Black_Flame Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Something i just made out of a sheet of 304 stainless steel Try and ignore those grey lines i drew on there with a pencil...it was something i was thinking about doing but somewhat changed my mind about. It would have been even more unique looking but useless. lol I should be finished this whole blade in (hopefully at most) a month from now...but no promises Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Einhorn Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 There is a saying "form follows function", which means that the construction of something is determined by what task it is designed to perform. Conversely one can deduce the intended function of an object by how it is constructed. That said, the tip of your sword prevents it from being used to stab with. The serrations indicate that you plan on sawing at very small trees and/or fire kindling. The interrupted curves of the sides of your sword indicate that you don't plan on using a chopping motion except perhaps with the short areas of the blade near its end. I could be wrong, often am. Perhaps the experts will chime in. Live long and prosper. Dave E. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Dave you pretty well nailed it and 304 means it will be soft and gooey! OTOH perhaps an abalone dive sword if it's thick enough??? Dive knives sometimes have a chisel end and made from non-hardening but stainless alloys. Also a serrated edge for cutting cable underwater. Looks hard to choke up on the blade though. Looking "cool" is always a personal thing but to a lot of people *functionality* is the difference between cool and stupid---I once bought a used pickup truck that the previous owner had added a roll bar, lights, whip antenna and oversize wheels to. It had a 4 cylinder engine and an automatic transmission! "All show and no go". I removed the roll bar and found it was just fastened in with hardware store low grade bolts and no plates!, I removed the antenna as there was no radio when I bought it and removed the over sized wheels because when you put more than 100 pounds in the bed the fenders would rub on the wheels--a pickup that you can't put stuff in isn't cool no matter how fancy it looks! When designing a weapon think about how it will be used and misused, what maneuvers will you be making with it, what weapons will be used opposing it and how. How easy is it to use? What advantages does it bring to the "fight"? What are it's weaknesses? And then compare it to other weapons that have similiar use cases. (the classic example is to compare the M16 and the AK47 for use in Viet Nam) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black_Flame Posted September 15, 2009 Author Share Posted September 15, 2009 Just had to point something out here I forgot to mention...I havent fully finished grinding down certain areas to the right form....and that serrated bit...its actually the top of the blade lol it wont really be sharp but then again i might make that adjustment to it later on. The drawing with te pencil i put on there im still debating about because it would create (in my opinion) a weak spot in the blade (and the blade is allready kinda weak lol) As for the tip that hasnt fully been grinded to its proper form yet (allthough your almost looking at what it really is) The purpose for that tip is for there to be a heavy weight at the edge of the blade and your right its mostly meant for chopping but you will still be able to stab with it...just not as effectively lol There will also be a slight curve from allong the blades edge to that point at the bottom...its purpose will mostly be to create a "pulling" slice towards you. The edge on the bottom there will be more broader than most of the sword so that it will endure longer because thats the part that would otherwise dullen the most. As for the use of this type of sword...I'm no expert but it does bring a nice feeling when your holding the blade ninjato style and swing in an upwards motion...but Ironically it's most likely gonna be used for chopping wood or as a meat cleaver because its stainless and can go in the dishwasher when im done with it lol It would probably be a divers 2nd best friend in fending off sharks or a close encounter with pirates though lol oh and the thickness is just about 5mm thick (maybe just under 1/4" in imperial) it may have been cold-rolled slightly before i purchased the steel though so its "slightly" harder than most junk I'm really gonna hate cutting my 3rd project out of that almost 1/2 inch Tempered T1 steel though. I still cant figure out what type of T1 it is though (theres a few alloys called T1...one I think contains Titanium and some just used for tool Steel) they warned me not to hit anything too hard with it or it might shatter (sucky) lol its a xxxxxxxx huge rusty piece of scrap though but they sold it to me as scrap so i got a good deal on it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Hale Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 A couuple of notes about stainless steel. There are many types around and some are good for edged tools and some not so good. The major difference in the two divisions is the addition of carbon. With out carbon stainless is more resistant to rust and it will not be able to be heat treated which is vital for cutting. With carbon in enough quantity a stainless blade can be heat treated and will hold an edge either rather poorly to really well. The difference being which stainless alloy, how much carbon and wot other additions are in the mix. On top of that is the methods used for the heat treat. They are described fully by the maker of the alloy. Here is a field test: try a magnet on it and if it sticks it has some carbon. If not it does not. That does not tell you how much carbon or anything about the intended use of the steel alloy. More coming: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Hale Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 Let me give you an example: You can make a gun stock for a rifle or shotgun from a lot of different kinds of wood. Two that come to mind are pine and walnut. both of them vary al ot in the cost to obtain them. Pine without knots is not really cheap but more so than a fine piece of figured walnut. The work to make the gunstock is not really different for each of them unless you want to do some carving or checkering. Pine would not do well as it is so soft. Here is the problem when you complete the stocks from each material they may be the same shape, wit4h the same fit to meteal, correct in every diminsion etc. The pine one has ruined the value of the gun as pine is not a correct material for this useage. ( we are not talking the pine that may be tight grained, with absolutely gorgeous color and figure and has for sure never been seen by me. Nope just pine) Now if your work is up to snuff the walnut one will be worth the effort you have p0ut into it. Blades are the same. The earlier suggestion for you to explore the books and learn basics needs to be addressed. You are making a wall hangar. You can buy those quite cheap a lot of places. You suppose it is worth the effort to spend I do not know how many hours on a piece you can replace for what may well be less money than it took to feed you while you worked on this? Don't take this as an attack on you. You will get it. Not soon and not easy. But spend your time wisely and prepare for blades down the road. Time better spent. Have fun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 To further that analogy: because of cost you go with pine as it's cheaper, you then expend 100 times the cost of the material in labour and at the end of it you still have a low quality item. Trying it with good materials means that if it all works out right you actually have something to be proud of! Can you tell what the piece of scrap was to begin with? ISTR T1 as being an abrasion resistant alloy used for dirt moving equipment and not a good sword alloy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver Posted September 15, 2009 Share Posted September 15, 2009 (edited) Unfortunately, there are two completely different steels designated T-1. One is a medium strength low-alloy and the other is a high-speed tool steel. The first (actually ASTM A514 -T1) is just junk for most things other than for wear resistance, it will only get around 35 Rc water quenched. and the other is a tungsten bearing steel with very little impact strength. Neither has titanium ( the magic metal!). 