forgemaster

Just had Hammered at Moonies weekend gone, you better believe it he had to pull the valves out of the Anyang to clean the bores up again, note to any one else, do not use a cylinder hone to clean the bores of where your valves go, on your anyang, little pieces of the honing stone will break off as they go past the ports and drop down into the port, and they take a long time and much fussing to get them out again, don't ask the Moon how he knows this now. I reckon either a flap wheel in a die grinder or a swizzle stick with some emery cloth in the electric drill would have worked better, and with no broken stones to fall down into the ports. Phil

John to embed videos on IFI, find Grant Sarvers channel on youtube (nakedanvil) he shows in step by step mode how to embed youtube vids here, its that simple even a knuckledragger like me could work it out. Even though Grant is gone for a few years now, he's still teaching us from beyond the grave. Phil

If Moonie was there we could light the durie of of moonies bit of round bar he has got to red hot by hitting it with a hand hammer.

Ok another one. This is today in our workshop, its to show how by driving the hammer in drive and still driving it much like you would a steam hammer, Pete our Friday guy can get a short dead blow from the 5cwt clear space. The reason why we want a short dead blow in this instance is because if you have a long stringy blow it will tend to spin the ring on the podger, making it very hard to forge as you are not able to define where the next hammer blow is to fall. You can see that he is pushing the handle forwards as the hammer die just leaves the job to come up and lets the handle off as it starts its downward movement ready for the next blow, sort of like when you were a kid and someone played ready,,,, steady,,,,,, stop!!!!!. He is basically setting the valves in the hammer to do the opposite of what you would normally want them to do, at the same stages in each stroke of the hammer, ie normally you don't want a dead choking blow and you don't normally want the hammer to only lift 1 1/2 inches between blows, but it is usefull if you can make the hammer do this on demand, hence driving in this fashion. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wYrVKmJzZbo&feature=youtu.be

Hi Guys I've just embedded a youtube video of the 40cwt clear space forging/punching some ring blanks in the steam hammer thread, hey I may as well put it here too,Done, that's easier: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FcZ3GuvsJ0&feature=youtu.be Note that the hammer driver drops the hammer into single blow hold down (grip) to hold the job while the manipulator gets another grip as they are rolling the punch out. Immediately before the hammer goes back into drive, you can hear a definite choofff of air as the hammer dumps excess air before it returns to automatic drive mode and they start forging again. These guys are driving the hammer without the stop in (the stop is to prevent the hammer from going into single blow from automatic (drive)) this is so they have a fluid change from drive to single blow in order to grip the job as you can see them doing here. If you watch the hammer driver at about 41 seconds you can see him with his left hand pull the stop out of the hammer and flick it over to the back, while holding the handle in drive up with his right hand, you should also be able to hear the chooof of air at about 56 seconds. When he goes back into drive to knock the punch into the other side of the job, I feel that the driver would have dropped the stop back into place, to stop the handle going back to single blow again.

OK we've come up with some footage of the big fella actually hitting something, (not a real good video it was shot with a phone) but not that bad either, Watch the skill of the guy driving the manipulator, my mate says it normally only takes the young guys 2 days to get good on them, he reckons "if they are good on those stupid computer games they are good driving a manipulator too". Note also how the hammer driver drops the hammer back into single blow hold down while the manipulator gets another grip as they are rolling out the punch. These guys drive the hammer without the stop in (the stop prevents the hammer from going out of automatic drive mode) so as they can move fluidly between drive and single blow. This crew of guys normally are working on a 15cwt clear space, but they have jumped in on the 40 while the 40 crew is getting another heat on their jobs, reason being they can take 3 or 4 heats to get these punched and rolled out on the 15 or they can jump in between heats on the 40 and get that part of their jobs done in one heat. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FcZ3GuvsJ0&feature=youtu.be

The clear spaces having this bonnet directing the air and connecting the valving top to the crankcase is one reason why they are quieter than the inslides hammer especially when they are in "hold up"position, the 1cwt massey in slides especially emits a high pitch screetch when it is in "hold up",(ie single blow mode holding the ram at the top of the stroke). John N I notice when ever I have to pull any of our hammers apart that they are all stamped with their part No on all components, often along with an identifying stamp which seems to me to be a stamp that the fitter building it may have added. Would that indicate that Masseys were built essentially by one fitter or one team of fittters per each hammer who would see it throught from a pile of castings forgings etc to test running the finished hammer or were they built more along the lines of a Ford Motor car, as in one bloke only does one part of the assembly then it goes to another tradesman who does the next stage etc, in a assembly line setup.

The exhaust flows go back inside the crankcase of the hammer, (via that bonnet that is bolted on the top of the hammer covering the valve spool/chamber) same as the hammer draws its air from inside the crankcase as its oily and mostly clean, there is a big port at the back bottom of the hammer so that it can all breath to the outside through, it is connected to the crankcase via a vertical "cast in" airway. When you put the hammer from single blow into drive you can hear a definite woosh of air out the back breathing port as the hammer dumps excess air. John N the patterns for the masseys castings must have been a work of art, do any still survive?

