Appalachian Power Hammer

[ertwdan]

Has any one out there built one of the Appalachian Power Hammers(Rusty, Dusty , Super Rusty) from the plans that they sell. I'm looking at making a junkyard-style hammer and I'm trying to decide if their plans are worth buying or should I look at a hammer like the Anvilfire JYH with a differential for the driver versus the Helve-Hammer style of the Appalachian. If anyone has any experience with building these....let me know...

[anon_smith]

I haven't built one, but I've used one. I think you'd be better off with a home-built air hammer.

[ertwdan]

I don't currently have an air compressor so I'm limited to a mechanical style hammer for the time being.....I'm also a mechanical engineer so I'm a little partial to the rotating machinery

[Glenn]

Go to IForgeIron.com > Blueprints and look at B-0063 Helve Hammer

Plans there for building a HelveHammer. Irnsrgn and others like the design very much.

[elkdoc]

I'm don't know squat about power hammers, but you might want to consider one of Clay Spencer's upcoming powerhammer construction workshops. He's been working to perfect a mechanical hammer design.

I'll PM you with some details that I have.

[SteveA]

I too am looking forward to one of Clay's power hammer workshops. Just saw the picture in the latest Bits. I also have about all the parts gathered up for a Rusty-like hammer, but "real life" has been interfering with all the really fun metal working kind of stuff I had lined up. "Ptree" who posts over on anvilfire (cut that out if I shouldn't say that) built one, I saw it operate last thankgiving and got a very favorable impression.

Steve

[Ed Thomas]

Elkdoc: Can you post the details here? I don't think it would offend anyone, and I have several friends that are interested.

[elkdoc]

Basically, Clay Spencer is refining the old Ray Clontz design for a tire-driven power hammer. All I know is what I gleaned from the recent Appalachian Area Chapter of Blacksmiths newsletter. The hammers are estimated to cost between $800 and $1000 US to build, and it looks like Mr. Spencer will be holding some workshops to build hammers sometime soon. Like I said, I don't know diddly-squat about power hammers, but I have seen one of Clay's inline (roller-blade style) treadle hammers and was more than impressed.

I'm hesitant to post his contact information without his permission, especially since I don't know him. However, if anyone is interested, I guess I can pass along some contact info that was printed in the newsletter via email or private message here on the forum.

[ertwdan]

Thanks for the info... I really wish I could go to some hammer building clinics but NC is over 3 days of driving from where I live......one of the the drawbacks to living up in "God's Country"...it's a long way to anywhere...If you guys hear of anything going on in Northern Minnesota I'll definielt have to try and make it...

[DonS]

I like the simplicity of the hammer that IRNSRGN posted. It appears that you can adjust the stiffness of the spring to allow it to operate properly at any reasonable top design speed. One disadvantage is that the dies will not be parallel for some thicknesses of workpieces, but if you are mostly drawing out, that won't matter much.

I built the Rusty hammer from plans that I bought. Plans are a bit sketchy, but the author claims thats because of the wide range of material people scrounge up.

I rum my 34 pound "Rusty" hammer at 240 beats per minute top speed, but had some trouble adjusting the spring to get it to work. It would be nice to have a soft spring, since that would give plenty of over-travel and die clearance. A soft spring means a lower number of beats per minute since you cannot exceed the resonant frequency of the mass-spring combination and have any kind of control. A stiff spring on the other hand allows higher rpm, and faster strokes with less die clearance (to accommodate thicker workpieces or top tools.) A stiff spring also requires a bit of a counter weight on the flywheel to even out the load on the motor.