304 is a poor steel for a knife. Well, maybe a butter knife. Edited September 15, 2009 by nakedanvil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 I don't know about others here but I've been sketching and writing up my ideas since I was maybe 8 and have all of them I've made since I was maybe 25. This reminds me of the house drawings I made before I had a clue about architecture, building practices, materials, etc. In almost all cases and "cool" house I tried to draw was ill balanced, ill proportioned, spazzed out with mis-matched styles and so on. they looked a lot like this blade like object. It makes me appreciate my parent's patience, I spewed ideas and defended them just as ardently and with just as little understanding as this. Frankly I don't know how to tell someone what they're talking about is drivvle and make it stick. It didn't with me, I had to beat my head on failures and Dad's "told you sos" for a long time before I figured it out. So, you just keep ripping the ideas out there Blackflame. This one unworkable in any sense of the word having no basis in form, function, utility, materials or style. Don't let that stop you though because once you actually have a basis in understanding you WILL be able to make things that are functional and look good. Frosty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black_Flame Posted September 16, 2009 Author Share Posted September 16, 2009 you have to understand that I am just practicing with working on different materials first. Its all fun either way, its not supposed to do anything other than be shiney and look somewhat like a sword...I'm not so naieve to think that any kind of steel will make a great sword/cutting tool. Sometimes what I'm after is just the art of making the design/prototype or the fun in it...not actually making the final product. I think few people are actually acknowledging this. It's a desighn idea not xxxxxxx Rocket Science on the entire metallurgical properties of every single piece of steel that I buy. Seriously, as soon as I post something for an entirely different purpose it gets critisized. What ever happened to just screwin around with your tools having fun making random junk? It's kinda beyond retarded since almost no one can even understand, respect or even relate to "that behaviour". lol Yeah it's xxxx but you know what, I'ts more fun than reading people posting different facts about different steels that I allready know the use for. (about as fun as reading your debt records) I mean come on, when your explaining something to your best friends/co-workers or even your wives/girlfriends do you really sound like a bunch of "tools" (no offence) stating the entire facts about every single property of steel and brag about it int heir face because they dont know anything about the matter? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy seale Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 i agree with what the more knowledgeable said but please stop LOL, it shows a diss for all that have tried to help by their imput...you are embarking on a journey that will last a life time of learning...i/we don't try to dishearten...but constant talk of inferior metal usage=nil. good luck on your endevers,jimmy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black_Flame Posted September 16, 2009 Author Share Posted September 16, 2009 (edited) Anyways in the future maybe just add suggestions to improve it rather than dissing the metal I just hope I can somehow change your aspect of this around to a slightly more positive outlook. :/ You still havent seen nothin yet but seriously don't comment if you really think this idea is rediculous because I dont give a rats xxx on your opinion! its my tools and my steel and I can do whatever the heck I want with them. If you notice I'm making quite a few amateur mistakes, I dont mind a simple gesture or point in the right direction but remember that I've got plenty of stuff left to grind and plenty of you guys around to give some advice on how to shape the blade so there is no point in scrapping this....just PLEASE FOR THE SAKE OF GOODNESS NO MORE CRITISIZING COMMENTS ABOUT STEEL TYPES!!! lol ...unless your going to supply me with the right type of steel then I might encourage it. lol Edited September 16, 2009 by mod06 MOD change due to language content Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Hale Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 Well let me just say this: you said it would end up chopping wood or used as a meat cleaver. That changed my whole thought on what you meant it to be. But given the latest post from you I will follow your rules and you will not see another post from me about the type of steel you use or any thing else for that matter. Have fun in you quest for knowledge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mod06 Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 (edited) hello Black Flame .. you may have noticed you last post was changed slightly This is a family forum , please keep out the language , need to be so you grandmother or your little sister can walk in and read without being offended If you wish to talk to me farther about this you can PM me Mod06 Edited September 16, 2009 by mod06 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy seale Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 adios blackflame be well and prosper....but your attitude and direction is what;s on trial....no respect or admoration for some of the best makers around????you on your own, jimmy seale Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jack hollingsworth Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 that'll look shmicko when its polished mate. I made a Machete out of a random stainless (316 i think, not a blade steel i know also) and you can get a mirror finish quite easily since its not hardened. make sure you post pics when you get more done, i want to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted September 16, 2009 Share Posted September 16, 2009 but seriously don't comment if you really think this idea is rediculous because I dont give a rats xxx on your opinion! its my tools and my steel and I can do whatever the heck I want with them. As you wish, the thread is closed. Best of luck to you with your project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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