Woody that's a C frame press, not a hammer. this is Picky my C frame with the manip when it was at BHP Newcastle. Phil

John N I read about a Naval Gentleman of a foreign power who was being shown through the works of Weir pumps back in the old days when they still were in the big business of making reciprocating steam feed pumps with their little patented steam valves and associated shuttle valves and chests, when the naval officer asked the old Scots engineer who was conducting the tour if it was possible to explain to him how their shuttle valve system worked, the old Scots man thought for a second or two and then said "why sure laddie, tis easy, ye see the steam goo's in this here port, blooo's aboot a bit inside here ad then comes ooot this port here laddie, noo did ye have any more questions I can answer for you". Question answered in my opinion. Phil

One other thing I would advocate is that when you make the pockets on the end of the tubes make them long enough so that if you break the head off a bolt there is enough room for the broken head to fall down into the pocket and then still allow you to get the new bolt head into where it needs to go. I have heavy conveyor belt under the standard of our 5cwt, never had a problem with it, also have conveyor under the anvil also not had a problem with it Basically the same setup with our 2cwt alldays too, only it has about 100mm of timber under the hammer its self, on the 2 I tried to set it up to a good height for working but failed miserably I managed to get the height at just the wrong position for my back. A little lower would have been good or a little higher would have also been good. I'm just sort of half stooped at the wrong angle. Its something you probably need to be aware of. I have seen power hammers set up on wooden pads under the anvil set deep into the ground, and 2 baulks of say 14" square hardwood 10 or 12 feet long buried in the floor either side for the hammer itself to bolt to. Worked fairly well, only you don't want the timber to start to rot. This is how the original steam hammer in our workshop was installed while the pit here was still working, (1910 era). We actually had to finish digging out all the timber when we installed our hammers, the 2 upper balks were rotted but the pad under the anvil was still solid. Phil

Woodmiester, the 40 is not in my shop, its at CGCKymon down in Gosford. We only have a 5 clear space installed. If you were to rock up we would have to go and have a look at it though, as well as the forging press at 'Comsteel". Phil

Hans there you go, anything moony or me can say will only be to add to what Jim has said. Phil

Of interest in that footage is that on the 1st and 2nd blow that Pete gives with the 40 you can see the camera shake a little, that is cause the ground shook under me.

Fire away woodmiester, report at will. Yes John you are correct Kymon forge (or CGCKymon now), yeh, the guy who works Fridays for us who is also the guy who you see driving it keeps it in pretty good order, he says its easier to do good work easily with machines that work well and are looked after than to try to do good work with rubbish that is broken and has had the stuffing smashed out of it. You can see that Pete is driving (pumping) the hammer also as he is driving it, that will give you a longer springier blow, he can also make it give dead blows in the same way just by timing the stoke of when he pushes the handle forward, then pulling it back on the up or down stroke depending on what he needs the hammer to do. One more reason why I'd like to get him here full time. Phil

Yours was only a baby Androo, a mere 30cwt,

Hey Farmweld Just put some footage of the 40cwt into the thread about steam hammers in this section. Its also on youtube on my channel you could search for "40 cwt massey hammer" Phil

For those of us that are power hammer, massey hammer nut/weirdos I have taken some footage that you all may wet your pants over. 2 ton massey clear space, (biggest clear space Massey made) When you have someone say "oh so and so has the biggest powerhammer made", you can say," was it as big as this" Be warned there is a rude word uttered in the video, (was not my doing) if you are to watch this around sensitive ears I'd turn the sound off. Its not really obvious but still. (mods if you can edit it out in here (IFI) feel free)

It seems like every time almost that we have hammered at Moonies we have to take his An yangs apart and clean the burned up crud and glaze from his valves etc, he never seems to have a problem with them, but maybe its just the interval or maybe he perseveres with it in the knowledge that Phil will be down next month and he will take these apart and clean it all for me. Seems as John said to come from the heavier oil, we as John suggested also wipe it all out with dieso. Phil

If I come to brisvegas I am under strict instruction from the war office to stay with the outlaws. Thanks however for the invite. (inlaws at Oxley and green mountain/Springwood). I'll shoot you a email anyway, when I am coming.

PS, the nest of hammers is Phil's back yard! Yes, I may now have more hammers than the moon, if not its getting pretty d close. He does however still have the anvil market pretty well cornered. Phil

What was Drewy trying to finish that he started at Eveleigh, was it by any chance his apprenticeship. (Just joking Drewy, couldn't resist the opportunity). Starlo says G'day too. Phil

1.7 ton Andrew. Phil

have to see what can be organised, getting a trailer at the right price that can carry the massey is going to be the catch. Will we be in the open or can we get under a roof, (my basil cell carcinomers aren't getting any smaller), be a lot more interest if there is shelter. Phil

I say go for it, if it doesn't work, then you have the experience to not make the same mistake again. You don't know until you try.