Hammer pad between hammer and foundation

[Ed Thomas]

Hollis (or anybody): Seems like you recommended a hard rubber mat under your Beaudry. Have you used wood? Is there a down side to it? I'm about ready to move the hammer onto the foundation and I'm really leaning to fastening pressure treated 2"x10" (or similar) to the concrete. I'm even considering just a sheet of 3/4" pressure treated plywood. Got any thoughts?

[HWooldridge]

Ed,

I used both. Concrete, then 4x4's tied together with all-thread and one of those thick rubber horse stall mats from Tractor Supply (or equivalent) directly under the hammer.

The work and tools don't bounce as much when the anvil is cushioned and it's probably easier on the hammer.

[Ed Thomas]

Hollis:

Hmmm... I might have to skip the 4x4's because I already poured the pad and that would take the hammer up higher than I'd like. Do you think that the compression and shock absorption of the 2" thick wood isn't adequate? I'll go to 4" if you really think it's a big deal.

The reservation I have with the rubber pad is the mounting bolts. If I use something inherently sproingly like that, don't I need special shock absorbing bolts? I already bought the threaded rod and epoxy and drill bit! If you found it to not be an issue, let me know. In other words, what did you bolt it down with?

Thanks.

[HWooldridge]

Ed,

2" is fine. I planned for 4x4's but don't get yours too high to work on. I am tall and like the hammer up high so my dies are the same height as my anvil, vises, work tables, etc., and I can always work at the same level no matter where I go. This is just my personal preference - I'm not making a blanket recommendation.

All the bolts do is keep it from walking. You don't need to sock 'em down with a 3/4" impact wrench to 200 lbs torque and you don't need vibration isolators. In fact, I think overtightening can put the frame in stress and possibly cause cracking or worse. Mine are often just barely more than finger tight. If one vibrates loose, I just run it back in.

I welded 1" all-thread into the right pattern to a frame of rebar and poured the concrete over it. However, drilled and epoxied will work fine. I have seen several hammers mounted that way and I actually think it's better than my way but I went by an old diagram.

[John Larson]

Ed, I have had excellent luck with 3/4 plywood. I use a corral around the base to keep the hammers from twisting and I let them float. I agree with Hollis about there being no need to tighten floor anchor bolts when the hammer is heavy. Hope the machine runs well. John Larson

[JNewman]

I put 1 1/2" of hardwood under my Massey as which is what my foundation drawing recommended. so far it seems fine.

[peacock]

I use rubber belting under all the hammers I mount. I think the most important reason for cushion is most all or the old mechanicals are cast frame and the parting line ridge runs right down the middle of the frame. If you dont put something under the hammer the base cannot set flat then the hammer will rock and work the bolts loose.
Phil

[Jamesrjohnson]

I use regular 3/4" plywood between the hammer base and my foundation on all of my hammers. It's low cost and have never had a problem. I also build my hammer bases out of 1/4" steel plate and then fill with concrete. I also put a piece of 3/4" plywood between the hammer base and the hammer. I have had my 33's and 88's set up that way for several years. I also use regular 3/4" plywood under the 165. I did not isolate the foundation... will probably need to remove the hammer, cut the concrete, dig a pit and pour concrete... it does shake the foundation... just been too busy.

[Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver]

Really depends on the size of the hammer. Any hammer should have a minimum of a rubber pad or belting or plywood. Little one piece hammers (say under 200 lbs) can get away with such. Bigger hammers and two-piece hammers require a lot more.

One consideration is height, though. I'm six-foot tall and for hammers that I'm using with the work in front of me I like 40" to the face of the bottom die. I hate bending over! Now for larger work, your arm is straight down at your side holding the tong or piece. In that case I like the die at 30 -32 inches high.

That's my story and I'm stickin' to it!

