Can't get heat in my charcoal forge

[Bill in Oregon]

Boy, I had a heck of a time getting past dull orange today with my charcoal washtub forge. It's a Tim Lively-style forge with an old Champion No. 40 blower and it took forever to get up to low forging temp. I'm going to clean out the tuyere and try some different fuel. I had been using conifer charcoal from slash burns, but today used a lot of Royal Oak hardwood charcoal, which I thought would burn hotter. But no.

[Jreed]

That is strange. I have been using Royal Oak for 4-5 months now and have no problem with heat. Charcoal needs air volume and lots of it. I would check the air supply and go from there.

[wolfe]

Boy, I had a heck of a time getting past dull orange today with my charcoal washtub forge. It's a Tim Lively-style forge with an old Champion No. 40 blower and it took forever to get up to low forging temp. I'm going to clean out the tuyere and try some different fuel. I had been using conifer charcoal from slash burns, but today used a lot of Royal Oak hardwood charcoal, which I thought would burn hotter. But no.

I just used charcoal for the first time the other night and had a great time using it. I got up to @ 1800 degrees all other aspects worked out well. I used mesquite charcoal which puts out way to many sparks. I used much less air than when using coal/coke. In the near future I will use the charcoal brand name Cowboy. You can get it at Fred meyers or Home Depot, its supposed to work much better without that many sparks. I think that I would check out your blower, remember that you don't need nearly as much air as with coal/coke. Hope that helps. Wolfe

[don't tread on me]

I am having the same problem but I know it isn't my air flow because I can blow the charcoal right out of the forge. I use my own charcoal made from pine. I have an electric moter hooked up to an old blower, I don't know what model the blower is.

[MattBower]

Lump charcoal -- I don't care what variety -- can easily burn steel. If you're having trouble getting to forging heat, you're doing something wrong. From your description of your blower, my guess would be that you're giving it way too much air. You can blow the heat right out of the fire. Charcoal actually requires a fairly gentle blast compared to, say, coal.

Pics would help tremendously. It's very difficult to diagnose your problem without seeing the forge setup and how you're using it. But yeah, something's wrong -- and I promise you it's not the charcoal.

[pkrankow]

Not an expert here, but from my limited experience having a slower draft through the tuyere is better than faster. If the charcoal is exiting the pot, but you are not getting a good hot fire, try opening the holes up some in your grate to slow the air flow by allowing more volume through.
Phil

[don't tread on me]

Lump charcoal -- I don't care what variety -- can easily burn steel. If you're having trouble getting to forging heat, you're doing something wrong. From your description of your blower, my guess would be that you're giving it way too much air. You can blow the heat right out of the fire. Charcoal actually requires a fairly gentle blast compared to, say, coal.

Pics would help tremendously. It's very difficult to diagnose your problem without seeing the forge setup and how you're using it. But yeah, something's wrong -- and I promise you it's not the charcoal.

Here are some pics, in these pics I didn't have the moter hooked up when I took them but, it is now hooked loosely to the belt.

[MattBower]

So, how do you turn down the air? Do you have a variable speed control on the motor?

[Francis Trez Cole]

don't tread on me - from the picture it dose not look like you have an ash dump at the buttom of you turee that would be a big problem. I used a lot of wood charcoal for some projects short increasing blasts worked for me.

[Michael]

What Francis said, if there's nothing blocking the bottom end of the pipe below the firepot, most of your air is going out the bottom of the forge and not to the fuel.

a bucket of water under the pipe, filled to cover the bottom of it will work in a pinch, catching the hot ash and blocking the airflow out the bottom, at least until you can cobble together an ash dump.

I've got a bucket of water under my ash dump, keeps all the charcoal sparks out of my shoes!

I've also been known to be cranking the blower for a good 10 minutes, before noticing the dryer hose from the blower to the forge wasn't connected.

[MattBower]

don't tread on me - from the picture it dose not look like you have an ash dump at the buttom of you turee that would be a big problem. I used a lot of wood charcoal for some projects short increasing blasts worked for me.

Great catch! That picture's so daggum big I can hardly take it in. Still, I should've noticed that!!

[ThomasPowers]

With a motor driven blower I often have to leave the ashdump door open to get the flow low enough for charcoal.

[don't tread on me]

So, how do you turn down the air? Do you have a variable speed control on the motor?

No I just tighten or loosen the belt by moving the moter forward or backward. I hve an ash dump but the handle broke off, but I have ben leaving it open. stuped me

[MattBower]

No I just tighten or loosen the belt by moving the moter forward or backward. I hve an ash dump but the handle broke off, but I have ben leaving it open. stuped

Not necessarily. But I do suspect your problem is air flow. Without seeing it, I'm not really sure whether you need more air, or less. But getting charcoal hot enough to burn steel should not be hard, so you need to experiment a little.

