what is the best college for learning blacksmithing?

[raz]

hi,i am raz

i mitght to know what is the best place that offers blacksmithing course..
i am intersting in places at usa or uk,between 2-4 years long

in adittion,if somebody knows the two places : American College of Building arts(charlstown) and hct(uk)

i would be glad to hear whats the difference between the two and what you prefer?

thanks

[John B]

Without knowing the US's college pedigree it is difficult to make a comparison, all I can say is that Hereford College offer blacksmith specific courses, usually one or two years, that will give you a good basic insight into the craft, using traditional skills but leaning to the more contemporary/artistic side of the craft that is more viable to provide a source of income for the future.

Personally I only have contact with the tutors at Hereford and their current and ex students, and my opinion is based on that, not the actual experience of taking a course there. The feeling is that it is very intensive but rewarding, and as all colleges, they cannot cover all the skills and so is only a basis for your future as a blacksmith.

No doubt others with personal experience may be able to give you a more enlightening overview of the course and what it offered them, and what they got out of it.

HCT is a long way from home for you, but the natives are friendly!

[John McPherson]

The ABANA webpage listing all of the schools, and some description. Sorry, I do not have any direct experience with any of them, or their graduates.


http://www.abana.org/resources/education/schools.shtml

[MLMartin]

Where are you Raz? I am Mackenzie, I am a student at the American College of the Building Arts. My school is always glad to give a tour to anyone. There are also many open house events during the year. If you come in for a visit I'm sure you'll meet me around the shops. The blacksmiths are going to have a smelt just after the new year. January 3rd i think. We will have a few of the smiths from Williamsburg come down to lead the smelt. Also our current Professor was a long time Smith from Williamsburg, Richard Gunthere. He is an extraordinary smith, he specializes in historical reproductions from 1700 to late 1800 English hardware. I have been vary surprised many times when I will come to him with a photograph of a random piece and he can tell me right off the bat that it was most likely made in Pennsylvania, in BLANK shop at Blank time. Furthermore he can quickly track down some examples and references to the piece in question. He really knows his work, were it came from, who made it, and the most important, how to make it!

I am in my third year at the school, this school year out main focus is railing and panels curved in one plain. Next year, my last year, we will move on to railing and panels curved in two planes.

[MattBower]

Raz, since I've never gone to school for blacksmithing and am not a professional, I can't answer your question with an informed opinion. But I do wonder if paying someone else to teach you blacksmithing for several years ends up being more worthwhile in the long run than getting a job being paid (even if not very much) to work for an actual blacksmith for the same period of time. I don't have an answer to that; it's just a thought. If you're interested, maybe some of the professional smiths here will offer their opinions.

[Dillon Sculpture]

I try and learn something from everyone I meet, especially the ones that work with their hands.

School is a totally different environment from a shop, hard to compare.

Schools don't expect you to succeed as much as there is little incentive.

Most shops have to much financial burden to truly take the time to teach.

[Glenn]

i mitght to know what is the best place that offers blacksmithing course..

Not knowing what your metalworking skill is at present, have you contacted BABA and ask for a list of master blacksmiths that may have need for an apprentice?

May I suggest you contact Uri Hofi, hire on and work for him. He will push you to be the very best. Then cross the pond and contact Frank Turley, Brian Brazeal, Rich Hale, Jymm Hoffman, and others. Each has their own flavor of blacksmithing, and you want to learn it all. By know you will have the education you desire, as well as knowledge, skill, and experience no college can teach.

[Frank Turley]

I don't have any motivation problems at my three week class. Everyone hustles. Each class is unique and the emphasis may vary, but we attempt to do quite a bit. It is a technique class.

My opinion is...if students wants to continue to learn, they should join their regional smithing group, and attend workshops. Purchase books and CD's. Youtube.com has some good material and some questionable material.

http://www.turleyforge.com Granddaddy of Blacksmith Schools

[MLMartin]

Mr Dillon is absolutely correct. In a school setting the only way you will learn anything is if its important to you! No one can make you learn and if your lazy then any school is just a wast of time. I do my best to take every opportunity to learn. And like said most shops wont stop and spend a day to teach some one really specific things. I have had the pleasure of working for Mr Dillon for a few summers and definitely see the benefit of learning on the job, but not everything should be learned on the job.

My school sends its students out to work at professional shops every summer for apprenticeships, so there is some real world training. But its still vary important for the first years of any skilled job to be closely scrutinized and instructed by a highly skilled teacher.

My opinion is that for any skilled profession you should be professionally trained for a time then move on into the job field and expect to learn much more in the coming years. By no means when I leave this school will I be ready to run a full time shop or be a master blacksmith, and anyone that thinks 4 years of any school will make them a master as anything is just foolish. What I do plan to get out of school is a great foundation. I think of it as everything I learn in my 4 years of school as the same as many peoples first 8 years of petering around as the shop lacky or grunt. I think that many people will tell you that getting a job in a field that in truth you may know vary little about is not the best way to learn, you may find yourself just sweeping the floors and cleaning machines because you don't know how to do anything ells. But to enter a shop with a good background of classical forging knowledge, that is a start for moving up the latter.