I am using a 1 HP motor, and checking the current wih a clip-on ammeter show that it is working at the max rated current, with some spikes as the flywheel rotates. Various spring hammers claim that they will work on a 1/2 HP washing machine motor, but how hard do they really hit, and how many peats per minute? The work delivered is 1/2 M x V squared, so it really depends on the speed of the tup as it strikes the workpiece. I used a video camera with a fast shutter speed to determine that I get about 30-40 foot pounds of work per blow. I analysed Manzer's video of his 50 pound LG and his 100 pound LG and they appear to deliver 80 and 240 foot pounds respectively, so mine is in the right ball park for a 34-pounder I think. The efficiency in terms of motor HP in vs energy delivered to the work appears to be about 25 percent.

If I were to build another one, I would look at the NC junk-yard hammer. After analysing the Rusty hammer, I began to appreciate the elegance of the toggle link in terms of smoother operation and more flexible die clearance. Also less floor space!

I like building mechanical stuff, so I opted for a mechanical hammer. An air hammer does not have enough moving parts for my liking. (The air hammer would be easier to build if you can come up with the $$ for the valves and the compressor.)

Let me know if you want more info. I might have rambled on too long already.

DonS, Edmonton Alberta

[ertwdan]

Thanks DonS
Keep the info coming....it's starting to make me lean towards the toggle link head instead of the Appalachian. Have you guys ever tried the differential/emergency brake - based drive that Anvilfire shows on their JYH. I'm wondering if that might work with the toggle-arm of the NC hammer. DonS if you have a picture of you hammer I'd love to see them as the pictures on the Appalachian site is not all that clear. Is the hammer/slide a piece of square tubing inside square tubing arrangement?
I also agree with you on the mechanical aspect of the hammer...if it's not making noise and present at least one method of getting maimed it's just not that interesting. Besides that the only compressor I can afford is the one's from Canadian Tire and I know that they don't have the service factor to maintain a long session of forging. Please let me know everything you can......as you guys in Edmonton know winter is coming and there's 6 months of darkness to try and keep busy through...

[DonS]

ERTWDAN: Here is a list of specs for my Rusty type hammer-
Hammer weight including die: 34 pounds
Beats per minute max about 240
Motor: 1 HP at 1760 RPM
Small Pulley: 2 inch, turned grove on lathe a bit bigger so it would slip better and to reduce RPM a bit
Large Pulley: 12-3/4 inch two grove cast iron sheave with split hub for 1 inch shaft. Acts as flywheel- about 10 to 15 lb, but is actually a bit too light. Also has about a 8 - 10 lb counterwight. eccentric is a 5/8 inch grade 8 bolt, 3-1/2 inches from center.
Stroke: 7 inches
Gap between dies at rest about 1/2 inch
Overshoot at top at full speed about 3/4 to 1 inch

Main bearings for fly wheel shaft: 1 inch pillow blocks, ball bearing
Bearings to allow spring to rock: 1-1/2 inch pillow blocks, ball bearing
Bearings at bottom of pitman arm: two races of ball bearings to fit 5/8 crank bolt. They are inserted in is short piece of pipe welded to bottom of pitman.
Bearings at top of pitman: a piece of 5/8 id pipe with small oil hole. fits a 5/8 bolt in a bracket clamped to back end of spring.
Bearings at front end of spring: two pieces of 5/8 id pipe rolling on 5/8 bolts.

Spring 38 inch length of 2-1/4 x 5/16 leaf spring, curved, bought new, sandwiched between two 24 inch lengths. leafs are clamped together 10-1/4 inches from center. Adjusted for correct stiffness. I should have made this dimension longer, more like 48 inches but I tried to make it more compact.

Idler is the hub from a small solid tire ballbearing wheel, belt is v-belt, 54 inches long

Dies cut form solid piece of 5 inch dia 4340 quenched and tempered. Die surface is 1-1/5 x 5 inches-- half is flat half is radiused to form combination die. uses two 1/2 inch mounting bolts. top and bottom dies identical.

Anvil is 10 inch dia 11 inches long 245 lb of 4130 steel clamped to base, removable if necessary to move hammer.