[don't tread on me]

Not necessarily. But I do suspect your problem is air flow. Without seeing it, I'm not really sure whether you need more air, or less. But getting charcoal hot enough to burn steel should not be hard, so you need to experiment a little.

The problem is more likly to much air becose if I want to I can blow the charcoal out of the forge.

[pkrankow]

Some motors can be slowed down with a light dimmer switch, others cannot. Universal motors are the ones that can. Might be worth investigating.
Phil

[don't tread on me]

In answer to Phil, My dad sead I cannot use a dimmer on this moter and he is an electricion. In answer to Francis, I closed the the ash dump and loosened the belt and suddenly I melted the end of a peace of rebar. Thanks all.

[poopdiddly]

I too am having this problem with my charcoal forge. I can only get the steel to a dull orange. After about 5 hits, it loses all color.

The tuyere is a black steel pipe with lots of holes drilled in the top. It won't blow charcoal out of the forge, but it blows pretty good. My blower is a hair dryer. Normally, I just put it on low, because it blows plenty strong. The other end of the pipe has a threaded cap on it. Should I unscrew that cap, or should I be adding more charcoal or something else?

I also can't seem to get the end of the steel hot. The part that gets orange is usually 1-2 inches from the end.

Could me using stainless steel have anything to do with it?

[John B]

In answer to Phil, My dad sead I cannot use a dimmer on this moter and he is an electricion. In answer to Francis, I closed the the ash dump and loosened the belt and suddenly I melted the end of a peace of rebar. Thanks all.

If you can't slow down the motor, consider the options.

Fit an air slide,

Make it hand cranked (far better for charcoal fires)

If you partially open the ash dump you can control the air flow to the tuyere, wider open, less flow, like a normal slide valve

Personally I would favour going for the hand cranked option

Whatever way you go, good luck with it.



As for captainbunch88 if it is not getting hot at the end, then you are poking it too far through the fire. metal gets hottest where the heat is greatest, you will have to learn by trial and error where this spot is in every hearth you use. Your fire looks OK as a starter.

Stainless is somewhat harder to work than ordinary steels or wrought iron takes more heat, but you should still be able to melt it in a charcoal forge, and after working it it will cool. How long do you expect it to stay hot? And even a hair drier should have some method of controlling the air flow to the hearth.

There is an unwritten legend about blacksmithing, 'everybody elses work stays hotter longer than yours does' (there its written now) it is not true, but seems to be valid.

[MattBower]

I too am having this problem with my charcoal forge. I can only get the steel to a dull orange. After about 5 hits, it loses all color.

That looks like a pretty hot fire, and your stock seems quite small. Are you working in bright sunlight? That'll completely screw up your perception of color when it comes to hot steel.

It does look like you could perhaps use a little more charcoal on top of the work, though.

[poopdiddly]

That looks like a pretty hot fire, and your stock seems quite small. Are you working in bright sunlight? That'll completely screw up your perception of color when it comes to hot steel.

It does look like you could perhaps use a little more charcoal on top of the work, though.

Yes, it is quite sunny outside. But I only get 5 hits on the steel? I knew it cooled rapidly as you hit it, but that's quick. Guess I have a lot to learn. I will definitely add more charcoal to the top though.

Thanks guys!

[MattBower]

Well, what do you mean when you say you only get five hits? It stops moving under the hammer? Or it just looks too cold to work? What size hammer are you using, and how big is the stock?

BTW, yes, stainless tends to be red hard and wants to be worked hotter than, say, mild steel. That may be contributing to your problem.

[poopdiddly]

Well, what do you mean when you say you only get five hits? It stops moving under the hammer? Or it just looks too cold to work? What size hammer are you using, and how big is the stock?

BTW, yes, stainless tends to be red hard and wants to be worked hotter than, say, mild steel. That may be contributing to your problem.

I mean it looks too cold to work. I did not take into account that I'm outside and it's bright. I'm a noob. What I may think is colorless steel, might still be cherry red or so. It will still move some, but I wound of cracking a piece of the 1/4 stock yesterday while hammering. So I really don't know how far I can push it.

I've been using both 1/4 and 3/8 round stock. For the time being, it's all I have to work with. Also, I'm using a 40oz cross peen hammer.

[ThomasPowers]

Looks like it's on top of the fire not buried into the hot spot---pile the charcoal high!

[Francis Trez Cole]

captainbunch88
Could me using stainless steel have anything to do with it?


captain that would have every thing to do with it stainless heats and cools a lot different than steel do not be a frade to stack on the coal looks like you are using verry little. the problem with a pipe forge is a long fire pot with small opening heating only confined areas.