Timothy Miller Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 I picked this up about a year ago. I had no idea what I had. I thought it was just a no name steel faced cast iron anvil. I weighs about 70 lbs. It seems to have seen very little use. I am not a hard core collector I own about 5 or six anvils. I am a professional smith with about 10 years in the trade. I have read Anvils in America 2 or 3 times. I took this out to Sofa meet this fall, and showed it to Richard Postman. He said it was the first he had ever seen but there is another known in the northwest. He said that mine was unusual because the trademark is on the cutting table. The mark is stamped not cast. I may eventually sell this for the right price but for now I just want to show it off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bentiron1946 Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 Looks like a nice anvil for a silversmith or jeweler, about the right size. Since it is an uncommon brand they wouldn't wear out the logo like a regular blacksmith would. Thanks for sharing the pics of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Miller Posted December 21, 2009 Author Share Posted December 21, 2009 I was told this was the Holy Grail of anvils. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 For who? Most smiths I know would ignore it if they could get a larger anvil of even a common brand for the same money. Not a big "collector's market" in anvils compared to the "users market" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 There is a real collectors market out there, but Thomas is right, its not big. Good luck, but I wouldn't call it an investment. It is a nice example of a unique way of branding an anvil. Thanks for sharing. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Miller Posted December 21, 2009 Author Share Posted December 21, 2009 There are only two known of this brand of anvil. Richard Postman said that this is the only one he has ever seen. In the book he says he could not locate one. He told me the other one is very poor condition. I met a few guys guys at sofa who collect smaller table top size anvils and seem quite devoted to it. I have noticed there seems to be resentment towards anvil collecting from some people. How is it any different from collecting guns or cars. I know some people want them to be dirt cheap but look at it this way. Old anvils are basically hand made by today's standards. They are made with materials and or processes that are no longer used. No body is going to start up a plant making wrought iron or for welding cast iron to steel. Then take years to learn all of the processes and skills necessary to make a good quality anvil. What would that anvil sell for $5000 or something like that. Also you can buy a decent starter anvil for $200 $300 bucks and turn around and get you money out of it just by listing it on eBay. What other thing can you do that with. And you can make a living with one. If anything old anvils are too cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blitzsmith288 Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 hello that is a very nice anvil I am new to smithing and looking for an anvil and was wondering because your from long island too were do you think i could find a decently priced anvil b/c i have been looking for a while but had no luck thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWCarlson Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 I wonder how many are around that have just had their stamp worn down to unreadable? Good luck fetching a fine price for it if you end up selling it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Einhorn Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 There are only two known ... How is it any different from collecting guns or cars. ..... Everyone needs a hobby, collecting stuff is as good as any. Although I would suspect that thimbles, dolls, bottles and toy trains would be easier to display and find room for. I guess that people like myself are just plain selfish in preferring to be able to find affordable tools for our hobbies that are within our limited budgets. If a person with limited finances wanted to acquire a car or a sporting gun they could likely be able to purchase a decent used one without competing with collectors since gun and car collectors tend to collect only certain makes and models thus only driving up the prices on those selected makes and models. Peace be with you. Enjoy your rare anvil. Unfortunately this forum tends to be mostly populated with folks whose interest is hammering iron, not collecting anvils, cars, guns, toys or thimbles, so expecting excitement about collecting from participants on this forum might be a bit misplaced, sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bentiron1946 Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 I can see his point about saving it for posterity. Like he said they ain't making them any more so maybe some of these old rare anvil makers ought to be saved for future generations. Remember the Tucker automobile? I met his son, a real snot of a fellow, but he had a whole hoard of Tucker parts saved just for that purpose, for the future generations(and to make a pile of money) but he could have used them all up at rather quick pace for quick cash now. I suppose that is why some people collect old tools, they just ain't making them anymore and somebody got to save them for the future.(Am I repeating myself?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 I can't afford to collect cars, and the weapons I own are not considered an investment because they can depreciate through no fault of mine, even though I have them put up properly. I also believe in using what I own. That extends to my wife's heirloom furniture too. Those have been mostly relegated to guestroom duty, but are being used and not simply "put up." Repairs are made as necessary and by a competent (admittedly retired) professional who has copied many period pieces of furniture. When the usable life of these pieces has passed, we will look for a buyer who can afford to NOT use them as furniture. I respect that you have the resources and taken the time to preserve this piece of history for others. I hope that when you decide to sell, you are able to find a like-minded buyer who has the resources to offer a fair price as a piece of history Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Miller Posted December 21, 2009 Author Share Posted December 21, 2009 I hammer iron six days a week at my shop. It would be worth it to me to pay 1500 for a 325 lb Hey Budden in good condition because its what pays the rent for me and I would need it if I did not have one. If I came in to work tomorrow and all of my anvils were gone I would pay top dollar for a new one in a heart beat. A hobbiest doesn't need an anvil he or she just wants one. It took me over two years to find my first anvil now I run into them every few months. I buy them and usually resell them to people show up at my shop looking for an anvil. I usually just mark the up 15% to 20% just to cover my time. I do this because I know how hard it is to find anvils. I have 4 employees that all to some degree have smiting ability. Of the 6 I have 3 of the anvils I have see daily use. Of the ones I don't use one is an old mouse hole form about 1820 or so. The face beat to hell. I bought because it is just a beautiful object and it reflects a lifetime or more of blacksmith work. This has a lot of meaning to me personally as a blacksmith. Another is the Sampson witch is too small for me to use and I look at it as an antique. The third is a 2 horn Fisher that