Base is 33 x 14 x 1-1/4 plate, 160 lb

Column is 45 inch length of 4 inch square tubing, 1/4 inch wall

Travel of ram is about 9 inches max at top speed, but clearance is 11 inches if things go wrong.

Ram is a 27 inch length of 2 inch square tubing, 1/4 inch wall with a 5 inch dia x 1-5/8 inch disk to mount the upper die. Total weight with die is 34 lb.

Ram is sandwiched between two 12 x 7 inch plates. A 12 ich length of 2 ich square tubing is placed on each side of the ram as a spaces. UHMW pads 2x2x1/4 inch bolted with brass screws to top and bottom of these spacers guide the sides of the ram. A 2x7x1/4 inch strap is located at the top (front and back) and bottom (fron and back) in the " sandwich" to guide the ram front to back. Works good as long as the tubing used for the ram is clean to start with - (no rusty scrap).

I place the whole thing on a trailer to get it up to proper woring height and allow me to store it outside the garage when not in use, but this did not work---too springy even with solid jack stands.

Built a small table out of 20x42x1-1/4 plate and I beam legs. about 400 lb.
Bolted it to that and it works 10x better than on a "soft" stand, but now it has to stay in the garage permanently. The table is just the right size to store the lawn mower under, so I can still get the car in the garage at night.

I had to beef up the mount for the flywheel to keep it from flexing. Don't underestimate the forces on the flywheel and the spring. Guards are recommended- especially at the front in case a piece of the spring breaks off. It will be right in front of your face!

Regrets: I should have used a heavier flywheel- that would make it easier on the electric motor.
I should have made the whole thing a bit longer ie longer spring with a bit more flex.
I should have looked into the NC junk yard hammer more closely. ( I Started to gather parts for one, but was reluctant to tackle the toggle links). If I had gone ahead based only on the picture in Anvilfire, I would have undersized the column and bearing and probably would have had early failure. Found out the actual dimensions after discussion with the builders later.

Have a look in some of the archives or try get ahold of the builders of this unit.

I will try to post a picture of my hammer later, but I have to work out of town for a while.

Am I satisfied with my hammer- yes. I forged a 2-/14 inch shaft down to about 1-1/2 inch square with a short taper at each end to make a bick about 14 iches long. Took several heats, but sure beats pounding it out by hand. I did finish the round and square tapers by hand, and that took longer than drawing out the rough shape on the power hammer.

[ertwdan]

DonS...you are awesome....Thanks for all the specs...This is helping me out when it comes to the design of my own hammer. I had a 30 spring and now I'm definitely going to use a much bigger one. I'm also going to look at the boneyard here at work for a suitably sized flywheel/pulley for the hammer. I think I 'll go ahead and tray and built the Appalacian style....toggle arms are a litttle daunting right now...I look forward to you pictures when you get back off the road......

[Clay Spencer]

Ray Clontz of Charlotte, NC invented this power hammer which uses the emergency spare tire and rim, hub and rear axle from a front drive car. I call it the King of the junk yard hammers. He has given me permission to use his idea to make plans and hammers. It uses a spring and arms linkage similar to a Little Giant.

My version of his hammer is a 50 lb. hammer with a 6" x 36" solid anvil, either round or square, mounted on a 2' x 2' x 1/2" plate base. The rear column is 1/4" wall, 5" square tubing, 6' tall. It weighs 700 pounds and is about 6 1/2' tall. It uses lead in the 4" square hammer head and also for the counterbalance weight. The hammer head guides are ultra high molecular weight polyethylene, a very durable and low friction plastic.

It is driven by a 1 hp, 1750 rpm, single phase, 60 cycle, 120/240 volt, frame 56, (TEFC preferred) electric motor. A flat pulley, 3.5" diameter, is mounted on the motor. The motor is pivoted by the treadle action and rubs against the tire. This clutch provides outstanding control and very high efficiency.
The hammer runs about 270 rpm and can use flat or drawing dies made from 2" diameter axle or spring.

