jerryt Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 A fellow about an hour away contacted me about this anvil. He thinks it came "from the railroad" to a family which sold it to him years ago when they sold their farm. No identifying marks that I can see from the pictures he sent. He thinks it weighs 4-500 lbs. 5" wide x 32 " long. Hardy is 1.25" square. Came to him on the damaged cast iron base. I see a large 6 and a small 1 in picture number 5. I'm trying to determine what to offer for it. He has a smaller anvil that meets his needs and is willing to part with this one. I sure would appreciate some help in identifying this and placing a value on it before I go to look at it. Thanks, Jerry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Turley Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 If the '6' is stamped under the horn side of the waist, it may be a Hay-Budden. I don't think other anvil manufacturers put numbers there. Hay-Buddens are highly valued and highly coveted anvils. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy Ivan Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 2nd for a Hay Budden. Looks just like my old one. If there is an hourglass indentation underneath the feet, it's almost definitely a Hay Budden. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryt Posted February 17, 2016 Author Share Posted February 17, 2016 Frank, I went back to him. The "6" is on the waist under the horn. Now to find some info on the various versions of Hay-Budens in the larger sizes. Thanks. Jerry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryt Posted February 17, 2016 Author Share Posted February 17, 2016 Thanks Frank and Ivan. What is your assessment of condition (given the rust-covered surface) and is there a place where I can find out the different sizes Hay-Buden made? Jerry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Turley Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 The face can be cleaned up with a disc sander. The chunks out of the step and heel shouldn't be a problem. Hay-Budden started in Brooklyn, NY, beginning about 1890. They made anvils 400, 500 pounds, and more. The book "Anvils in America" by Postman talks about the history. $1.00 a pound would be a super deal. If it were me, I would finagle up to $2.50/pound...less if possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted February 17, 2016 Share Posted February 17, 2016 jerryt, Look at the front foot (under the horn). You may be able to make out a stamped serial number. Looks like a HB to me too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Direwolf Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Hi Jerryt, definitely a Hay Budden as the others pointed out.. As to the size, it is not 400- 500 pounds, the combined weight of anvil and stand is though. I have a number of them from 50-400 lbs, I quick measured a 310 lb one it is 34 inches x 5 inch face, with 1.25 hardy hole, and a 375 lb that is 36 x 6 inch face, 1.5 hardy, that matches Mr Postman's table in Anvils in America which gives the dimensions for a 300 lb anvil as 5" x 21" face, 13" horn and 1.25" hardy. So I would feel confident to estimate the one you picture in a range from 275 to 300 lbs, perhaps a little more or less. The logo and weight are always stamped on the side you look at if you are standing with your right hand on the horn and left on the heel as in the picture third from the top, the weight will be below the logo. They are great anvils some of the best made. As Frank pointed out it would clean up nice. Due to the rust you may not be able to make out the logo or weight but a little wire brushing might reveal something. If you go look check the rebound with a ball bearing preferably 1-inch or tap around on the face with a hammer. I hope this info helps you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryt Posted February 18, 2016 Author Share Posted February 18, 2016 Direrwolf, Thank you. I kinda figured it was closer to my Fisher in weight. I don't understand the board/forum, I guess. I posted details twice and can't see my own posts, so don't know what anyone else is seeing. Jerry Direwold, I see the one I just addressed to your response. The other two have disappeared. Something is screwy. Jerry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkie Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 jerryt, great anvil. Hope you are able to get it. Hay Budden's are wonderful anvils. As for disappearing posts...the norm these days on the forum. PM,s disappear too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 Just don't pay "anvil" prices for broken cast iron stand! It would do just fine on a stump stand. Let us know if you get it! (and check that front foot for a serial number!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryt Posted February 18, 2016 Author Share Posted February 18, 2016 Roger Tom. I keep trying to reply and post but most disappears. Frustrating! 1 hour ago, arkie said: jerryt, great anvil. Hope you are able to get it. Hay Budden's are wonderful anvils. As for disappearing posts...the norm these days on the forum. PM,s disappear too. So did my response to you........................ 16 minutes ago, ThomasPowers said: Just don't pay "anvil" prices for broken cast iron stand! It would do just fine on a stump stand. Let us know if you get it! (and check that front foot for a serial number!) Either the stand is free or it will be a plant stand at his house. