macbruce Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Still fun though. Rob Fun, I'll tell you fun, I'm friends with a smith nearby who has a 700 nazel. If he'll let me I'll post the results, probly wont have to heat it..... Also, This test is likely thought of by some to be a total wast of time, absurd,etc,etc. But It sure as hell beats watching the news! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstermetal Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Fun, I'll tell you fun, I'm friends with a smith nearby who has a 700 nazel. If he'll let me I'll post the results, probly wont have to heat it..... Also, This test is likely thought of by some to be a total wast of time, absurd,etc,etc. But It sure as hell beats watching the news! Bingo.... I am headed down to Bob Kramers today, Maybe I can get him to let me do the test on his 500lb Little Giant... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macbruce Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Here it is on David Norrie's 700 nazel 5 bl: .20, 10 bl .135. The only forge available was a wide open propane, 1800,1900 deg. I think it shows how tough the matieral becomes when it goes below .15 or so. It's the biggest sport hammer I've ever operated..................mb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Here it is on David Norrie's 700 nazel 5 bl: .20, 10 bl .135. The only forge available was a wide open propane, 1800,1900 deg. I think it shows how tough the matieral becomes when it goes below .15 or so. It's the biggest sport I've ever operated..................mb Good point! Always had a problem with rating hammers by how thick they could work. In some respects it's how thin they can work effectively. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macbruce Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Good point! Always had a problem with rating hammers by how thick they could work. In some respects it's how thin they can work effectively. Yeah, It was like the thing hit a wall.... I heard a formula once re power boats: If you want to go 100mph you need a 1000hp mill.For every mph higher you need another 100hp........a bit of a stretch, but in the same ballpark.....mb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstermetal Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Look at the Bugatti Veyron The standard million dollar version will only do 253mph or something but the 1200 hp/1100 ft lb torque 1.7 million dollar super sport will do 267 mph. Those last couple mph are quite expensive Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nonjic Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 :blink: a 155lb Blu can outwork a 700lb nazel ! test is good fun though B) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macbruce Posted January 10, 2011 Share Posted January 10, 2011 Ya betcha', just one minor detail........... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstermetal Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 Bob did not have a hot forge this morning so I didn't even ask about doing the test with his hammer.. I did snap a pic while he wasn't looking though ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Miller Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 I've worked 4" round in the larger model say mak, albeit the specific hammer is a little beat and worn, it did not handle it very well. it did not "forge through" the stock, but fishlipped it slightly. I would not recommend it! Even when it was new it really didn't do a good job on 4" round BTW that was a hunk of 4140 round it might have even been 4 1/2 If I remember. If someone could sell me some parts it wouldn't be so beat or if I had gotten a manual when I bought it I would have known better how to maintain the hammer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstermetal Posted January 11, 2011 Share Posted January 11, 2011 Hey Tim I can get you parts and have the manual copied to PDF and can email it no problem... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dillon Sculpture Posted January 12, 2011 Share Posted January 12, 2011 Not sure what this means... 250 Murray mech. .583 and .383 500 Bradley mech. .610 and .489 I heated the material when I was waiting for some 3" round to come up to temp. so probably not real hot on the test. If there is any consolation I drew the 3" out on the 500, it took two heats, drew 15" out to 34", 2-1/4" on the flats to 1", hex shape all the way down. :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dillon Sculpture Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Sorry Sam, I really didn't like my standings (competitive nature) so I had a coal fire going this afternoon... second try was a little different 250-429 and 306, made a couple of mechanical adjustments to the 500-434 and 297 flat dies on both. Still use the 500 lb. hammer for anything over 3". My scanner is busted, I thought I posted this before. Capacity of Chambersburg pneumatic motor driven 100- 721 Ft. lbs. 532 Joules 2" stock (production) 200-1600 Ft. lbs. 1180 Joules 2.75" stock (production) 400-4000 Ft. lbs. 4086 Joules 3.875" stock (production) 750-8516 Ft. lbs. 8516 Joules 5" stock (production) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macbruce Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 The squeaky wheel gets the grease. Maybe that 500 ain't squeakin' or knockin' but it needs a tune up, .297 ain't too shabby.........Good use for the test......mb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macbruce Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Looks like air hammers have more output force , but considering my 250 needs 15hp and my friends 250 lg needs half that. It would seem the extra output comes at a considerable cost. But, juice still ain't as bad as gas......................yet..............mb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Looks like air hammers have more output force , but considering my 250 needs 15hp and my friends 250 lg needs half that. It would seem the extra output comes at a considerable cost. But, juice still ain't as bad as gas......................yet..............mb My 500 pound Nazel was also 15 hp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dillon Sculpture Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 The squeaky wheel gets the grease. Maybe that 500 ain't squeakin' or knockin' but it needs a tune up, .297 ain't too shabby.........Good use for the test......mb Maybe 3rd times a charm! I don't think I have released the full potential of the hammer yet but how flawed is this test? What does it show? It is still a matter of sizing the hammer to the stock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macbruce Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 My 500 pound Nazel was also 15 hp. I was speaking in more general, and my hammer probably ain't the best example. Had a friend once who ran a 500lb Beaudry with a 5hp! The 500 was more of an ego trip than a working rig and I'm sure It would have gone nuclear If ever really put to the task. I was amazed the poor thing would even turn it ! I'd say he needed a minimum of 10 and 10 is a pretty good hp/wt ratio. Any how there's allot more hammers out there to test. We'll see about my opinion...........listing hp might help clarify some questions...... Oh please Sam please !.........mb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hankknickmeyer Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 This is fun...It might be enough to get Hofi and Tom Clark posting again. Maybe I'll try it with my Nazel 2B and Saymak 50 when it warms up a bit around here. Hank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twcoffey Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 There are some confusing results in the data so far and I think head acceleration may be the explanation. If all test power hammers were drop hammers then the comparisons would be consistent because they would all be operating at the same head acceleration of 32.2 ft/sec/sec(gravity). Force = Mass x acceleration. In the case of mechanical hammers tuning by adjusting the spring or linkages can greatly alter the Force or impact of the head because it changes the acceleration some call it "slap". In the case of air hammers air pressure and air flow rates will control greatly affect the acceleration. A lighter head at a higher acceleration could possibly deliver more force than a heaver head with lower acceleration. Ted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstermetal Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Boy is really going to be something if you can get Tom posting... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hankknickmeyer Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Don't underestimate Tom. Hank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstermetal Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 I wouldn't, I know Tom was a human dynamo... But as far as I know they dont have a high speed connection yet in Heaven.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hankknickmeyer Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 He would need broadband, dial-up couldn't keep up with him. Hank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sask Mark Posted January 13, 2011 Share Posted January 13, 2011 Oops, I posted then my refreshed screen showed me Larry beat me by a couple of hours... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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