult to blend in and leaves unsightly boogers. You wouldn't want to use it at all for knives, borax is the thing for that. I still use EZ for most things.

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IronFist,

I think your gasser will be plenty hot enough to evaporate a little moisture from the flux, don't you? ;)

I have seen EZ - weld used, but in all I've seen and read one thing is clear: If the pieces aren't clean and at the right temperature, it don't matter what you use, you won't be able to weld 'em.

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I use a sacrifical chunck of high-alumina kiln shelving. I use this for my floor as well. Borax will eat away at it over time, but it will stand up a lot better than most refractory. After about 100 hours of forge time, I still haven't gotten to the point it needs to be replaced.

These are what I'm talking about:
Bailey Ceramic Supply - Kiln Supplies - Cone 11 Shelves & Posts

Or:
Spectrum High Alumina Cone 11 Kiln Shelves

They can be cut with a wet tile saw to fit in your forge. A single piece is usually enough to get 2 or 3 pieces.

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when using fluxes other than borax, get a material safety data sheet (MSDS) and read it. Some fluxes contain Fluorite which when heated gives off very toxic even deadly fumes. As for a flux that is concocted by a blacksmith I would want to know exactly what was in it before I used it. You can mess up a weld every day and live with it but you can only mess up your lungs once and you can't live with that.

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I use my gasser for making pattern welded billets for knives and other stuff and all I use is 20 mule team. Anything else that needs welding I do in my coal/coke forge, depends on the a lot of times I may not even use flux, but of course this takes a lot of practice and some skill. If you want some anhydrous borax you can you can give Kelly Cupples a shout he is a steel supplier for knife makers. You can reach him here [email protected] or can give him a call at 509-949-5231 and for those that are knife makers or need high carbon steels hey has some of the best prices and orders over $50 he ships free.

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I started using a mixture of 4 Pts. Borax and 1 Pt. Boric acid a while back and like it a lot better than straight borax. It's more aggressive and still not noxious.

You can find boric acid in most pharmacies or in the bug killin section of the super market under the name "RoachPruf."

If you want to forge weld SS you start getting into the toxic flux additives like Sal Amoniak(sp?) and other flouride compounds. It takes something pretty serious to remove chrome oxide from SS.

Frosty

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More options: Along with borx and E Z weld you can find Sure Weld and Cecils Swans flux at farrier supplies. I have used all and this is what has worked for me. Swans is about the easiest to learn to forge weld with. It just works great. It is also the most costly of the bunch. Get a container and use it until you get things going your way. Sure Weld or E Z weld seem alike to me and are next on the list. Borax is the last to use. It seems to me to have a narrower working ragnge of temerature. There is only a narrow heat range that it is best at. If you overheat a bit it will burn and crust and the only way I have saved a weld like that is to cool and grind surfaces and begin once more. Use every advantage you can to learn this,,later it will seems like it should have never given you a problem. If you weld something everyday and all is well use the borax and smile

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