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryt Posted February 18, 2016 Author Share Posted February 18, 2016 Update: I looked at it and struck it repeatedly. IMO, the table was not consistent in rebound or ring. No obvious damage but I was just not impressed with the sound. Maybe that is characteristic of Hay-Buddens (if that is what this anvil is). I've never seen a H-B before. There were no other identifying marks. The stand is open in the center so I could feel the bottom. No hourglass recess. Totally flat on the bottom. Anyway, given that the brand is not clearly determinable, I felt he wanted to much for the anvil (started at $1,000 and came down to $750). I went as high as $600. No deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 If the anvil is tightly fastened down it won't ring. The rebound is of grave concern. Some of the early HBs had a very shallow rim to them that have been known to wear flat over a long life. I have one like that, you almost have to dust it to see the hourglass. That face looks more like the one on my Trenton though---thickness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryt Posted February 18, 2016 Author Share Posted February 18, 2016 Crap! Lost my post again!!! I'm not a typist. Anvil is tightly secured to the base and base thickness is about 3/4". Rebound varied, particularly near the Hardy. The flat of the horn had no rebound at all. Made me wonder if the top is tool steel and body is cast, similar to Fisher. My Fishers have the tool steel extended from the table fully across the flat of the horn step and across the top of the horn. I don't know how the H-Bs were made. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 No; A lot of anvils have an unhardened horn; Fishers are one of the few that steeled the horns. Any buzz when checking rebound? (any denting too?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryt Posted February 18, 2016 Author Share Posted February 18, 2016 No noticable buzzing. I used his small 16 oz ball peen. Did not strike hard enough to dent. You think I may have made a mistake walking away at that price? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 18, 2016 Share Posted February 18, 2016 As I'm averaging about US$1 a pound for the last 1000 pounds of anvils I have bought I would say no. I've learned to walk away without a backwards glance if I think the price too high. Sometimes I'll leave my card if I think they have just been misled by outrageous prices on the net; but may come to their senses. Getting started you may not profit from a large anvil as much as a small one---easier to haul around until you get a secure dedicated shop set up and truthfully; I have more hours smithing on my 93# A&H than on my 515# Fisher---though every minute on the Fisher reminds me why the big ones are *nice*---and why Fishers are particularly nice! Of course I am notoriously cheap and hunting stuff down cheap is how I enjoy time off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryt Posted February 19, 2016 Author Share Posted February 19, 2016 11th attempt to respond, including a computer restart. Never see such a tough site to use. Tom, Thanks for reaffirming my decision to walk away. He has my contact info. BTW: I have a retail store but am only fooling with anvils to learn. I do have my 214 lbs Peter Wright listed on CL but have made no further selling plans. Jerry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fatfudd Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 My 300 lb Hay Budden is 33 in long and 5 in wide. They can vary a little in size and weight but I would say that one is closer to 275 lbs, That being said the larger the anvil the more the price goes up simply because there are fewer of the large ones. At $750 for a 275 lb anvil puts the price around $2.70/lb. Altho a lot of folks have found anvils much cheaper than that, myself included, that is a really decent price for a bigger anvil. The prices for anvils keeps going up driven by ebay and collectors. What you described as the rebound sounds normal when using a small hammer to test it, clearly a 1 in steel bearing is better. If that anvil were here in NM it would have been sold in minutes at $1000, because there are far fewer anvils here than say Ohio. The price for anvils is very location dependent. My guess is that you still won't find many 275 lb anvils for sale at that price even in VA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 19, 2016 Share Posted February 19, 2016 Traditionally anvils had a peak in the price per pound curve around 100 to 125 pounds as that was the size most in demand for using and the big ones were often cheap as few people needed or could manage them. Then the internet came along and "collectors" moved in. I'm lucky I got my 515# Fisher for 66 US cents a pound in mint condition and the 410 trenton for 50 cents a pound; but needing some TLC at an anvil repair clinic held by my local ABANA group. Remember however that Francis Whitaker; one of America's great blacksmiths, did his entire career on an anvil around 165 pouinds IIRC. Blacksmiths suffer terribly from anvil envy; but how you use it is more important than how big it is! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerryt Posted February 20, 2016 Author Share Posted February 20, 2016 Posting attempt 1. Thanks fellas. In a few days I'll remind him via e-mail of my continuing interest and see what he says. Jerry HEY !!! I got lucky in posting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johan Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 Hello guys, i picked up this anvil for a good price this weekend. I cleaned it up with a wire brush and can only distinguish a few letters and no numbers or words. I would love some help itentifying it if its possible just by visual qualities. Any help is appreciated. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 It looks like an english anvil made by any of 200+ different makers; as the way things happened a "new" factory was often started by someone who had worked in another factory and then went on thier own---but this resulted in a lot of anvils looking a very similar. *ANY* letters would help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johan Posted March 8, 2016 Share Posted March 8, 2016 Ok thanks Thomas, I will have a better look tommorow and write down what I see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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