Trailer hubs and axles may be used ( over 1" diameter axles) but must match with spare tire rim holes. They may cost a little more.

There is not a good estimate of cost for building these hammers in a workshop yet. I think the cost will be around $1000, depending on cost of steel and number of people in a workshop. I am not sure how long the workshop will be but we should be able to do the assembly in a 3 day workshop if all the material is on hand and cut to size before we start.

Plans are not available yet but we are working on them.

As of early July, workshops are being planned in south Alabama, Canton, GA, Chattanooga, TN, Tallahassee, FL, Columbia, SC and Birmingham, AL, possibly in Colorado, Ohio and Maine next year.

I sold a tire hammer for $2000 in June and plan to replace my 25 lb. Little Giant with a tire hammer.

I am working on jigs so we can do the assembly in a 3 day weekend - hopefully. First workshop is scheduled for mid September near Dothan, AL.

Clay

[sandpile]

I have built my self a hammer. I later bought a 50 LG. The 50 has been setting here for over a year. I have not got in a hurry to get it up and running, although, all it needs is to fix the treadle.

The reason for not working on the 50 is , the home built hammer works so good, I don't really need the 50.GRIN. My HBH is of a yoke spring and toggle set up.

Having said all of this. If I was building another hammer from scratch. I would use RAY,S(PTPIDDLER) and CLAY,S design. This is the simplest, easyist hammer to build or use, that I have seen. If you scrounge the parts you can come in a way below the $1000.00 mark.

Where to scrounge?? The bigger pieces are in the scrap yard, even if you have to weld several pieces together, for the upright. Front hubs off a bigger car. Connecting rods form the mechnic down the street.

Buy some doughnuts and drop by the scrap yard. Stay and eat your share of the bear-sign. Get acquainted with the people there. You will have great need for them in the future.BOG.

Just some thoughts

Chuck

[Glenn]

Clay,
Welcome to the forum and thanks for your information.
Please keep us informed as to your workshops.
Glenn

[ertwdan]

Thanks for the info ....now you have me thinking...always a dangerous thing to do to a guy who engineers by day and blacksmiths by night....If you have any pictures or even rudimentary sketches of you tire-hammer (other than the ones on Anvilfire) I'd sure love to see them. Perhaps even submit them as a Blueprint here on IForgeIron (see I'm helping Glenn) hmmmmm now it's time to head back to the shop and start sketching.......

[Glenn]

There may be a couple of photos on the PPW hammer in series posted on the opening page of IForgeIron.com

[frogvalley]

The appalachian power hammer, or spring helve hammer, is one of my favorite designs. It reminds me of old style hammers and beam walking engines.

I built one a number of years ago, not from the plans, but from the top of my head, and mine is much bigger, almost 7 feet tall. Springs are from a Jeep CJ 5, unrolled ends and are about 48 in long.

About a 75lb ram. Its slower than other hammers, about 150 top end right now, but while using other power hammers, I never like to run them up to the 350 rating anyway.

You can see it here http://www.frogvalleyforge.com , scroll down to see the hammer and other shop tools. Not shown is our Fairbanks 25#, thats new to us.

Anyway, if you are still considering one of these machines because you like the gracefulness of a helve hammer and the ka-chunk ka-chunk of a mechanical you can contact me.

Mark

[ertwdan]

Thanks Mark...I'd actually been looking at your creation online for something to follow. It is impressive. If you could, I'd love to see more pictures from differnet angles and if you want to share, any "if I could have done something different" stories I would certainly enjoy hearing them. I'm really torn between the tire-hammer and the spring Helve.....decisions decisions.......

[ThomasPowers]

If you do a spring helve paint it up to look like one of those "drinking birds" ...

Thomas

[ertwdan]

I figure that these hammers look a lot like the old walking-beam engines on the old paddle-wheel steam ships.....hmmmmm now if only I had access to a boiler.....