Brasilikilt Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 (edited) Hey all I don't know for sure if this one has been sold or not, but I'm rather interested in it, and was wondering what your opinions are. As many of you know, I have been seeking out an anvil, which this one meets most of what I have been after in terms of weight, pattern, price. I have been hoping to spend around $2/lb for an anvil. This one with shipping would amount to somewhere in the neighborhood of $2.35/lb It's an old Mouse-Hole anvil, (maybe 1850's?) which is good for me since I plan to use it for historical reenacting, but I'm wondering about the general condition. For a first anvil, I think I could probably do a lot worse. I like that it's thick in the waist and that there's plenty of metal in the hardy area. What say all of you? Edited July 5, 2009 by Brasilikilt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arftist Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 It's pretty swayed. What are you planning to use it for? Seems like it should be cheaper considering how much use it has seen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bentiron1946 Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 I wouldn't be in a hurry to buy it. There have got to be better then that one for near the same price. I agree with Arftist on the condition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brasilikilt Posted July 5, 2009 Author Share Posted July 5, 2009 Hmmmmm...... Didn't some of you explain that sway in the face is *good* as it is the "sweet spot" and can be useful for straightening and such? Also wouldn't it be an indication that this is a quality anvil that was used by a blacksmith for years and years before me? This is potentially my first anvil, and I plan on using this one for general blacksmith work, carrying around to events to do demos (and to perhaps make a little gas/food money), but also substantial enough to handle slightly heavier work that I would do at home. This one looks about the same condition as the little 110#-120# Peter Wright I saw locally the other day going for $300, I also think that one might have been in a fire. That one was smaller with some pretty bashed-up edges and a face that had almost as much sway. The guy told me that he paid $270 for it a few years ago. I haven't seen much of anything else for sale except for a 150 lb Hay Budden 200+ miles away for $400, which has probably sold. A lot of the blacksmiths and "tool people" that I've talked to explain that anything around here in decent shape, from a good maker often gets sold for $4/lb and over....and I have been looking/asking around for months. Pickings here in Oregon/Washington are quite slim. People WITH anvils often don't want to sell them, and they act as though they're doing me a favor by charging me an arm and a leg. I'm also getting a little weary of looking and want to get something halfway decent, that's an older style and in my basic price-range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Einhorn Posted July 5, 2009 Share Posted July 5, 2009 (edited) It looks ok to me for your first anvil. I have two Mousehole anvils, my demo anvil of slightly less than 100 pounds is pictured below. The white is lithium grease and not gouges. My main shop anvil is fairly large but swaybacked, and I got used to it. The wrench has a post welded to it so as to be able to bend and twist close up to the audience, with the post mounted in the hardy hole. If you were in the area I could point you to a couple anvils about 120 to 140 pounds in a bit better condition than the one you pictured for less than $200, but this is Pennsylvania iron country. :D Edited July 5, 2009 by UnicornForge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greebe Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 If you were in the area I could point you to a couple anvils about 120 to 140 pounds in a bit better condition than the one you pictured for less than $200, but this is Pennsylvania iron country. I too am looking for a decent anvil. I just moved out of Nome, Alaska and let my anvil go for a song. It was too expensive to fly it out. I will be in northern West Virginia, around Morgantown in a few days. If you could direct me to some of these anvils I would be much obliged. Thanks Greebe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arftist Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 Hmmmmm...... Didn't some of you explain that sway in the face is *good* as it is the "sweet spot" and can be useful for straightening Some sway. Like an 1/8''. I am not saying not to buy it. Anvils are rare and expensive here too. You know what the market is there, far better than I do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Einhorn Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 I too am looking for a decent anvil. .... I will be in northern West Virginia, around Morgantown in a few days. If you could direct me to some of these anvils I would be much obliged.Thanks Greebe Check you PM (private messages) for the information. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keithgartner Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 I believe the Mousehole anvil pic you posted was made prior to, 1820 as, that's when they started adding pritchel holes. Also I wouldn't be as worried about the "sweet spot", as I would be that the edges are so radiused, and you'll need somthing square, to make weld scarfs, necking down, etc. I have a PW with chipped edges that I going to weld up and grind square. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trying-it Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 When you get to be as old and well used as that anvil, how well do you think you will still look? If we start seeing old, worn, and abused items as being worthless, God forbid our wives start reading these forums or we too might be deemed worthless! I would NOT take $200 for this old Mousehole (also lacking a pritchel hole) and although not my main anvil, still find it quite handy to have around. Each and every thought to be defective area can have its own unique qualities and purpose with a little use of imagination! