Jura T Posted February 20, 2008 Share Posted February 20, 2008 I went to see a Soviet Union made power hammer today (pictures of it below). It looks like a Beche clone. The main axel was stuck as it hasn't been used for a while so I couldn't try it. I will go back on Saturday and try to get it running. Is there anything specific (commonly known problems, areas prone to cracks etc.) that I should try to check? Is there any info on these type of hammers available somewhere? What are the levers on the side used for? I don't speak/read any russian, but I assume that the info on the side of the machine says that it is a 50kg (110 lb) machine with 225 bpm and 220mm (8.7 inch) ram travel. I don't even have a workshop at the moment (though I'm planning to build one this year), but it is a good start to find a hammer first :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philip in china Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 We have a russian woman teaching mathematics here. I will get a translation for you before the day is through I hope. Happy lantern festival to you all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philip in china Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 1st 3 lines factory name and address Then: Power Hammer Model # 4127 Serial # 5568 Year of production 1972 Strokes/minute 225 Weight of hammer 50Kg Height of working zone xxxmm Total weight of hammer xxxxx Kg I don't suppose you have learnt anything from that but it is good to know that the details are confirmed. Would you like it translated into Chinese? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jura T Posted February 21, 2008 Author Share Posted February 21, 2008 Yes, it was nice to get a confirmation. My chinese is as bad as my russian, so no need for the translation . Xie xie! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imagedude Posted February 21, 2008 Share Posted February 21, 2008 For all the powerhamers you could wish for, see:PRESSTRADE - Presssenhandel GmbH They also sell presses too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valentin Posted February 22, 2008 Share Posted February 22, 2008 well the levers on the side are 1 it's conected to the foot pedal so that u can control the stroke from the hand also. 2nd one has 2 position hammer head up-when u start the hammer the hammer head get's puled up and when u push the pedal it strikes down hammer head down-when u start the hammer the head sits down and when u push the pedal it get's up and then down i can;t see for shure in the pic but mine has a 3d one at the oil pum to greeas the cylinders(i can't see it in the picture ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jura T Posted February 23, 2008 Author Share Posted February 23, 2008 There is a third one, but that acts like some sort of lock for the first one. There is nothing that would look like as something to be used for lubricating the piston. There is only a oil reservoir with two pipes leaving from it. There might be an oil pump somewhere inside the hammer? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jura T Posted February 23, 2008 Author Share Posted February 23, 2008 Today I tried to get the hammer running for some time. It seems to be stuck in every possible way. We (me and he current owner) were able get the main axle/camshaft to rotate by using a long iron bar. So now it idles just fine, but the piston/foot pedal system is completely stuck. I need to go back and treat every moving part with some anti-rust lubricant. It may take some time, but in the end I will make it to run... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nonjic Posted February 23, 2008 Share Posted February 23, 2008 I think it will be a vacuum oiler (ie no pump) The middle lever is an air bypass to reduce the starting load. I would pull the covers off and tip some oil down the bores. The big end bearing on the Con rod will be grease lube, take a grease gun and give it a few shots. Similarly there will be a grease point where the crank exists the cylinder by the flywheel. If the valves are 'frozen' with rust there might be 2 covers on the other side of the cylinder. Remove all bolts, take the covers off and using a picece of wood drift the valves out, emery, oil & refit. Make sure you mark everthing up so it goes back together the same ! - if you loose the valve positions your into a lot of hastle. I think there will be a spring loaded ' clack' valve in the bottom valve - check this is free Its sometimes a good idea to buy it before repairing it, the price might go up once its running! hope this helps some! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jura T Posted February 24, 2008 Author Share Posted February 24, 2008 I think it will be a vacuum oiler (ie no pump) That makes sense. The big end bearing on the Con rod will be grease lube, take a grease gun and give it a few shots. Similarly there will be a grease point where the crank exists the cylinder by the flywheel. Yes, there is a grease nipple close to the flywheel which we gave a few shots. I didn't notice any other nipples on the hammer. I opened the oil bath cover and there seems to be plenty of grease where the con rod and camshaft meet. If the valves are 'frozen' with rust there might be 2 covers on the other side of the cylinder. Remove all bolts, take the covers off and using a picece of wood drift the valves out, emery, oil & refit. I think there will be a spring loaded ' clack' valve in the bottom valve - check this is free. I did actually open the two covers. The spring loaded valve was free and shiny. There seemed to be a bit of rust on the other two, there are probably also frozen. I'll try drive them out the next time. Any advice on how to actually do this as you have to pull them towards you? Whit some sort of a inertia hammer? Its sometimes a good idea to buy it before repairing it, the price might go up once its running! That is a good advice. Though I don't think it'll be the case with this one. I've know the owner for some years and he isn't actively selling the hammer. I asked him whether he'd be willing to sell it and he sayed why not, if someone pays the same amount of money he payed for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mende Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 I think you should get a few friends . .or just free up some time . .take it apart. . sand blast it, repaint it . .oil everything up ..and THEN start it up. .You risk damaging it further if you just squirt grease on some rusted parts and plug it in. Plus. .Having it polished and painted will make you feel a lot better about it. .and will make us more jealous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nonjic Posted February 24, 2008 Share Posted February 24, 2008 there should be 2 covers on the other side of the hammer that you can take off, then tap (push) the valves out in the direction of hand levers (ie, when they are out you should be able to see right through the cylinder !) Free the ram with a block and tackle / fork truck / hydraulic jack or similar (ie push it up!) then put some heavy matting on the bottom die, if it starts rouge hammering it will take some of the shock out of it ! - Never sand or shot blast a hammer - 1 little piece of grit will destroy a bore in 30 seconds (and you can never get it all out!