Rose flower project

[Dillion Brian Grant]

So earlier this year I bought the rose flower project from kens custom iron and I cant for the life of me figure out how to forge it any advice would be greatly need this figured out as soon as possible 

[Irondragon Forge ClayWorks]

I'm pretty sure the Peace Flower instructions on Ken's web site will apply to the Rose too.

[Daswulf]

On blanks I cut out from a template I was given by a friend, I start (after cut out) by drilling a hole in the center of the petal rounds. You could hot punch round holes, or square holes that would hold better without wanting to twist on the stem. Then I forge a stem making a little bulb at the top and taper the end that the petal rounds go on square, leaving enough that i can pein(rivet) the petals once on. 

You could use a crosspein hammer to texture the petals if you like before attaching them to the stem.

You'll put the star piece on first, then largest to smallest petal round.

Personally I use OA torch and modified needle nose pliers to shape my petals.

Then forge my leaves and weld them onto the stem. 

Have you tried contacting them for instructions? 

[Dillion Brian Grant]

1 hour ago, Irondragon ForgeClay Works said:

I'm pretty sure the Peace Flower instructions on Ken's web site will apply to the Rose too.

Looking into this now

 

 

56 minutes ago, Daswulf said:

Have you tried contacting them for instructions? 

yes never heard back 

[George N. M.]

Dillon:  In addition to what Daswulf said I will add a few thoughts:

1.  You have all the parts but the stem.  You probably want a bulb under the bud part (the star shaped piece).  You can either upset some 1/4" stock or start with 3/8" or 1/2" stock which gives you the bulb diameter and then you can forge down and draw out the stem to about 1/4" diameter.

2.  At the end of the bulb isolate and forge out a peg about 3/16" in diameter.  This is the rivet stem that all the other parts sit on.  I'd make the peg about 3/4" to 1" long.  You can cut some off if it is too long.

3.  Drill 3/16" holes in the center of all the pieces.

4.  This is optional:  Some people like it and some don't.  Using a cross pein hammer or a dull chisel make close spaced lines or flutes radially on the edges of all the petals (at right angles to the outer edge of the petals.

5.  Starting with the smallest petal piece start dishing and folding up the petals.  Each individual petal on a piece will overlap its neighbors.  On the larger petal pieces you will want to start flaring out the edges of the petals.  Each of the petal pieces has to fit over the next smaller one.  You will have to do some fiddley fitting to get the whole stack to fit tightly.  You can use a small nut and bolt through the holes to help get things lined up and tightened.

6.  Dish the center of the bud star to conform to the curvature of the bottom of the largest petal.  Then, bend the points of the star down, away from the petals.

7.  Once you have the pieces all fitting together the way you like, and this is one of the hardest parts of the project, you have to rivet over the peg on the end of the stem.  Rehearse this step cold until you have it down pat.  You may want to cushion the jaws of your vise so that you don't mar the stem below the bulb with pieces of leather or copper. Then, get the peg quite hot in the forge, quickly move to the vise, catch the stem in the vise (peg up), quickly place the flower parts over the peg, put a  punch down through the top of the flower against the peg and mushroom the top of the peg down forming a rivet head.  If you have  rivet setter (a punch with a hollow, rounded tip) it will look nicer.  Basically, all you are doing is mushing down the top of the peg enough to hold all the petal parts in place.  Some folk my be able to reach down into the flower with a welder and put a weld in place of the rivet head to hold everything together.

8. Adjust the petals hot or cold to your liking.

9.  Weld the leaf to the stem with either gas, electric, or forge welding. And clean up the weld with a file or fine grinder.

I have a hard time believing that there are not You tube videos on how to do this.

Before you start, get a real rose and study it.  Note the 5 fold symmetry and how the petals expand and spread from the center out.

"By hammer and hand all arts do stand."

[anvil]

Nice how-to, George

[Daswulf]

Here is basically what my stems end up as after forging. (Lost some photos in transferring pictures from my phone) the part the petal rounds go on gets trimmed and peined/riveted one they are on.

Pictures I have after the petals are riveted on the stem. Alternate the gaps in the petal rounds. 

one thing to mention in my process (using an oa torch and needle nose pliers)  is to start bending up and curving the petals with one of the small center ones then work in a circle either way you like doing the next petal. Have some water handy to cool the pliers. 

Here is an image of one after. Have images of more of the process but not on my phone atm. This one I curled the edges over after bending up and curving.

This is one I didnt curl. 

 

Hope some of this is at all helpful. 

[ThomasPowers]

I square the end of the stem and use a modified cut masonry nail to punch square holes in the flower petal pieces.

[George N. M.]

Daswulf's method of assembling flat, riveting or welding the central piece, and then bending up avoids the problem of having to rivet down through the center of the flower.  You can also get the smaller petal pieces curled in tighter because you don't have to leave a hole in the center.  I may try it on my next rose and see if I like his way better.  I can see advantages to each method.

"By hammer and hand all arts do stand."

[Daswulf]

There are many ways to make them, and no way is wrong if it works. 

George, I've had a few before to where after bending all the petals they loosened up on the stem. To fix that just heat the center, bend them out of the way then a bit more riveting with a longer punch. Then rebend them back in. It's harder to heat then and I had to basically cold rivet it but it was just snugging up. One I did mig weld because it was stubborn. If you start with good tight fit and riveting from the get go they work out well.