[patrick]

At this very instant I have my Bradley jacked up 11" off the floor. I am resetting the hammer at this height which is a good 7" higher than the original installation to overcome the issues of bending that Grant mentioned. After 4 years of service on a hardwood timber pad 3.5" thick, the anvil had worked down into the wood about a 1/4". When I reset the hammer I will be using white oak timber that are salvaged from under some of our big steam hammers at work. Depending on how flat everything is, I may need to shim some areas and I do have some convor belting for this. I will be using epoxy to anchor threaded rod in the foundation. This method was recommended by one of the engineers here at work. I had the done the original installation this way and it worked pretty well. Just make sure you have a deep enough hole and that it is very clean before you fill it with epoxy. All the epoxies I have seen recommend cleaning the hole several times with a wire brush followed by a stiff blast of compressed air.

Patrick

[arftist]

I use a 1/2 '' thick conveyor belt under my hammer. Got it free somewhere. I used wegde anchors for bolts. I put rubber donuts made from truck tires, then big flat washers, then nuts. Keeps the hammer from being able to work on the bolts if it jumps, which it does. The upstroke of the tup lifts the whole machine a bit when it is full out. I have had it on three different slabs and hasn't cracked one yet. When I drill thew slab for bolts, I drill all the way through. Then I can drive the bolt down and patch over the top if I want to move.

[John Larson]

So Ed, what did you end up doing and how has it worked out for you?

[Judson Yaggy]

A good tip for blowing dust out of drilled holes in concrete is to figure out what thread is on the tip of your air gun (some folks call it a chuck) and find a piece of copper tube of similar size, a foot or two long, and tap or die the copper so it'll screw onto the gun. This lets you get the compressed air to the bottom of the hole where it will do much more to clean things out than just blowing into the top of the hole. WEAR YOUR SAFTEY GEAR as the dust and bits will go EVERYWHERE!

[AndrewOC]

yeah, i blew out 1 1/4" dia, 2 ft deep holes once that were half full of water... erky perky! Used specs, but i looked like a coal miner/ oil driller.
Andrew O'C

[Ed Thomas]

John Larson, as you can see by the posting date, this thread is over 4 years old. Since then, I have poured and mounted 3 Beaudry hammers. The 100 pounder is now gone and its foundation removed.

The 200 pound hammer, currently working just fine, is on a 3/4" plywood sheet on a 3' thick reinforced concrete block. It works fine, though at the time I did not understand how to bolt the anvil and at some point I will have to address that issue. The anvil is simply corralled with wood shims and floats around inside the frame.

The 300 pound hammer is on 2" yellow pine on a similar 3' foundation though the footprint is bigger. It is not operational yet, as I still have to make several parts including the sow block. Its anvil is bolted to embedded rods, and moderately isolated with steel washers over rubber washers cut from the tread of old tires.

In both cases, the foundation is isolated from the rest of the shop floor by a 2" wood frame.

I think more foundation might be better, but probably not necessary.

[forgemaster]

We normally put our hammers on a large monolithic cast block of concrete. All our hammers bar one are 2 piece. The anvils are set in a recess cast into the block with a thickness of conveyor belt under them. We then secure the anvil in the recess with wooden wedges/keys fitted into the gap between the edge of the anvil foot and the concrete. These are normally driven into place with either a sledge hammer or a modified jack hammer. We use no reo bar in the foundation just cast a big block of concrete as dense as we can get it. If you have to use an immersion vibrator try to use it sparingly as this causes seperation of the concrete and the mix water. The hold down bolts are Tee ended bolts fitted into fabricated pockets which are positioned into the concrete as it is being poured. We normally have a plate fabricated removeable formwork for the anvil recess which has provisions for aligning the bolt pockets to the recess. The reason for the pockets is to allow lateral movement and the bolts to be removable as we have had them break off level with the concrete when they have been cast solid in the foundation in our early days. When cast solid in the concrete I have found there is not enough flex in the top of the bolt to accomodate any movement of the hammer as it is working. Now if they break off, and we cant get the tee head out, the void at the bottom of the pocket is deep enough to allow the broken head to fall down with enough room for a new head to be inserted. The hammer its self is then pulled down to the foundation with a layer of thick conveyor belt under it to take into consideration any unevenness of the concrete, as getting the top surface of the concrete flat and true is not one of my good points. We have had hammers located such as this for about 12 years now doing fairly heavy commercial work 5 day a week with no problems so far.
Cheers
Phil

[MOONY]

 ye as he say 2  lolol