Starting to feel like Jerry Seinfeld, gotta keep makin' Newman happy! Really good ideas John.

Gotta quit calling it an anvil, maybe multi-purpose customizable forging unit.

I like it, especially the idea of being able to configure the tooling in whatever order you would desire for the task at hand.

I would call it the "Multi-configurable Forging Apparatus" or MFA for short.

Edited November 27, 200916 yr by keykeeper

I want one! When does production begin! It makes sense that in these days of technical revolution that such a thing as an anvil could be improved and I am not surprised at all by who is doing the improving. Seems to me that it is basicaly at the point of making the basic body and offering a large selection of slide in attachments, which I asume would be made from some highly durable treated steel. Great job Grant!

Grant,

I took Brian's class at Yesteryear a couple of weeks ago so I have a small suggestion for your design. A couple of longer slide in plate so you can cover up the dove tails not in use. The blacksmith can put the hardy holder or fuller in the middle and not worry about the top getting dinged by a striker. After the class and seeing my accuracy, I was thinking about how to cover my anvil face so no one messed it up. Just a couple more pieces of kaboodle for the kit.

How were you thinking of attaching the upright plate to the base plate? Another slide in dovetail with welds to secure? Or would the welds hold? Sorry not a welder.


Brian

Edited November 27, 200916 yr by brian.pierson

This "open forum" design process sure helps avoid pitfalls that someone working alone might not uncover. This is SO cool. And Sketchup make it easy to get the idea across. And IForge makes it easy to use text and pictures and share.

I had thought about mild steel "dummies" to go in empty slots. They would serve to protect (as you mention) and also as cutting plates and for welding stuff to.

Base: Well I haven't settled on anything yet. Might machine a slot and use four or five really big NF bolts as I don't have a big duo-shield welder anymore.

Edited November 27, 200916 yr by nakedanvil

Very interesting design and the Kiss rule is always good. Are we submitting names for the..... MANVIL.:D

Cutting a tapered dovetail sounds like a pain. How would you do that?

Edited November 27, 200916 yr by Rob G

Not sure I understand the question. Just mill it out.

I realize the base adds a lot of mass but does it need to be that heavy? My understanding is part of the thinking of this anvil is to keep costs down . While I like a big heavy anvil you could be pushing the cost out of your market? Or maybe I have misread your market maybe this is a second anvil for bigger shops in which maybe you don't even need the horns. An option whichever base you decide on could be legs welded on to the base. Or that could be something the end user does.

I have thought of machining slots like this in a set of hammer dies. I know you have done that in you Kick-xxx hammer but I was thinking multiples rather than just the one. If you go ahead with this fabbed anvil, I think I will make my slots the same size as your anvil slots so I can buy your inserts off the shelf. Any chance i can talk you into making the anvil 3 1/2" thick ;)

So, in one post you want to reduce cost and in the next raise my cost?

Yeah, the horns look like an expensive proposition, don't they?

not a dovetail but a tapered dovetail.

Drop forge the horns then machine only as required to cut dovetail or surface, add a guillotine swage tool w/dovetail. It needn't cost a lot, basic anvil then add on pieces as you want them. This is starting to look vaguely like an old ship yard anvil/swage block combination.

So, in one post you want to reduce cost and in the next raise my cost?

Sure why not? :D

I agree on the buy the basic anvil then have all the bits including horn as options. I made a quick and dirty straight horn the other day, by forging flats on a piece of 1.5" round bar so it would fit in my platen table and then bending it over so it hung over the edge of the table. Having a blank mild steel dovetail I could have just welded my 1.5" bar to it and it would have been a better tool because of the lack of bounce. Maybe a bunch of cheap straight horns would be better than an expensive tapered one?

Rob: O,K. I see. I'm fortunate enough to have a CNC vertical machining center. I can cut angles just as easily as straight. A 1" diameter X 1" long cutter will plow out each one in less than a minute and then the dovetail cutter will finish them in about 2 minutes each.

John, wow I was thinking along similar lines. Those horns look real pricey.

As another horn option you could simply offer a hunk of round stock with the dovetail milled in and the buyer could turn/grind/modify as desired.

Someone else questioned the additional piece added on for the base and I'd like to second that. If you need the mass, widen the anvil some but to my eye your design calls out for a fabricated stand, something out of heavy angle perhaps, and that would reduce the need for the wider base. If you want to bolt or lag it down to wood or concrete weld on some "smaller" lugs with holes.

------

Sorry, looks like we were typing at the same time.

I still like the idea of straight horns but I just had a light bulb go off. The horns wouldn't be horrendously expensive as castings. You would just have to touch the dovetail up with the mill or if it were cored as cast might even work.

I really don't like castings. If I was to be buying one that would put me off. Yes I know they make some real fine cast steel stuff these days, Ruger comes to mind, but generally I don't think quality when I see cast anything that takes a beating. In Ruger's case you think that it is machined from solid stock not a casting. Would Grant have to machine these cast horns or just grind them smooth?:confused:

Appart from Peddinghaus all Modern anvils are cast. Yes the horn would need a little grinding or perhaps vibratory finishing? Tumbling? Yes drop forged might be nicer but it would need grinding or some other post finishing as well.

Well, let's see, I don't have a big drop hammer anymore and besides, dies would be about $6,000 - 8,000. Hafta sell a lotta horns to make that pay! Casting or fabricating are the only options.

Good point Judson, I'll have to think on that.

Shipping with mild steel inserts to populate all dovetails limit "abuse" concerns. If the dovetails are protected then accidental abuse won't occur at least. You are right, ultimately nothing is proof against abuse.

Do you need to have 4-5 dovetailed slots? Why not 3, that way horn, tail, center. The hardy can go into a horn, tail, or "hardy" die, and have an overhang at one end for punching, or an angled slot to kick the punch out the side or back. Ship with a mild steel "hardy" die, a mild steel "pritchel" die, and a tool steel "bottom set". If you want to keep all mild to ship then a mild weld your own die and have all tool steel dies as separates.

While at it you can bump up your weight by going to thicker and/or taller steel to hit your expected mass. Buying a different thickness of plate should not cost significantly different than thinner plate per pound.

If you are bolting the foot on with heavy duty bolts, then you can market an adjustable tripod for a bottom plate instead of the plain flat one. Or you could make it so some 2 inch pipe can thread into the bottom of the plate to make a tripod.

Cast steel doesn't bother me as it can be foundry finished as an investment process that is incredibly fine quality to rather tight tolerances before any machining is done. I understand that certain "sand" processes can produce rather good quality finishes as well.

Lastly, how long would it take to change out dies on something like this?

Phil

This could be a handy anvil for general metalsmithing not just blacksmithing. I was just over looking at my silversmithing and sheetmetal stakes. You know the old PEXTO and Niagara ones. Most artist/smiths now make small stuff and can't really afford the big stakes. I got an email alert from Rio Grand Jewelry Supply today that the Pendinghaus blowhorn stake was on sale for $475. That's a good deal if you have the money. Now in post #24, where your sketch is, you got a nice selection of dovetails there with various tools, expand that to hold some stakes for hollow forming and you could have a whole new tool setup for the artist/smith. Maybe one that doesn't break the bank to get the different stakes necessary to form metal.