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anvil id


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Hey ,

Ive gone a bit anvil crazy the last few weeks and picked up one today,was hoping you guys would be able to identify it. the pictures i saw before i bought it didnt have any marks, and was only a picture of the side and I was convinced it was a later 1903 mouse hole anvil by the shape of the waist however now ive got it, it has two hardies and the area with markings is all chiselled up but I can clearly see the letters "MBLE" but thats all ive got, anyone have any ideas? as it has two hardies is it likely it was made at mouse hole for some firm ending in mble ?! I can also see the weight clearly which is 2 .3 .15 making it 323lbs or 147kgs on this side of the pond nowadays!

also seems to have a few blobs of weld on the face from some careless owner but still rebounds ace in between the weld beads, Im definately going to shave that off and clean it up it rings like a bell too, more so than my cast steel anvil. If anyone can tell me what they think it is would be great ,

much appreciated,

Matt

thanks

 

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There were over 200 English anvil makers many of them making anvils that are quite similar in shape---the usual progression to becoming an anvil maker was to learn the trade at one of the large maker's (like mouse hole and peter wright) and then go off on their own making what they learned and so they often made quite similar styles.

I do not see two hardies with that anvil. I see two hardy holes. The hardies are what fit in the holes...

Looks like it is weight stamped in CWT; but doesn't look as fat waisted as a lot of MH's.

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thanks for the input there tom,

apologies for not using the word "hole" after the word  hardie!     I know there are many unbranded anvil makers that sprung up in the uk and I also know thatmany unbranded anvils were made by the big brands for certain companies who sometimes wouldnt want the anvil manufacturers logo and name on them and often wanted their own. perhaps why there are so many brooks anvils knocking about with the word brooks ground off them I dont know, and as this is a twin hardie "hole" anvil it is most likely made for a specific industrial company.

I agree she is thin in the waist and got them curves tom compared to most mouse holes out there and over there too but I have found examples of what looklike identical twins apart from the additional hardie hole like in this youtube vid from eastern europe somewhere, and the later mouseholes seem to me to get longer and thinner in the waist like like on this thread with images from the book the later one at the bottom has the same tall thin waist and angles

looks pretty close to me but obviously could be someone who ripped mousehole off and set upon their own next door and copied them  who knows !

 

here is another example of a large mousehole that seems to be the spit with the thin waist pattern let me know what you think

Anvil 020.jpg

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Hey John thanks for the input !

Yes I can see the twin hardie hole is in many of the standard patterns but it looks to me that the standard patterns that possess both holes are not london pattern with the step which mine is unless it is the spring makers anvil with the side bick cut off! so I am still thinking it is some sort of custom london pattern with twin hardie holes, I keep seeing these mouseholes that are identical in waist shape my one like the one at the bottom of this picture. has anyone ever heard of an anvil manufacturer ending in MBLE? maybe MBLIE? I will go at her with a cup brush tommorow and see if I can get any more clues!

Thanks again

Matt

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Hey Matt,  welcome to the forum.

Have you read this thread? It will help with getting the most out of IFI.

Nice anvil you have there, when you say shave off the weld I hope you aren't going to grind or mill the face. If you read a few threads about "restoring" an anvil it will be clear that's not the way to go.

 

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Hey ,

Thanks for that I have now updated my profile a bit, I did actually have an account when I started into blacksmithing on here about 12 years ago! but that is long gone so about time to make a fresh one I think, join the community again and come out from under my rock..

to be honest in the last few weeks I have read about every thread on anvils on here and elsewhere I have become obsessed, and yes I know many people say it is a bad idea to thin down the steel face but I will have to at the very least take of the beads of weld as it is unusable as is.  About ten years ago I ground all the chipped edges out of my cast steel anvil and filled with mild steel rod not knowing any better, since then the anvil is still lush to use and the edges that I have worked on have sagged a little but dont explode so I think its all good myself, the face is still very hard and doesnt have a single mark on it from a lot of use! on the other hand the guys that I do alot of work for have a double horn peter wright that he refaced with hard facing rod which is still my favourite anvil there however all the edges are chipping off every day that goes by and he wants to fill the edges with mild steel soon. dont worry Im not gonna shave off anything substantial! and I understand that the steel has work hardened over time and is precious stuff , but I sure do like a flat area to work on that isnt stamping marks into my work!

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just scuffed her up a goodun! cant see any more letters other than its surely MBLES, however there is some pretty clear serial numbers on the front left foot #32707 and a sideways 0 I think on the right.the hardie hole near the bick is massive and tapered making me think its some other kind of tooling hole, if only it wasnt chiseled to death on the side where all the writing was oh well!

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The tapered hole by the horn looks about the size for pexto tooling.

I would take a fine, 180 or 240 grit flap sanding disk an carefully smooth out the welds on the face being sure to just take off the weld material. By where the s/n is located it is most likely a special order made by Hay Budden. If so that s/n would have been made in 1897.

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Guys I finally found it! It is another forging company in sheffield  called MOSS & GAMBLE BROS

MOSS & GAMBLES

SHEFFIELD

that took somework!  definately the spitting image of a later mousehole though Im thinking it was made around 1910 or afterish?!

how do the serial numbers work?anyone know it isnt the 32nd thousandth one they have knocked up?!! the early ones are just like the early mousehole anvils too! seems they have been copying or vice versa.

Well I know you will all cry about sanding into that face of hers but I cleaned it her up a bit earlier and sanded the welds off but still heavilly dinged up in the main worked area. I then did a ball bearing test and guess what the "work hardened"area is the worst section maybe 50 to 70% but that could be becuase its so dinged up the ball doesnt connect quite as good,whereas the areas that are not really worked and not "work hardened" like around the heel rebounds at 90% or so basicly I drop the ball and it comes right back into my hand at the non worked areas. also all the weld beads when ground off have hair line cracks around them, so might have to go a bit deeper sorry! might heat and fill some of the dents up too you guys are gonna hate me!

I mean the plate is a good 10mm thick and when hardened from new they must have heated more than 1mm deep of the face ,in fact not to do so would be nigh on impoosible!

this anvil rings so loud! I dont think ive heard one as noisy to be fair ! thin waist and solid I guess.

Frozen forge thanks for the tip I will look into pexto tooling!

And Im glad you can see what I mean with the weld globs, some people eh!

Thanks for the input you guys!

 

 

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Those dings and weld lines will not hurt your work. Use it for a while then decide if you " need" to grind further. It will function fine the way it is with the welds off of it. 

I have a hay budden with chisel marks all over the face, they don't show up in the work. 

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6 minutes ago, Daswulf said:

Those dings and weld lines will not hurt your work. Use it for a while then decide if you " need" to grind further. It will function fine the way it is with the welds off of it. 

I have a hay budden with chisel marks all over the face, they don't show up in the work. 

Thanks  I hear what your saying although the truth is I dont "need" it anyway I already have a perfectly flat similar sized anvil and another smaller brooks but the truth is I "want" it to be smooth and pretty ! Im a bit picky with this stuff I can even notice my work isnt as smooth and shiny after condensation has formed tiny pits on the face! its got to the point I put a towel on my anvil before I call it a day!

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Covering the anvil with some canvas at the end of the day stops rust on the face. At least it does so In the Sydney weather. Can't guarantee it will do so in Alaska. 

That anvil would be a perfect candidate for texturing your stock before working it. 

Having said that I am not sure I would be able to resist the temptation of sanding those weld blobs flat. 

 

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