Power Tools

[John Martin]

Okay, well I'm sure some of you lucky smiths on here have all the power tools & tools that anyone would ever want or need. I'm wondering what you should have, and what WOULD be nice to have. From what I've been doing so far, I really need a drill press & bandsaw. I'm getting a drillpress in about a week. BTW, for those of you who were wondering, my shop is done, everything is really sweet (for me at least. lol). I'll get pictures as soon as I can, camera isn't working.

John & his friend quentin.

Edited August 18, 2008 by m_brothers

[psilogen]

I've worked in a modern shop a little bit, and I can say that I would love to have a disc and belt sander, and an oxy-acetylene setup. Whenever I find myself a semi-permanent place to live and some shop space, those are probably first on the list, along with a drill press. Punching holes isn't glamorous enough to justify the hassle, in my mind. Drawing, tapering, welding, bending, on the other hand...

As far as bandsaws are concerned, I'm told that you're not likely to find one that does both horizontal and vertical operations equally well for any useful value of "well", but there may be models out there that work satisfactorily in both configurations. I have not done any independent research, due to the time period of my usual work and my available funds and space.

Also, I think it is really hard to go wrong with a MIG as long as you learn to use it well. It makes short work of many long tasks.

[Dan W]

I consider a drill press and a bench belt sander essential for my shop. Fortunatly I can get away with using the bench sizes and dont need the big floor models.

[Dave M]

I like tools that are multi taskers and for power tools there are a couple of great ones. I have bench mounted drill press with HF. X,Y table I use it for drilling, sanding and lite milling & polishing. Next would be the hand held 4.5" right angle grinder used for grinding, sanding, cutting, wire brushing and polishing. 8" bench grinder for grinding,polishing, sharpening and wire brushing. Disc and belt sander for sanding and sharpening. Miller mig welder. Miller stick welder used for welding, Hardfacing, gouging and if need be carbon arc cutting. Now a couple of power tools I don't use all of the time but when I do they pay for them selves. Plasma cutter, 80 gal. compressor and 14" chop saw.

[Sabre]

i use my grinder allmost everyday its a 6 " bech grinder.... i would recomend u get 1ive also got a drill press bansaw 14" chop saw compressor 2 mig welders an arc welder... i never use a prill press and find that the forged work is just tbo solid to drill!

[Mills]

The best money I have spent on tools is a milwaukee portaband and a dewalt 4 1/2' Angle grinder. the portaband CAN be chucked into a vise and used as a vertical saw but is best and safest when the stock is held and the saw moved around. The grinder is very multipurpose and having a good strong one for the most common operation, usually grinding, and filling in with HF cheapo's for cut off, wire wheel, flap wheel, fiberdisk and more.
A drill press would be next inline with a MIG right behind it.

[keykeeper]

Currently I have a small benchtop drill press, 4 x 6 bandsaw, flux core Mig welder, 4-4-1/2 inch angle grinders (keep different wheels on all of them), bench grinder, and a small air compressor. The drill press is indispensible in a shop, IMHO. The bandsaw is very handy with vertical use, instead of killing your arm and shoulder with a hacksaw. Those cheap angle grinders are good, more or less disposable, but for me and my hobby use, not a bad investment.

Things I'd like to have: Power hammer (either manufactured or a "rusty" type), a good arc welder to handle everything mig won't, larger compressor so I can make the most of my air tools, and a decent, older metal lathe. And, Oh yeah, a bigger shop wired for all the above.

[Trollhammer]

The things I use daily and would be lost without:
A multitude of angle grinders...you can never have enough, especially when they're only
$20 apiece at HF
Drill Press
Old Lincoln Buzzbox
O/A Torch
Combo Benchtop Belt/Disc Sander
Benchtop Grinder/Wire Wheel
Heavy Duty Sabre Saw
Dremel with a bunch of accessories
Chop Saw
275gal Air Compressor

I never needed most of that stuff until I got it. Now, if any of them go down, my day is stopped dead. I've become too reliant on power tools.
Mickey

[Frosty]

Lights, gotta have good light. I have a couple single 150 (I think) watt halogen work lights and a double on a stand.

cutoff saw. I have a Jet 7x12 horizontal vertical and use it as much or more than anything.

Grinders: Bench either wheel or belt preferably both. Hand, 9" for heavy stock removal and 4 1/2" for fine work, the more the merrier.

Drill press for precision holes, hot punching is faster but not nearly so precise.

Elec welder, preferably a multi-process unit with a lot more capacity than you need. (it's better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it.)

Torch set, I use an All State's oxy/propane rig.

