What we achieved this week

[forgemaster]

This is our production for 38 hours 2 tradesman one 1st year apprentice.

6 log tongs forged and assembled
6 fencing bar heads forged
40 semi trapazodal links bent welded swaged and tapers stamped.
17 pinions forged and heat treated (starting with 300mm of 100 dia 4140) using a 400 ton press
2 x 160mm dia rockbreaker moils reforged (sharpened to a chisel)
8 chain anchors forged (23kg of 130 dia 4140 each) and normalised them. (don't have a photo of them, though there is footage of us forging them on Utube)
we also found time to do some profile cutting, re heat treated approx 100 jack hammer moils (they were too soft 1st time around),

Not our best week, as we had a couple of distrations, (me to the accountants for a day, apprentice to help one of the steam loco blokes for 4 hours)
I don't mean this as a brag session, just to give the people who may wonder what a small forge shop does to earn a living.

Cheers
Phil

[bigfootnampa]

Interesting Phil! Thanks for sharing that with us.

I have a question on the log tongs. I would expect them to have a welded ring and am wondering if we are seeing them in a partly finished stage or if they were done with just open rings for some reason... possibly as a breakaway safety device?

It would appear that you work hard in that shop!

[Timothy Miller]

You Europeans and your 38 hour work weeks .:P

[Mainely,Bob]

So,what did you do on the second day? ;)

[rokshasa]

i would take 38 hours over 50 any day!! nice work guys!

[Frosty]

The log tongs look pretty good Phil but if you set the points to meet like that they'll split the logs on a hard pull, especially if they're flat. If you make them "T" in cross section and offset them so the points pass by each other instead of meeting, they won't split through the log, beam or whatever you're lifting, dragging, etc.

The attached (I hope) pic is me repairing a log tong I damaged by attaching it to a back hoe to move some really too large for it logs. If you look close it shows what I mean by making the points "T" in cross section. I'd straightened one leg by putting WAY too much poop on them with the back hoe and am recurving and resetting the angle.

And yes, that's a wood fire I'm using a 12v blower intended to inflate air matresses, rafts and such through a piece of pipe to make a side blast. Oh yeah, that IS a birch block I'm using for an anvil.

The next day I brought a proper kit including an anvil, forge, tongs, hammers and such. You just don't really NEED the "right" tools to smith with, they just make it a whole lot easier. The only tools you REALLY need are your brain and thumbs.

Frosty the lucky

[Fe-Wood]

Frosty-
That is a great on site making due with what you got photo!!

[Mainely,Bob]

The next day I brought a proper kit including an anvil, forge, tongs, hammers and such. You just don't really NEED the "right" tools to smith with, they just make it a whole lot easier. The only tools you REALLY need are your brain and thumbs.

Frosty the lucky

So,oh Frosted one,you lay your brain on the ground as the anvil and then use your thumbs as hammers?
Cool pic,that your son there or your son-in-law?

[Frosty]

So,oh Frosted one,you lay your brain on the ground as the anvil and then use your thumbs as hammers?
Cool pic,that your son there or your son-in-law?

I'm rethinking using my brain at all, it didn't work so well splitting wood.

That's me about 12 years ago.

Frosty the Lucky.

[bigfootnampa]

Frosty I am not sure what you mean about the "T" cross section on the log tongs but it does sound like something I would like to know... maybe even should know. Any chance we could get you to post a diagram or detail pic that would help? I love learning here!!

[Mainely,Bob]

Frosty I am not sure what you mean about the "T" cross section on the log tongs but it does sound like something I would like to know... maybe even should know. Any chance we could get you to post a diagram or detail pic that would help? I love learning here!!

The "spade" part of the tongs(the part that bites into the wood) is welded or forged at 90 degrees to the arm or beam of the tongs.
The spade(what they call it here) digs in across the grain rather than with the grain so it doesn`t split the wood.

Not Frosty,but I did sleep in a Holiday Inn last night(and NOT because I got thrown out again). ;)

[Jocko 58]

G'Day Phli

Great work it would take me 5 weeks and some to do , see youse at Moony's
Cheers John and Dags (Darren)

[IanR]

Thanks for sharing Phil, I was flat out today turning some 25mm round bar into a 50mm ball. What size forge do you use to get an even heat on the larger pieces? I guess we dont do a 50 hour week out here we just squeeze it into 38.