belonged to my first teacher who passed last year not sure was I am going to do with it. I have had some very serious offers from dealers for this anvil. If you cant afford a 200 to 300 for an anvil just beat on a hunk of RR track until you can save enough of your pocket change to buy one. You might luck into one for less but you want to pound iron right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Miller Posted December 21, 2009 Author Share Posted December 21, 2009 I did not pay very much for this. I did not know what it was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstermetal Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 I think these guys are being rough on you... There are plenty of people out there who are not only anvil collectors but blacksmith tool collectors in general.. I have a collection of tools I don't use, I find them interesting and fun to display... Hard to come by or one of a kind tools are that much more fun... If you where serious about selling it I personalty know two anvil collectors here on the west coast who would go gaga for your anvil... and im sure pay enough that you could buy just about any working anvil you wanted... I think what you have is worth a couple grand easy... maybe more.. Not that I know but I have seen anvils that are less interesting sell for more... I saw a 750lb anvil that came out of a steel yard that was destroyed fetch $3000... If it would have been in good shape it would have brought $5000-$6000.... And I can guaranty you it wouldn't be sitting on a stump in some ol boys smithy... Alot of the "good ol boys" complain about collectors running up the price... but they seem to think its ok to take the $2000 that a nice 450lb Trenton fetches when it comes time to sell..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Einhorn Posted December 21, 2009 Share Posted December 21, 2009 ....A hobbiest doesn't need an anvil he or she just wants one. ....... If you cant afford a 200 to 300 for an anvil just beat on a hunk of RR track until you can save enough of your pocket change to buy one. ..... Wow, I really appreciate being straightened out. Thank you for venting and sharing your view of hobbyists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Miller Posted December 21, 2009 Author Share Posted December 21, 2009 Talk to me when you cant pay your mortgage with out using an anvil to make money that is need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Einhorn Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 Talk to me when you cant pay your mortgage with out using an anvil to make money that is need. Only talk to you after I become a professional? I apologize for being a hobbyist expressing a few humble observations.http://www.iforgeiron.com/forum/f7/what-does-customer-service-mean-you-16326/#post152236 :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horseshoer1983 Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 (edited) Talk to me when you cant pay your mortgage with out using an anvil to make money that is need. i can talk that talk then my friend. past 7 allmost 8 years a anvil has been a part of what pays my bills. hobbyist or fulltime iron beater i see no difference my self. Edited December 22, 2009 by horseshoer1983 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timothy Miller Posted December 22, 2009 Author Share Posted December 22, 2009 I have no problem with hobbyists I help them when ever I can. I have literally given away tons of drops of steel. Stayed late to show them a thing or two at the forge. A few months ago I gave a champion cast iron forge with a 400 blower and anvil #110 hey budden to a very earnest young smith who kept coming by and asking to learn stuff. This person turned me on to a very large forging job that kept me busy for months. But the idea that there should be some code of ethics that governs collecting tools is preposterous. The item is worth what the buyer is willing to pay for it. no more no less. I even have a length of RR track that I keep cutting pieces off of that I give away to people. who cant afford a real anvil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horseshoer1983 Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 i think the problme entails the fact that you came on here sounding like a collector. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstermetal Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 I don't want to get drug into a war about this but might I suggest we are all on this fourm because of our love of the craft, the tools or maybe even just the idea of blacksmithing. It takes everyone. The sole occupation smith, the anvil nut and the hobbiest to make it all work and further our craft. You know I don't know how you all feel about Richard Postman but if he would have had the attitude an anvil was an an anvil, a tool and nothing more. We wouldn't even be having this conversation because no one would know that this relic is one of two known. It would end up destoyed under the hammer of some beginer because it's size makes it unworthy. Maybe to you that's just as well but part of my craft is to value tradition and roots and protect and preserve the rare tools of the past. I think it should be in the hands of someone who values and reguards it as the historic artifact that it is. What if it was the last Bradley or beaudery? Would you say to h e double toothpicks with tradition. It's a tool and nothing more? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njanvilman Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 I find it interesting how a member showing off a rare anvil digressed into a discussion about collecting vs using. I personally have no problem both using and collecting. Those of you who have read my story of how I became involved with the preservation of the Fisher & Norris artifacts have applauded my efforts. When photos of my Museum collection were posted, I received nothing but praise(and envy). I do not see how anyone can criticize anyone for what they care to do or not do. I see myself as a caretaker for all of the anvils and artifacts. I have not figured out what will happen to it someday, but I hope somehow it can stay together. I am involved with this due also to Mr. Postman's book. It has had an impact much bigger than he could have imagined. True, prices for anvils have escalated in the last ten years. But many rare and unusual pieces have been preserved and given a provenance because of his work. If I had never read his book in 1998, I would never had knocked on the factory door in Trenton. All of the artifacts that I preserved would have been trashed. NJanvilman, resting after a day forging on a 300 lb Fisher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bentiron1946 Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 ..........oops Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Salvati Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Were I an anvil collector in the purest sense of the word in that I would collect but not use them, I would gladly pay quite a sum for an anvil with only a couple known to exist, or can be verified with the maker's mark to exist. I think most blacksmiths are anvil collectors, hobbyists too. If someone owns more than one or two anvils can they honestly say they use all they're anvils everyday? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricRollerskate Posted December 7, 2013 Share Posted December 7, 2013 Just picked this 128 lb Samson in a trade. I didn't know what it was until...well now. I guess it will be moved in doors, lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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