Lathes, mills, shaper, power hammer(s), press rolls, forging press, more power hand tools than Norm Abrams has, the more the merrier. Can there ever be to many power tools?

Hydro-electric power plant on a good year round fishing stream.

Frosty

[Dave M]

Hey Keykeeper you made me feel better about my 3- 4.5" angle grinders. I do the same thing 1 has cut off wheel 1 has flap disc and the last 1 has a grinding wheel on it. It saves so much time just grabbing the grinder all set up and not always switching stuff back and forth. I will take it 1 step more, I do the same with my O/A torches. I have 3 loaded with different size cutting tips that are balanced for the torches they are on. I have 2 set up for brazing and 1 set up for rose buds and 1 loooong torch for doing steel demo work. No I am not made of money I bought all but 1 of these on E-bay when it was new and you could buy a box with 2 or 3 torches or bodies that you could then make 1 or 2 good ones out of for about $20. Those days are gone, just about every body selling stuff on e-bay now thinks it is 1 of a kind and pricless:(.

[Mike BR]

You've got to be careful with those 4-1/2" grinders. One is plenty, but four isn't nearly enough . I recently bought a pair of Ryobis from Home Depot for $40 (last I checked they still had them). I haven't really put them to the test yet, but they seem to run smoother than the Chicago Electric (HF) ones.

[ptree]

6 each 4.5" grinders, a 7" wth a 4" wirecup wheel, 6" bench grinder with flap wheels, a 8" bench grinder, a 12" disc sander, a 2.5" by 60 belt sander, 2 each 4 x 6 horz/vert band saws, portaband, 12" drill press, 15" floor drill press, 21" buffalo drill press, 14.5"x56" lathe, Miller thunderbolt stick, lincoln mig with gas, Lincoln SA-200 gas engine welder,OA torch set, OA carry tourch, 36" bending brake.
For wood, 10" table and 10" radial saws, 12.5" planer, 4" jointer
and a rash of hand drills skill saws etc.

[ptree]

Oh and I forgot, a junk yard hammer.

[Ten Hammers]

Yeah, I've got tools. Some of the best money spent was ( at the time ) 20 bucks for a good Nicholson ( and I have a Stanley too ) hacksaw. I formerly used Sandvik blades but they are no longer available ( here anyway ). They cut like well, a good blade. I'm using some off brand blades from the farm store ( Nicholson when I have to ). Yes I have a chop saw. Yes I have a plasma. Either coming out of the forge or perhaps just trimming while I'm on the forge side of the shop, the vise and hacksaw are faster than going around to the chopsaw. A hot cut is fast yes. A GOOD hacksaw is fast. Cutting 15-50 pieces of bar or round etc or if I happen to be on table side I will of course use the chopsaw. I have a 12-15 year old Bosch side grinder and a 5 year old Milwaukee ( 4 1/2 ) and a Craftsman 7". I haven't owned a rock grinder in years. I have a shop built 2 x 48 belt that gets used daily. Yes I have air tools. Starting out, a good grinder would be on the list from Santy Claus. I weld with acetelyne and Miller Mig. As mentioned, good lighting is a must.

Edited August 19, 2008 by Ten Hammers

[maddog]

Torch set, I use an All State's oxy/propane rig.

Frosty,

Have you figured out how to weld with that torch?

[Frosty]

Yeah, I have gotten welds but it's so much hassle and the welds are so poor, mostly heat effect zone the size of a 67 Caddy hood, that it isn't worth the effort.

I've heard a lot of theories about why it is but my observation is the velocity of the gasses coming from the torch tip are so high it blows the molten metal out of the puddle.

To allow for it I had to get it good and hot then move the torch tip well away from the puddle. This of course made the heated zone enormous.

I have various electric welders and a couple forges so I don't torch weld. Heck, I have 3 oxy acet rigs that haven't been hooked up since I got them at auction. For everything and anything ELSE I use the AllState's rig. It's pretty unbeatable.

Frosty

[Glenn]

my observation is the velocity of the gasses coming from the torch tip are so high it blows the molten metal out of the puddle.

There are many different size tips for the ox/ac torch, and one size does NOT fit all sizes of work.

One company listed their tips by size and working thickness.
000 Light Up to 1/32"
00 Light 1/16" - 3/64"
0 Light 1/32" - 5/64"
1 Light 3/64" - 3/32"
2 Light 1/16" - 1/8"
3 Light 1/8" - 3/16"
4 Light 3/16" - 1/4"
5 Light 1/4" - 1/2"
6 Light 1/2" - 3/4"

Another company lists their tips by gauge sizes
20, 18, 14, 12, 10, 8, 6, 3, 0.
10 gauge being 1/8 inch and 0 gauge being 5/16 inch plate.