See you at Mooney's
Cheers Ian

[Ratel10mm]

Thanks for the thread Phil, it's really nice to see what a commercial operation can do.
With regard to the HT, do you use temperature controlled ovens & suchlike, or is it still done by eye & feel? Do the clients expect / set tight standards, are yours tighter, or does it not really matter too much?
Just wondering since I have been talking HT in cutting competition knives a lot recently. :D

[forgemaster]

The log tongs look pretty good Phil but if you set the points to meet like that they'll split the logs on a hard pull, especially if they're flat. If you make them "T" in cross section and offset them so the points pass by each other instead of meeting, they won't split through the log, beam or whatever you're lifting, dragging, etc.

The attached (I hope) pic is me repairing a log tong I damaged by attaching it to a back hoe to move some really too large for it logs. If you look close it shows what I mean by making the points "T" in cross section. I'd straightened one leg by putting WAY too much poop on them with the back hoe and am recurving and resetting the angle.

And yes, that's a wood fire I'm using a 12v blower intended to inflate air matresses, rafts and such through a piece of pipe to make a side blast. Oh yeah, that IS a birch block I'm using for an anvil.

The next day I brought a proper kit including an anvil, forge, tongs, hammers and such. You just don't really NEED the "right" tools to smith with, they just make it a whole lot easier. The only tools you REALLY need are your brain and thumbs.


Thanks for the feedback frosty,
Yeh we used to set the points about 5" apart but the customer asked us to make sure that they meet, he reckons it "makes them look better" he sells them at Ag field days and such. Dont know how I'd go about explaining about the points not even lining up. We make a heavy sleeper lifting tong that has a chisel end on the points, so I hear what you are saying about the "T" points.

Big foot yeh we do weld the rings up(MIG), then we bring them back to the anvil, heat them back up and swage the welds, mainly to save us from grinding them but it also gives it a bit of grain refinement to the weld. I decided to photograph them there as I had them all sitting there cooling down after I had normalised them, (I hoped that no-one would notice the welds werent done.

With the 38 hours, the boys (employees) work 38 hours a week as set by the government and unions, I work about 12 to 14 hours a day 6 days a week, me being so lucky as to be the owner.

Cheers
Phil

[Timothy Miller]

How did a 3 man shop end up with a union?

[thingmaker3]

How did a 3 man shop end up with a union?

That's Europe for ya. You've heard of the "E.U." have you not? :D

[bigfootnampa]

Thanks Bob and Phil. I think I have it now. I am ready to make a pair of log tongs for myself. It's pretty AMAZING what you can learn here if you pay attention and think steps through and do a little practice!!!

[IanR]

I had no idea we Australians were part of Europe :rolleyes:

[Mainely,Bob]

I had no idea we Australians were part of Europe

Don`t let on that you`re not,Foster`s sales may go down here in the US. <_<

[HWHII]

Bragging? I wish I had 38 hrs a week of nothing but forge work in my shop. Good luck is with you. ;)

[Frosty]

The "spade" part of the tongs(the part that bites into the wood) is welded or forged at 90 degrees to the arm or beam of the tongs.
The spade(what they call it here) digs in across the grain rather than with the grain so it doesn`t split the wood.

Not Frosty,but I did sleep in a Holiday Inn last night(and NOT because I got thrown out again).

Thanks Bob, I'm pretty sure that's exactly what I'm talking about. I took a look in the shop and couldn't find the log tong I was repairing in the pic but did find an example of the points I was talking about on another tool, a log peavy. (I think it's called) something else I saved from the dumpster at work!

Sorry, the attached pics are huge files. Since my comp crashed I've been having trouble getting things straightened out so I can resize files like I used to with a simple "save as" I don't know what happened but I'm working on it. sorry for the added bandwidth.

Frosty the Lucky.

[bigfootnampa]

Thanks Frosty!

[Frosty]

Thanks Frosty!

My pleasure.

Frosty the Lucky.

[forgemaster]

No we dont have a union in a 3 man shop, but we are a member of the Australian Industry Group,(an employer group) Weekly hours of work are set as the award, as are minumum rates of pay for employees. The federal and state, governments along with the unions and employer groups all thrash out minimum wages, penalty rates, holidays, sick leave, and hours of work.

I always thought Austria was part of Europe.

Does Fosters actually sell somewhere in the world? I know I would'nt buy it for love or money here in Oz.

Matt, the customer usually states the hardness range he needs his jobs to finish at, normally for this customer 277-311 BHN. This is all done in electric furnaces which are temperature set and have timers on them.

Frosty, going to see if we can incorporate that kind of point into our log tongs for the next order.

thanks for the feedback guys.

Phil