meco3hp Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 4 gal. part fireclay 4 gal. grog 4 gal. silica sand 3 quarts of borax powder Fireclay can be gotten at most fireplace stores, and lumber yards. Grog is crushed fire bricks. This is a key ingrediant, to eleminate shrinking, and cracking. Mix thoroughly while dry. Water should be sprinkled over the dry mixed ingredients while stirring, until mixed completely to a consistency that can be made into a ball in your fist that can be broken cleanly in two. When it is to that point, you should cover with plastic over night. It will keep indefinatly in a sealed bucket. z Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archie Zietman Posted January 2, 2006 Share Posted January 2, 2006 are there substitutes to firclay which work as well? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meco3hp Posted January 2, 2006 Author Share Posted January 2, 2006 Hello, Not that I know of. You might be able to find some natural clay to use, in your area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archie Zietman Posted January 2, 2006 Share Posted January 2, 2006 thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meco3hp Posted January 5, 2006 Author Share Posted January 5, 2006 I have made it and used it with out the borax powder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Ink Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 Can I make the grog myself If I cant find It?Or is there a sub I can find @ home depot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Czar Posted December 22, 2007 Share Posted December 22, 2007 are there substitutes to firclay which work as well? cat litter (bentonite clay) but it needs to be groundCan I make the grog myself If I cant find It?Or is there a sub I can find @ home depot.grog is a clayceramic that has already been fired, if you have a local potter, his brokenexploded pots would be ideal, again needs to be broken up to a suitable granular dimension other insulative additivesVermiculite Sawdust (the coarser the better, chainsaw particles are ideal) turns to little charcoalized insulative pockets additional insulative barriers will make the forgekilnfurnace more effcient, a box in a box or barrel in a barrel with rock wool, Vermiculite or other air trapping fireproof material with a low thermal mass the more thermal mass the forgekilnfurnace has the more energy it will take to get it up to a given temperature, but the better it will hold that temperature (principle behind a masonry heater) but unless you plan on leaving it on for days at a time, its better to have a low thermal mass with a high insulative value Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welder19 Posted December 22, 2007 Share Posted December 22, 2007 Better than generic "fire clay" is epk kaolin clay, all those supplies are best bought at a ceramics/pottery supply such as;http://http://www.baileypottery.com/clay/clays-chemicals.htmhttp://http://www.axner.com/axner/materials/ball-clays.php You can easily make a refractory to withstand 3000 F welder19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjohnbarleycorn Posted January 4, 2008 Share Posted January 4, 2008 where do you get the borax powder? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Czar Posted January 4, 2008 Share Posted January 4, 2008 generally the supermarket 20 mule team borax, with the detergents and the bleaches very popular laundry additive and household cleanser, if one supermaket chain doesnt have it try another Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjohnbarleycorn Posted January 5, 2008 Share Posted January 5, 2008 thanks for keeping up with all my questions. I do appreciate it. kevin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J W Bennett Posted January 16, 2008 Share Posted January 16, 2008 Richard, Good to hear from you, John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Kelley Posted January 20, 2008 Share Posted January 20, 2008 What's the purpose of the borax powder? Doesn't it tend to melt under high heat? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Czar Posted January 21, 2008 Share Posted January 21, 2008 What's the purpose of the borax powder? Doesn't it tend to melt under high heat? good question, lets look into the crystal ball....patent 4233078 (pdf) Sodium borate, preferably a hydrated sodium borate and most preferably borax (the decahydrate), is added to a graphitic refractory composition suitable for forming a refractory monolith, for example a plastic or a ramming mix, in order to reduce the loss of plasticity of the mix during storage, to inhibit fungi formation in the mix during storage, and to improve the intermediate temperature strength of the compositionDehydration Behaviour of Borax Pentahydrate to Anhydrous Borax by Multi-Stage Heating in a Fluidized Bed Calcinator (PDF)Anhydrous Borax (BA) is an industrial product produced from borax decahydrate and borax pentahydrate. It is used as a flux material in metallury, and in the production of high quality glasses, ceramic materials and enamels. it goes on to say that the amorphous form we know as a metallugical flux, is actually just one of several states, there are also 3 different crystalline forms with melting points of 1015K (1367F), 993K (1327F) 936K (1225F) anhydrous of course means without water, so its likely we arent employing BA specificallyThe low melting point of BA causes very dangerous corrosion problems which can only be prevented by forming a layer of solid calcined borax on the refractory material of the furnace. best guess its added for multiple reasons but one of the most likely is to form calcinated borax on the refractory still researching ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philip in china Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 Re the use of sawdust am I getting this right? The idea is that the sawdust actually burns and thereby leaves small empty pockets or pockets containing charcoal which due to it's lack of mass increases the thermal insulation properties of the monolith. Please let me know if I am wrong! I am looking for a good insulator for round my cupola. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Czar Posted January 27, 2008 Share Posted January 27, 2008 thats my understanding, reduces the mass of the refractoryCeramics, Clay and Insulating BrickA Low Cost Kiln Brick for Production of an Appropriate Purifier Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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