I have welded 55 gallon drum thickness material with ox/ac using the cutting torch tip, but would not recommend it. Take the time to get the proper welding tip for the job at hand. It makes life so much easier, not to mention the quality and appearance of your welds. (grin)

The cutting torch tips come in a variety of different sizes, depending on the thickness of the material you are going to cut. I was only able to find information on a cutting tip that would handle 4 inch thick steel, but have heard of tips that can cut much more.

I knew that I had seen this material before, just could not remember where. Then it dawned on me, go to IForgeIron.com and do a search. Sure enough, it is right there on the IForgeIron site > Blueprints > BP0018 Victor Cutting Tips Guide

[maddog]

For everything and anything ELSE I use the AllState's rig. It's pretty unbeatable.

Frosty

It is! I bought one five or six yrs ago on your & Ron Reils advice you also gave me a lot of tips on how to use it. You probably dont remember but thank you!

[ironrosefarms]

I have an old (very old) drill press, a 4 1/2 dewalt angle grinder (I've sworn off the cheapo grinders as I have a pile of about 10 of them I've burnt up), bench grinder, Miller stick welder, 25gal portable compressor, 200+gal home built compressor, 2 pneumatic die grinders, pneumatic hand drill.

On my list of NEEDS (want is not a strong enough word when talking tools)... horizontal electric hacksaw, band saw, belt grinder, sand blasting equipment, treadle hammer, and a powered hammer of some sort...

[Frosty]

It is! I bought one five or six yrs ago on your & Ron Reils advice you also gave me a lot of tips on how to use it. You probably dont remember but thank you!

You're right, I don't recall EVER recommending an AllStates torch to a Maddog.

Glad it's working for you. Often when I talk about the thing I get the feeling reasonable folk think I'm telling tall tales. Sometimes I begin to wonder myself, then I'll need to do something really unreasonable for an O/A rig, break it out and it just breezes right through it.

I have to order a part for the oxy reg, I dropped it a while back and broke the bottle level gage.

Frosty

[Frosty]

There are many different size tips for the ox/ac torch, and one size does NOT fit all sizes of work.

Right you are but if you find the tip that will let me weld with my AllState Oxy Propane torch let me know. The guys who make them say you can weld with one but I've yet to meet anyone who could do it well at all.

Frosty

[Glenn]

Would Harris, Victor, or other brands fit your AllState? How about uncoupling the AllState head and coupling another brand onto the hoses? There are several oxy/propane tips out there, getting one that fits inside an AllState torch may be a challenge.

[Frosty]

You can get different size and type tips for the AllStates torch that are designed to work properly with it.

There is a problem with the pressures of the gasses involved. Unlike O/A which is an equal pressure system, twice the oxy psi as acet psi amounts to the same molecular weight hence "equal pressure". The propane torch operates at widely different pressures, the propane in the low ounces per inch (ozpi) while the oxy even using the small brazing tips in in the range of 20-30 psi.

With oxy psi this high the flame itself just blows the molten metal out of the puddle.

Lyle at AllStates told me I just needed to know how but the local rep couldn't show me. Then he told me I needed to buy a newer model torch. Then he hemmed and hawed. Three different conversations over a period of time.

I'm not complaining, I didn't buy it to weld with. I simply point out the one weakness of the rig when I talk about them. If you have to have a torch set you CAN weld with do NOT buy an AllStates oxy/prop rig. Unless (and it's a big one) you have a rep who CAN weld with it and teach you. If anyone runs across one and learns how, please tell me!

Frosty

[Glenn]

Can you put a regulator in the line to cut the pressure / flow to what is needed?

[maddog]

To get the equivalent heat of an oxy acet torch you need a much higher oxy pressure. Also, an oxy acet is much more concentrated than propane so you get a larger HZ and must use a hotter setting (since you are heating more material)

But I think the chemistry is just wrong. About the point where I get a puddle it all turns to slag. If it is possible its going to be way to touchy. Like Frosty I want to know how but I doubt I would use it for welding even if I did. Acet welds even when you are sloppy with the settings. Propane is fine for brazing and silver solder but worthless for welding steel. However propane rox for cutting and heating. One of the nice things about propane is you can use much higher pressures since its not unstable like acet. The tip is held about 1" away from the work and you can just roll the torch sideways to make a long straight cut. Also the cut surface is soft, not carburized and a lot cleaner than acet