These are just my ideas & thoughts, If you like them Huzzaa! If you disagree..... Ill have to send my attack birch out! haha

Best of luck to anyone on what ever path they chose and works best for them!

[A.Lewis]

Hi Raz,

My name is Aislinn. I am also a 3rd year student at the American College of the Building Arts. As Mackenzie said, our professor Richard Guthrie is a top-notch smith and a great teacher. If you get a chance, come to an open house (or just call the school and get a tour anytime)or the smelt he mentioned.

http://www.buildingartscollege.us/

Good luck on your search!

[kpotter]

I went to college and got a four year degree in art with a focus on metal.. Art colleges dont teach you how to make a living, I went out and thought that any jeweler in town would be thrilled to hire me. Not, I had to work for free for the first year full time and then I made minimum wage for a couple of years. I learned alot about design and history and got an education, but I learned to be a goldsmith by doing it for 20 years. I would get an education if you can afford it but dont think it will help you get a job most shops wont give any credence to a diploma.

[Dragons lair]

Mr Dillon is absolutely correct. In a school setting the only way you will learn anything is if its important to you! No one can make you learn and if your lazy then any school is just a wast of time. I do my best to take every opportunity to learn. And like said most shops wont stop and spend a day to teach some one really specific things. I have had the pleasure of working for Mr Dillon for a few summers and definitely see the benefit of learning on the job, but not everything should be learned on the job.

My school sends its students out to work at professional shops every summer for apprenticeships, so there is some real world training. But its still vary important for the first years of any skilled job to be closely scrutinized and instructed by a highly skilled teacher.

My opinion is that for any skilled profession you should be professionally trained for a time then move on into the job field and expect to learn much more in the coming years. By no means when I leave this school will I be ready to run a full time shop or be a master blacksmith, and anyone that thinks 4 years of any school will make them a master as anything is just foolish. What I do plan to get out of school is a great foundation. I think of it as everything I learn in my 4 years of school as the same as many peoples first 8 years of petering around as the shop lacky or grunt. I think that many people will tell you that getting a job in a field that in truth you may know vary little about is not the best way to learn, you may find yourself just sweeping the floors and cleaning machines because you don't know how to do anything ells. But to enter a shop with a good background of classical forging knowledge, that is a start for moving up the latter.

These are just my ideas & thoughts, If you like them Huzzaa! If you disagree..... Ill have to send my attack birch out! haha

Best of luck to anyone on what ever path they chose and works best for them!

I like the attitude. Just a few thoughts from a oldun. Before ya was born I was a avionics tech. Went to work in the real world. Found guys with electrical enginnering degrees who couldn't read color code on a resistor. Went into welding back in the 60s. was in a shop in FL in the 70s. they hired a VoTech grad. Came in his first day with his new bucket and new tools. Was told to help me deburr a couple of boxes of flamecut parts. Picked up his bucket and said "I am a trained profesional I don't do that. Told him I was welding when he was born. 20yrs later I run into him again. 600 miles away. He puffed up his chest and said now I am a CNC operator. Took him to the shop I worked for
Asked him if he could program the Fadal VMC or run it. He asked who runs it. Charlie usually runs it or I do. Running that thing was Open the door, remove part, install new part, close door, push start. 14 mins later do it again. I have swept floors and cleaned stock racks with 20+yrs expereance. Just saying if ya come to my shop I don't
care where ya been or who taught ya. I'll give a project and a time to do it. It's pass fail. I get 10 calls a month
" DUH YA HIREING" "NO" show up with your tools ready and able to show my what ya can do. I guess what i an trying to point out is Schooling is great.But expereance is king, Wish I had more.
Ken.

[Dillon Sculpture]

Didn't mean to step on your toes there Frank, I was really talking about a university type school. I would love to be in a position to take a class at J.C., Penland or the Grandaddy

I think you can learn more on a personal scale especially if you have a hard ass boss like Ken. Most of the mentors I had were pretty stern and expected more from me than I could even see down the road.

A journeyman would be my preferred way to lean, little pay if any, move on after and only after 3 or 4 months.

[fciron]

In the US, a couple more schools that offer Blacksmithing are Southern Illinois University at Carbondale and the Appalachian Center for Crafts, Tennessee Tech. The SIU program is probably the oldest degree program in the country. I know the instructor at ACC and he's a good guy.

There are a lot of ways to learn blacksmithing and a few different ways to make a living at it, so it is very hard to say what method would be best without knowing a lot more about you and based on my path, a lot more self-awareness than I have available. I would say to explore as many options as possible and then go with your gut.

[Paddy]

I went to HCT UK ( to take the pre-farriers blacksmith course) a few years ago.

Look at the diploma course, 2 years for Blacksmithing. This was seemingly the most practical based approach to getting practical skills for smithing up to a level where you can make something really saleable.

Its a great place to learn blacksmithing in a beautiful area of the UK. The course members and tutors were a great bunch of friendly people. The skills there to be learnt are exceptional. The 2nd year students were making their first gates and their own pieces, having done basic forging skills in year 1.

