Shade 3 flip up clip on lens for forge work

[ptree]

I am in from the shop, and tried out the flip up shade 3 clip ons. I am pleased. They match my mild avaitor style safety glasses in lens shape almost exactly. They do help with looking into a welding fire. I made a bending fork for the anvil hardy. First bent some 3/4" round in half, then fagot welded about an inch. Then cut and added a 1/4" thick scab to each side to make enough metal to fill the hardy hole. The loose scab plates take a fair amount of fiddling in the fire. The shade 3's helped as my eyes were able to see the colors better instead of being dazzled. I did note that the green lens made for a different color at weld temp, but I adapted right away. I like them. I also fired up the gas forge and heated and straightened some heavy spring stock. Again the lack of dazzle from the forge was helpful.

I did brush the lens by accident with a dirty gloves hand and left a big smear of grit and dust. No biggee, just went on and when i came in did the lens wash as one should always do with a plastic lens to preserve the scratchfree surface. The proper way is to wet the lens, with a half drop of liquid soap gently scrub the lens with your fingers and rinse free. Use a clean towel or scrap of tee shirt to dry. These lens are no hard coated so some small care will keep the lens in good shape.

Remember these are to be worn over safety glasses as these are a shade, not an impact lens.

I feel that I can reccomend these to anyone who wishs a shade three flip up lens to clip on their safety glasses. And at less then $9.00 plus shipping a deal compared to the phillips lens on the internet.
Contact Mike Morrison at Hagemeyer at 502-961-xxxx and ask for AOSAFETY Pn 40427-00000. The take major cards and ship UPS.

And I got the sample clip ons for doing the test

 

 

phone number not working

[Steve Sells]

What did this testing cover? what was the measurement of IR light entering the eyes? As Dr JPH can attest, and as already covered in another thread, a normal welders lens is not the best choice for forge welding. When dark glasses are worn the eyes dilate and therefore allow in even more IR light than no shades would have. This can allow more burning to the retnas of the eyes.

IR filtering is a good thing to think about, Dydidium or Rose1 is what my Dr told me to get for smithing. Check with your eye doctor and see, before damage occurs.

Edited January 18, 2009 by steve sells

[ptree]

Didyium is for sodium flare when working glass and is the wrong wave lenght. The polycarbonate that is used in lens of this and safety glasses is very good at filtering UV. These are as are welding lens shaded to stop IR.
The wavelenghts of metal at forging temps is the same as metal at welding temps.

I can attest that after working with these today, I do not have the after images of bright spots that I get when not using a shade.

I have some issues with believing that a lens designed to shade for IR, such as a welding lens will cause this issue.

[son_of_bluegrass]

From my research, Dydidium does not block IR. I can't speak for Rose1. But the latest ANSI standard for welder's lenses requires IR blocking. So if the lens meets or exceeds the current ANSI standard it blocks IR (as well as UV). I used to have absorbtion spectra for various lenses from when I was researching and from what I remember a shade 3 welders lens is a good way to go. Since it was more than a year ago that I did my research, I'd have to find most of the info again if someone wanted the info but I think I linked to some on-line sites in another thread on this board (I know I did on one of the boards I frequently read).

ron

[ptree]

The standard wear for heaters in every commercil forge shop I have ever been in was Shade 3 welders green lens. The heaters are the guys who load the forges and pull the hot billets out to pass to the hammerman. The heater will end up looking into the forge several hours a day, 200 days a year for years.

The flip ups i tested are marked as ANSI Shade 3.

[TASMITH]

ptree is correct about the heaters in forge shops. My last place of employment was a closed die forging shop making auto parts and all the heaters and hammermen wore the #3 welders green lenses. They forged parts at 2250 F and spent 7 hours a day staring into the LARGE billet heating furnaces without ANY ill effects at all.

Terry

[Ten Hammers]

I was warming the welding helmet yesterday. Inside the forge hood ( coal coked ). I happened to glance throught the automatic lens at the fire. PERFECT welding heat look. THe coal is marginal quality and the fire was a tired fire from 5-6 hours of use. Warm helmet is nice on a cold day.

[Steve Sells]

That's good to hear, I was falsely under the assumption we needed at least a shade 5 for IR. I fear many using improvised safety gear (sun glasses etc) that's why I asked, as A/O and forges have different outputs of intensity and spectrum.

