eBay's effect on Anvils

[Thomas Dean]

Here is a prime example of what eBay has done to the prices of anvils. http://austin.craigslist.org/tls/2123047199.html
That figures out to be $3.78 p/lb. Just in the last year or so I have seen prices of anvils rise to crazy high prices on eBay and it is trickling down to non-ebay sales.

[arftist]

Thats the asking price. A lot of over-priced anvils stay for sale for a long time. What a piece of crap by the way. I sometimes send these greedy idiots a message letting them know what I think about their prices. They don't tend to appreciate my input.

[dablacksmith]

well ... its always a case where what ya ask and what ya get is two different things... i had a anvil come into my shop last year for 100 $ about that size ... the guy just wanted to get rid of it and wasnt willing to wait... also didnt want to deal with putting it on craigs list .I told him he could get more for it !I gave a guy who had his anvil stolen a good deal and still made money on it . he is asking top dollar for that one but he may sit on it for a wile ... ebay is the way for those that are desperate for a anvil and have to have it NOW! tho i did buy a anvil off ebay ... it looked real ugly in the pictures so it went cheap but the parts that count (the face) was good! one of those times where ya had to look at the overall picture and then figure the inportant part .the shipping was almost as much as the anvil cost was tho. i wouldnt blame the prices on ebay alone tho ... there are a few collectors out there nowadays and the general feeling that a anvil is old therefore valueable.

[Thomas Dean]

i wouldnt blame the prices on ebay alone tho ... there are a few collectors out there nowadays and the general feeling that a anvil is old therefore valueable.

Agreed. Maybe not entirely but there are WAY more people looking at anvils on eBay, wheither buying or setting their prices, than seeing collectors with anvils. I know for fact of quite a few folks that price their blacksmithing equipment solely on the prices from ebay.

This anvil would be a good candidate for refurbishing and I am not a big one for refurbishing anvils.

[MattBower]

If the guy can find a buyer willing to pay that price (which is unlikely, but certainly not impossible), well, more power to them both. All the Internet does is make it easier for would-be buyers and sellers find each other. That's not a bad thing. Sure, you have some idiot sellers who irrationally overestimate the value of their wares, and some idiot buyers who pay more than they have to for what they get. But those are not new phenomena. :)

[maddog]

If you follow Stewarts' First Come First Serve thread, you will see a lot of very good deals on anvils listed on ebay. Some steals in fact.

Ebay is not some kind of conspiracy to jack up prices on anvils. It's just a market. The value of something is what people will pay for it. If you manufacture electrical switches with gold contacts, there is no sense in complaining that you have to pay absurd prices for the metal because people are wearing it as jewelry. Gold is simply worth what people will pay for it.

A market like ebay provides an important service. If it were not for the greedy, profit hungry antique merchants hunting out these anvils, many of them would still be rusting away in people's sheds, waiting for that final spring cleaning when they go to the scrap yard and end up as rebar. We would all like stuff for free or cheap. Problem is that if the price is too low, people are not motivated to supply the goods. If gold cost the same as lead, no one would trouble to dig it out of the ground.

Where I live, there are very few blacksmithing tools or anvils to be found. I have bought a lot of good smithing tools on ebay that I could not afford to buy new. Perhaps in some areas these tools can be found at garage sales for a lot less but even then, you have to invest the time and the effort to seek them out. On ebay I have my pick of a wide selection and all I have to do is click on PayPal.

[its512eric]

Ebay definetly makes the prices artificially high(er), but part of the problem is the difficulty in locating an anvil at a reasonable price, if you can locate one that is not ready for the scrap yard. If you have one, you can wait for a price that makes sense, but anyone that is new or starting over can find themselves hard pressed. I purchaced a Kohlswa in good used condition on ebay for what worked out to $3.17/lb to include shipping. I bet I tried 200 times (ebay and local) before I found something. I stayed on the lower end, I know because I would always loose, based on articles from this site and anvilfire. Eventually you can find something, but you have to be able to be patient.