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Sells Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 I think the technical term is Texture tool ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trying-it Posted July 6, 2009 Share Posted July 6, 2009 I was thinking more of economical savings and shop space-saving advantages: anvil, dappling block, and a swage block all in one tidy little package! Just needing a good home, tender loving care, and an owner that really cares about saving a small bit of living history! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Thompson Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 Hey all I don't know for sure if this one has been sold or not, but I'm rather interested in it, and was wondering what your opinions are. What say all of you? It's scrap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Einhorn Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 I think that some of the posts have been a bit harsh. If that anvil is the best he can find in his area for what he can afford I would say to go for it. He can make a hardy tool for when he wants a sharp edge by welding a stub to a block of steel. It is an older anvil that would fit into his demonstrations for the 19th century. And I have seen a lot of anvils in much worse condition. He can continue to use this anvil for a portable demonstration anvil after he later upgrades his shop anvil when he can afford a larger and more pristine anvil. The surface looks usable, especially if one is used to working around the worn spots on an anvil. Personally if given the choice between using that anvil, along with a few home made hardy tools, and the choice of using a length of railroad track, I would choose to use the worn anvil. Not everyone can afford or has access to pristine anvils. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Thompson Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 In the 19th century, 19th century anvils were new and didn't look like a large jelly bean after a hot day! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brasilikilt Posted July 9, 2009 Author Share Posted July 9, 2009 Hey all The feedback I have gotten from you all is rather mixed. Finding a good old anvil here in Oregon has been frustrating. (This anvil is in Pennsylvania.) There's 2 guys at work who have anvils, but don't want to sell them. At my other job I have to look at a sweet little 125 pounder that sits there unused, collecting dust, but my boss doesn't want to sell that one either. I've been offered a couple others that were much smaller, way overpriced, and in just about as bad a shape as this mouse hole. I guess I like the fact that this anvil is so old, and has the features I've been looking for and is a price (with shipping) that falls within my budget. Would it really be too much trouble and costly to build the face back up with hardening rods? I have a friend who might still have some rods left over from his anvil project. In the fall I can also bring it into my blacksmith class where my instructor (who has tons of welding experience) might actually enjoy being involved in the process. I think it would be really cool to make this anvil last another 150 years. Anyways, it's bedtime take care Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Thompson Posted July 9, 2009 Share Posted July 9, 2009 I'm sorry to seem harsh but it's only a lump of metal; there is absolutely no point in using a tool just because it's old. With very few exceptions new tools are vastly superior and easier to use. An old WI anvil can be pleasant to work on but only if it is in good condition. There is plenty of info here on how difficult it is to repair anvils. A swayed face like that might have limited use for straightening bar or texturing, unfortunately there are better ways of doing that and a flat face and your own choice of edge radii are of far more use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 9, 2009 Share Posted July 9, 2009 B'kilt: First stop right there and think!---most of the world forges on things that do not look anything like a London pattern anvil---why do you have to have one? Next start looking for anvils that are not anvils. I've done good work on a broken train car knuckle---it had a flat place and a curved place, didn't dent and was FREE! Neotribal knifemakers have popularized using a chunk of large square stock set in a bucket of concrete as their anvils---I've seen a $900 knife that was made on one of those!. If you are near a coast line I *KNOW* that there are some hefty pieces of steel around there somewhere! Honest Bob demo's at SOFA meetings using a section of metal shaft about 1 foot in diameter by 6" wide---his stump is carved to hold it on the flat or on the curve so he can draw faster with it. Even A36 will work with hot steel and have the advantage that you can simply grind off your learning mistakes leaving a clean surface. (some folks are now selling these "bladesmith's anvils" of heat treated alloy steels now!) If you are into the "romance" of the anvil; well the london pattern as we know it didn't show up till about the last 100 years of the prime smithing period. Japanese swords were made on an anvil that looks like a retangular chunk of steel---much like sawyers anvils look like. (any logging done in the past out that way?) Shoot I know a fellow who started forging using a granite cobblestone as an anvil So start thinking out of the london pattern box---it's the *practice* and *skills* that makes one a smith not the tools! (I once did a pattern welding demo using a claw hammer and a piece of rr rail the forge being a sheetmetal firepot welded up to hold charcoal from old bonfires; didn't have any problems welding up a damascus billet!