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feukair Posted February 28, 2008 Share Posted February 28, 2008 Very cool hammer. This forum is amazing. I havent had much time to post or even read lately but I just wanted to say that. Guy finds old power hammer, labeled in foreign language, gets translations and great advice to get it working from people all over the world.... You guys are all awsome... Lt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jose Gomez Posted February 28, 2008 Share Posted February 28, 2008 True.... It speaks volumes for the type of people that blacksmiths are... that when given the opportunity and a resource like this amazing forum, they will share all of the tricks of the trade, life lessons, and knowledge that they have worked so hard for. Thanks Glenn and everyone else that help to make I forge iron such an amazing resource. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenn Posted February 28, 2008 Share Posted February 28, 2008 Ask a question from Finland and get answers from New York USA, China, Romania, North Wales UK, UK, Severin Romania, Michigan USA, the name plate translated from a photo in Russian by a Russian woman teaching mathematics in China, and you get suggestions on how to get the hammer working. No questions about it, IForgeIron IS a International Blacksmithing site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jura T Posted February 28, 2008 Author Share Posted February 28, 2008 Very cool hammer. This forum is amazing. I havent had much time to post or even read lately but I just wanted to say that. Guy finds old power hammer, labeled in foreign language, gets translations and great advice to get it working from people all over the world.... Lt The power of internet! It is extremely nice to have a forum like this, where people are willing to help you and share their knowledge. In regards of the hammer, I don't have time to go back to work with it right now, but when I have, I will take plenty of anti-rust lubricant and a bottle jack with me. I will try to loosen and prelubricate everything before running it. Thanks for the advices! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philip in china Posted February 28, 2008 Share Posted February 28, 2008 Following those postings I suppose I ought to get some photos of my forge and post them. Just don't ask to look at my work. It is not a pretty sight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valentin Posted February 28, 2008 Share Posted February 28, 2008 You can see here oil pump - Blacksmith Photo Gallery this is my oil pump it's a hand pump looks a lot like yours but both mine and yours are missing something ...and that is a lever used to push and make presure to send oil throw the lines althow the hammer sucks oil i don't think it's compelty without a pump and some reasons that i think this way ... the oil lines are on top of the jar ... oil won't go up when the level is sinking and the second one ... mine is not like this mine has a manual pump ...i'll take a pic of it 2morow ...after beeing replaced and others have a engine pump ... so ... i whoud say some parts are missing from that pump Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jura T Posted February 28, 2008 Author Share Posted February 28, 2008 Valentin, do you see oil going through the glass pipe when the hammer is running? In the one I'm planning to buy, the glass is broken and the owner sayed that oil squirts out through the crack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valentin Posted February 28, 2008 Share Posted February 28, 2008 ok found a pic with it after it has been repaierd. The 2litter plastic bottle is just a cap of the rezervoare ..don't mind it :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valentin Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 yeap there is oil u have to pump until the glas get's ful... mine are also broken and i repleced them with some trasparnt plastic hose Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hofi Posted February 29, 2008 Share Posted February 29, 2008 A Hammer Like That One Was Bought By Jossef Mikke My Freind In Prgue One Year Ago. But The 80 Kg 176# Size For Less Then 2000$. A Very Very Good Hammer!!! Hofi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jura T Posted March 13, 2008 Author Share Posted March 13, 2008 Yesterday I went to work with the hammer again. The ram is now moving. So are two out of three valves. The owner told me that he had freed the valves, but I noticed that actually the pins that connect the lever to the valve axle (the top one) were broken and the valve itself wasn't moving. Next time I'll take a threading tap with me and remove the broken pices, so that shouldn't be a problem. I removed the covers from both sides and tried to drift the valve out (as JohnN suggested). I noticed that the whole valve assembly (valve+sleeve) was moving. Should I drift out the whole thing? Any ideas if the sleeve is in one or two pieces? If it is in two pieces could I run into troubles when the other part gets into the chamber in the middle? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kalevra Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 Hello Minotaur, I read Russian, so if you need any further assistance with the language, etc. feel free to contact me. As luck would have it, I have a Beche hammer and you are right, the hammers are very similar. I will be installing mine in the coming weeks, and it would be fun to compare notes. How did your hammer make it here? cheers, kalevra Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nonjic Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 sounds like those valves are properly seized!!! you do not, under any circustances want to loose the relative position of the valve sleeve (tube). knock it back in and stamp the end of the sleeve with a corresponding point on the frame casting. you then have 2 main options....... drift the whole lot out and soak it in parrafin or similar, then unseize it, then reassemble using your marks for alignment, or I would get 4 really heavy washers and use the tapped holes for the valve cover, with the washers to prevent the tube walking out. then drift the valve out as previous. edit. I would guess the valve sleeve is 1 piece. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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