[MattBower]

anyone that is new or starting over can find themselves hard pressed. I purchaced a Kohlswa in good used condition on ebay for what worked out to $3.17/lb to include shipping. I bet I tried 200 times (ebay and local) before I found something. I stayed on the lower end, I know because I would always loose, based on articles from this site and anvilfire. Eventually you can find something, but you have to be able to be patient.

This is why I go out of my way to tell people that improvised, homemade, fabbed, and other non-commercial, non-London pattern anvils ARE anvils. There are lots of things you can use as anvils -- with great results -- until a commercial anvil comes along. It's a mistake to rush out and by an overpriced London pattern because you think you need a "real" anvil.

[Timothy Miller]

Perhaps congress should pass a law to institute a policy of anvil socialism. They could have the government tax professional smiths and tool collectors at say 25% to fund the purchase of used anvils for hobbyists. You would not be allowed to spend your anvil stamps any anvil made later than 1926, costing more than $3.15 per/lb or over 175 lbs. Also you would be required to burn only domestically produced coal to support the American mining industry. You will also have to meet with agent from anvil services department quarterly to make sure you use your anvil at least three times a month, don't weld on torch it or hammer your iron too cold. If you do so your anvil will be taken into protective custody and your leg vise box removed for 30 days. After this time you may seek a hearing to see if you should be alowed to blacksmith on a real anvil. You may also apply to use public anvils but they are cast iron and have triangular hardie holes.

[MattBower]

Perhaps congress should pass a law to institute a policy of anvil socialism. They could the government tax professional smiths and tool collectors at say 25% to fund the purchase of used anvils for hobbyists. You would not be allowed to spend your anvil stamps any anvil made later than 1926, costing more than $3.15 or over 175 lbs. Also you would be required to burn only domestically produced coal to support the American mining industry. You will also have to meet with agent from anvil services department quarterly to make sure you use your anvil at least three times a month, don't weld on torch it or hammer your iron too cold. If you so so your anvil will be taken into protective custody and your leg vise box removed for 30 days. After this time you may seek a hearing to see if you should be alowed to blacksmith on a real anvil. You may also apply to use public anvils but they are cast iron and have triangular hardie holes.

B)

[bajajoaquin]

I'm not sure I agree with the statement that, "Ebay definetly makes the prices artificially high(er)."

I purchased my Hill anvil (185lb) on eBay for $200, or about a buck ten a pound. That seems to be a pretty fair price anywhere in the country, let alone anvil-poor Southern California. I put in my max bid, figuring that it would get bid out of my range, just like every other anvil in my area. But I got lucky, and I won.

Remember that eBay allows more people to look for anvils, which lets more collectors drive prices up. But it also lets more people sell anvils to a wider audience, which would tend to drive them down. Every time someone posts that anvils are impossible to find at a reasonable price, others respond with stories that say just the opposite. I suspect that when the only way of getting the word out was a flyer on the post office wall, things were much the same. There are bargain hunters, and people who don't want to wait.

I totally agree with Matt's suggestion, and followed it myself.

[Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver]

Before we had a national marketplace (eBay) prices were a local thing, some items sold for a lot more in some areas and a lot less in others. eBay is just the great equalizer. Hurts some and helps others. Just by creating a marketplace at all has probably raised prices overall though, I believe. On the up side, if you really want an anvil, you don't have any excuse.

[MattBower]

Look at the bright side: as prices go up in the secondary anvil market, that'll drive some of the demand to new anvils. That extra demand will stimulate competition and greater production, which should eventually drive prices down. Pretty soon it's free, new Refflinghauses for everyone! ;)

[BIGGUNDOCTOR]

A couple of observations here.

Anvil poor Southern CA. Earlier this year I got bored and checked all of the CA CL listings, and turned up 12 anvils that had been listed in one week. Many of them were in the LA area. You have to be vigilant. Punch the main header of Items For Sale, and type in anvil. That way you get all of them listed under tools, antiques, business, etc.