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted July 9, 2009 Share Posted July 9, 2009 Wow, I suddenly feel better about the poor anvil I picked up at a flea market. Heel is broken off at the pritchel and hardy and the edges are chipped rather badly. Weighs 68 lbs on the bathroom scale. Any thoughts on using a log for a pritchel... other than the obvious -it's going to burn some? I have a number of maple logs not yet split for firewood, a drill, and a set of spade bits. I could even chainsaw a section out of the side to let the tool drop through. Is a relatively small (4 inch x 4 inch) piece of #11 sheet steel adequate to protect a log pritchel? I have heard of people using a log for some hardy tools with a piece of sheet metal or even nothing to protect the wood, but never mention of a wood pritchel. The granite block did cross my mind, I like the cobble stone idea. I used the concrete step of the garage growing up to straighten all sorts of hot and cold pieces of metal for my dad growing up. Sometimes I think it was so he could work and hear that I was not getting into trouble, but that step took it. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 9, 2009 Share Posted July 9, 2009 (edited) Punching on a wood pritchel won't work real well as the wood will tend to burn out and be a 'soft" surface where the punching wants it to be hard and resist . OTOH just get a chunk of thick steel and drill a "pritchel" hole in it and place that on your log (or anvil) My "loaner anvil" has the heel broken off at the hardy; nice face, decent horn---a great anvil and at US$40 for 100+ pounds a great deal in my opinion. I loan it to students to use until they can find one for themselves at a *good* price. Seems like as soon as you have an anvil they start showing up around you. My current student was just give a 130# Peter Wright in nice condition by his grandmother. His uncle got the larger one... Edited July 9, 2009 by ThomasPowers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MLMartin Posted July 9, 2009 Share Posted July 9, 2009 looks like a good anvil but dont buy it, looks pretty obvious that its a collector selling is, i think a fellow on this site acualy, all the collectors i see buy at super cheep and just jack the price up ridiculously high, wait till you find some one with one out in the barn or geradge, they will sell for a much more reasonable price, just showing pictures on this site ive had collectors send me e mails and bug me about trying to buy them from me when i still say not for sale, they just buy um up and sell um to folks desperate for an anvil. just as bad as most used car salesmen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted July 10, 2009 Share Posted July 10, 2009 I like the steel block idea, but all the scrap yards are closed to the public in this area. I guess there were some lawsuits in Ohio about people getting injured picking through metal piles. I don't know what the auto-farm bone yards have available but my recent parts scrounging expeditions have had me go pay dealer prices because they were cheaper...darn plastic body parts. Maybe I will have an excuse to learn and practice forge welding if worn out steel can be had for a good price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted July 10, 2009 Share Posted July 10, 2009 Ohio? Hers a fairly recent tale of making an excellent anvil for about $25 and some sweat equity that happended in Columbus OH:Marco/Krieger Armory - Rapiers and Accessories and yes I am the Thomas mentioned---I drug out the other fork and it moved to NM with me. Glad I didn't know how much it weighed when I did it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted July 11, 2009 Share Posted July 11, 2009 Makes me wonder where the rest of the fork truck is...but I don't think my little cavalier can handle that. Email me directly if you want to give me a treasure map. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brasilikilt Posted July 12, 2009 Author Share Posted July 12, 2009 Thanks for all the input, some very good points have been made which have helped me put things into perspective. While I am still basically in the beginning stages of blacksmithing, I had made up my mind a long time ago that I wanted a *real* anvil. I already have a railroad track anvil, a 4"x4" chunk of mild steel, a 3" chunk of round stock/sledge hammer head set upright in a stump. All of these things worked, and I will keep them for possible modification into specialty tools as the need arises, but I have money left over from an educational award which I am using to pay for this anvil and other tools, so why not buy an actual anvil? I don't like this anvil because it's old. I've seen anvils from the 1500's and 1600's that I didn't like that much. I like this anvil because it's thick in the waist and isn't too thin out into the hardy hole area (heel??) It has a nice mass of metal under the striking area which I have heard helps to put a bit more resistance against your hammer blows AND it fits into my anvil budget. The fact that it's almost 200 years old merely appeals to my historical interests, and if all of my tools are antique, used, rescued from the trash and refurbished or made by me. I can't afford to buy a reproduction of an anvil from the 1700's, I don't have the equipment or gang or strikers you would need to make one. After seeing how a guy on this forum did it, I've actually given serious consideration to the thought of using 4" mild steel plate, using a cutting torch to burn it into shape, and then using a wire welder to secure a length of fork from a lift-truck to the top as a striking face. A lot of work, eh? If I had the means to do it, I would. That's why the thought of using hard-facing rod to lessen the sway in the face of this anvil doesn't seem that bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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