The ROSE1 is what I have from advise of my eye doctor, according to his chart of filters. The Dydidium does not have the same amount of IR protection, as its rated to about half that of these Rose1. http://www.auralens.net/m2_glassworker.cfm

Edited January 19, 2009 by steve sells

[ptree]

As an industrial safety and environmental guy, With years of forge shop experience, I can assure you that the standard in industry for forges is shade 3. These are also used in steel plants and foundries as well.
A rated shade with an ANSI stamp means it is the real deal. Just as real safety glasses are stamped ansi Z87, or Just Z87. Prescription safety glasses are also stamped on the frames and the lens must be marked with the makers mark. Some of mine were marked where you held them up to the light and the mark appeared when you tiled to the lens. Others, such as the ones I currently wear have the markers mark stamped into the lens at the top outside corner.

If you are welding, OSHA has a nice shade cart in the standard that is a great guidline for what shade to use with different processes and amperages and tip sizes for o/A.

While the o/a is at a slightly higher temp, I do not think it is enough to warrent a warning re what lens to wear versus a forge. The forge metal is usually just under liquidus and the refractory is at incandescent heat. The Shade 3's will suffice

[DKForge]

So forgive the question but just to confirm... the Shade 3 lens is used when forge welding because you need to look into the fire to gauge color vs. other blacksmithing when you normally pull your piece out of the fire to check for color? Or are you wearing the Shade 3 for all of your forging?

[Steve Sells]

we weld at higher temps than when general forging, so the IR light emitted can damage our eyes. Though its a good idea to always wear safety glasses, why not get them coated with some form of Infrared protection? note there is ligglt Ultra Violet light form forges, but Polycarbonate lenses are a natural filter for UV anyway.

[johnptc]

nice thread.......

is the consensus that #3 is the best overall for blocking IR ??? so much welding (electric) is about UV I havent found many references to blocking IR which is my concern.

[triw]

I like the clip on Idea do they have a web site to show the different shapes or do they have just one shape? Thanks William

[ptree]

Just one shape, a mild avaitor style. Shade 3 is the industrial standard for folks working with forges.

[son_of_bluegrass]

The darker the shade the more IR and UV that is blocked. But the darker the shade the more visible light that is blocked as well. I've tried shade 5, and it may be suitable for a really bright shop, but blocks too much visible light for my shop. Shade 3 is considered to block enough IR to provide adequate safety. So it is a trade off between seeing what you're doing and blocking potentially harmful parts of the spectrum.

ron

[M. Demetrius]

I was told for torch welding (and presumably forge welding) that green shade 4 is safe, too. Were they telling me rightly? That's what I bought, on the recommendation of the welding supply guy.

I wear glasses, and these safety/color glasses fit on just fine over my glasses. It's hard to see at night working at the forge, though, because once I look away from the fire, everything is very dim. Should I light the area more with regular light to overcome this?

I also have a full face shield in 4. In some ways, especially when it's hot weather (Texas) that is nicer, because I can be shielded and then bare face for a breeze with just one little adjustment.

[RcRacer]

I see several posts where the shade is referenced as the primary attribute for selecting protection. This is not true. The medium of the safety glass or polycarbonate in most cases IS the filtering medium. You can have clear lenses that filter all of the harmful UV and IR that is emitted in the wave lengths that we experience in forging and welding. The shade only serves the purpose of comfort and is a matter of preference. ( or for color recognition purposes ) This may not have been true with older glasses and older glass coated for welding filters but safety eyewear today ( brand named and designed for the purpose of welding ) has ANSI ratings that specify the level of UV/IR filtering. Adjustable auto darkening welding helmets are a good example. At their lightest shade ( usually 3 or 4 ) they still provide full protection. The shade that you select is for your comfort and ability to observe the puddle. Most safety glasses with clear lenses can be used when plasma cutting ( if you can stand the brightness ). I'm not saying it's good because eye fatigue is another issue if you don't wear a proper shade but it is UV/IR safe. I guess my point is that you should do a little more homework before selecting glasses of some shade. Steve Sells was right when he said that a shaded glass with no UV/IR protection is worse because your dilated pupil will let in more harmful light than normal. That's just my 2 cents ;)

[son_of_bluegrass]

Can you give a brand/model of a clear face shield that has ir protection. When I was looking I couldn't find anything clear that specified a rating for IR, I did see some that gave the level of UV protection. I'm not interested in a autodarkening helmet, just a face shield.

thanks.

ron

[RcRacer]

I'm not sure which brand ... AOSafety ... maybe ... but any pair of polycarbonate lens will protect from UV and polarized lenses will filter the longer wave lengths of IR frequencies. Unfortunately, most polarized lenses are tinted.

Let me clarify ... even though you can probably find protection in a clear lens, you probably want a small amount of shade for comfort and to eliminate eye fatigue. All I was trying to point out in my previous post is that lenses having a shade rating does not imply that it has protection.

[RcRacer]

FYI ... Just checked at work this morning ... Western Safety offers safety glasses with IR protection that are 2.0 shade.