I think Ebay has driven prices up. I have seen this with many items. Lyman Super Targetspot scopes went from $100 at local gun shows to $600. Dooling tether cars went from $200 to $3,500. Marble Goss sights went nuts. Many of the car parts that I used to deal with went way up too. What happened is uninformed impatient buyers get caught up in an auction frenzy, and pay too much. I have seen it at machine shop auctions where people were paying $100 + premiums for used Craftsman shop vacs that were on sale at Sears for $99.99. $50 for Taiwanese bench grinders that were new downtown for $29.99. Now what happens is some goob pays $100 for a $50 item, and everyone else thinks their $50 item is now worth $100. A lot of buyers are also speculators hoping to get something, and resell it during a frenzy on certain items.
It is good if you are selling, but really sticks the ones buying an item to use, and not just look at.

Is all this a bad thing? In the end no. We live in a capitalist society, so you have to be ready to buy when the deals are at hand. I wish I had bought several cases of 7.62x39 when it was $60 a case. Who would have thought it would jump to $350 a case in just over a year. I have found that items will run in cycles. Prices start climbing then top out after awhile. Then when either the supply has grown, or demand dwindles, the prices fall back down. Sometimes it only takes a couple of years, sometimes awhile longer.

If everyone decided that an anvil was not worth over $1 a pound, and didn't pay anything over that, prices would drop. Will that happen? Not unless you can get the propaganda ministry to get the word out. Then again if every smith's mantra was "A buck a pound" it may work. ;)

[Timothy Miller]

If everyone decided that an anvil was not worth over $1 a pound, and didn't pay anything over that, prices would drop. Will that happen? Not unless you can get the propaganda ministry to get the word out. Then again if every smith's mantra was "A buck a pound" it may work.

So you are proposing a Union of anvil users? You must hate our Freedom :unsure:

[MattBower]

Too much incentive to cheat. If you and I both want the same anvil, the way I make sure that I get it is to offer more $ than you're offering. In which case we're right back where we started. :)

[bajajoaquin]

Look at the bright side: as prices go up in the secondary anvil market, that'll drive some of the demand to new anvils. That extra demand will stimulate competition and greater production, which should eventually drive prices down. Pretty soon it's free, new Refflinghauses for everyone!

A perfect example of the free market economy. Southshoresmith offers a subsidy, and not to be out-bid, you offer free anvils. I am sensing that the market won't change direction any time soon. I'm holding out for MonsterMetal to offer to pay me to take some of his surplus off his hands.

It could happen. :D

[Sweany]

'ello gov'nor 'ave you 'eard the price of anvils lately!

Bloody Shocking! what

[MattBower]

What bizarre poses. Who sits down with his hand in his pocket?!

[Timothy Miller]

What bizarre poses. Who sits down with his hand in his pocket?!

That's probably why he is smiling.

[MattBower]

That's probably why he is smiling.

You had to go to there. I mean, I thought it, but I wasn't going to say it.

[Mainely,Bob]

That's probably why he is smiling.

Bad news Tim,my Mom says I can`t hang out with you anymore.
Something about being a bad influence and cutting the bottoms out of your pockets. :rolleyes:

[KYBOY]

Ive seen anvils go for more than $4 a pound on ebay before.I troll ebay a lot.There are a few certains sellers who have a steller reputation who will always get upwards of $3 a pound. I honestly dont see to many "good" deals on ebay anvils but I see some reasonable deals..Hammers and tongs often go for outrageous prices on ebay to collectors. You know, I suppose more power to em'..Ill admit Im a gun collector and have held on to many a gun and gun parts to sell at an inflated profit . I had about 10 italian beretta 92f mags still in the paper I bought for $10 each..Kept them for a few years and sold them for $60 each when the ban went into effect..Now, I can find them cheap again..Pre-ban ar's were the same way..Some folks do buy this stuff up to sell for profit later..Anvils never get cheaper..
.......
Sometimes equipment go's in spurts..I went three or four years without seeing an anvil for sale..Then all at once we bought two in just a few days Go figure.

[Dean Christman]

Jeeze, I guess i got lucky, i bought a PW 170# in better shape than that one for 250$!

[zampilot]

"I know what it's worth, saw one on Ebay....."
A guy sort-of-local has been trying to sell a mediocre PW for a year now, twice on ebay, several times on CL. $450 for a beat,chipped swayback 100lb'r, but he knows what it's worth. I'm really glad I called before driving the 300 mile round trip!