Good luck and Work Hard wherever you end up

Paddy Falvey CF (AFA)

[raz]

thank you all!
please dont hesitate to write any info that you have about the two colleges..

i undrstand that the colleges give me a basic training and after that i will need to be a journeyman for several years.

so,do you know at wich place there is more master blacksmiths ,whom i can work with- charlston or england? where will it be easier for me to find one?

thanks

[Dillon Sculpture]

Glad to see your back Raz, thats an excellent question.

[Bryce Masuk]

Glad to see your back Raz, thats an excellent question.

If you can go to england, Go

If I could have I would have, not only are you going to get to learn about blacksmithing but your heading into the history of the craft because european's developed the craft into what it is now though the past, not only will you be able to see great art and historical sites its going to entirely change your perspective if you willing to put the work into seeing it and learning about it.

eventually its my goal to head to europe and do the journeyman thing, life is out there its not in one spot if you want to be a part of it you cant sit still, there is too much time to do that for too long
your idea's will come from life and you might as well have as interesting one as possible.

you can see the quality of work produced in england though various people or people from england who have left and most of it lends itself to high quality of craft and style, by those who actually care about the work the same as anywhere else
location doesnt mean everything

[John B]

Hi Raz, this may be of interest or not, our Blacksmiths Guild sponsors an Inter College Competition for students and we award the Frank Day Trophy for the winning students piece, we also have people who attend our basic blacksmithing courses who then go on to various colleges, and sometimes they come back during the course to gain experience on a particular technique, when they complete the college course then come along to various other courses we can put on that are not covered in the college prospectus

This year one of Hereford colleges students Sam Pask was the recipient of the award, and I was at the prizegiving presentation during which I took some pictures of the work students had produced on their course which will give an inkling of what the students are learning there.

The Trophy is all forged and was made by some of our Guild members, Bob Hobbs a Gold medal winner of the WCB drew up the plans and made the figurines seen at the top of the trophy, other members made various bits and the whole assembled into what you see there, the panels depict the career of Frank Day, the founder of our guild I have pictures I can post if anyone is interested.






I hope you find them of interest.

[MLMartin]

I like the attitude. Just a few thoughts from a oldun. Before ya was born I was a avionics tech. Went to work in the real world. Found guys with electrical enginnering degrees who couldn't read color code on a resistor. Went into welding back in the 60s. was in a shop in FL in the 70s. they hired a VoTech grad. Came in his first day with his new bucket and new tools. Was told to help me deburr a couple of boxes of flamecut parts. Picked up his bucket and said "I am a trained profesional I don't do that. Told him I was welding when he was born. 20yrs later I run into him again. 600 miles away. He puffed up his chest and said now I am a CNC operator. Took him to the shop I worked for
Asked him if he could program the Fadal VMC or run it. He asked who runs it. Charlie usually runs it or I do. Running that thing was Open the door, remove part, install new part, close door, push start. 14 mins later do it again. I have swept floors and cleaned stock racks with 20+yrs expereance. Just saying if ya come to my shop I don't
care where ya been or who taught ya. I'll give a project and a time to do it. It's pass fail. I get 10 calls a month
" DUH YA HIREING" "NO" show up with your tools ready and able to show my what ya can do. I guess what i an trying to point out is Schooling is great.But expereance is king, Wish I had more.
Ken.

I'm most definitely not saying I'm above any of the grunt work in any shop, and did not say any such thing. Even the Shop Boss should know and be able to perform all the work in a shop top to bottom. I have spent many days scraping paint, sweeping floors, digging holes and cleaning machines. I just wouldn't want to get a job where that's all i knew how to do, it can be hard to move up from there if that's all you know. But starting work at a shop and being the green horn but still generally understanding some of the main work in the shop is a great start!

[MLMartin]

thank you all!
please dont hesitate to write any info that you have about the two colleges..

i undrstand that the colleges give me a basic training and after that i will need to be a journeyman for several years.

so,do you know at wich place there is more master blacksmiths ,whom i can work with- charlston or england? where will it be easier for me to find one?

thanks

England being much much larger will have a huge number more professional smiths to work with as apposed to Charleston being just a small city. The only good smith I know of in Charleston is my teacher Mr Gunthere. There dose not seem to be any good smith shops in Charleston at all actually, Only my school, but that's not a professional shop its a school.

[Bryce Masuk]

I always thought there were a few good shops down there at least in virginia there are some good blacksmiths I know that for sure frank turley's subsitute teacher moved back down there to work with bunch of people in a large shop by today's means doing alot of restoration type work I would suspect all over the east coast.

[raz]

Mlmartin15,

so how are going to find a job if there's no smith's ther?are you plannig to move to onoteher country?

[MLMartin]

There are few smith in Charleston the city, there are plenty of smith in the USA, I don't know where I will end up after school. I do have a nice sweetheart and she keeps me worm, that's the only thing I actually worry about at the end of the day. Theirs always a job some where.