I'm getting grumpy...

[HWooldridge]

No BS content -

We live in the country so I plink a bit and tend to go thru a brick of .22 LR every few months. I walked into Academy tonight and went to the gun counter; there was one young man behind the counter (likely part-time summer help but can't say for certain). At any rate, I started the conversation by remarking that the last time I was there, they were out of stock on .22 rimfire and I was wondering if any had come in. The clerk turned away and muttered somewhat under his breath, "I thought all .22's were rimfire". I stopped in mid-sentence while staring across the counter, turned on my heel and walked around the aisle to where the other rifle ammunition was stacked. I pulled a box of .22 Hornet and .22-250 off the shelves, walked back to the counter and set them on the glass cabinet. I said, "These are .22 centerfire. I don't want these - I want .22 rimfire". His face turned a bright red and I said, "Kindly hand me a box of the Winchester". He passed it over and immediately walked away to the far end of the counter. I asked if I could pay for them and he just pointed to the front registers near the exit.

It used to be that counter people in most any store (especially auto parts places) were often some of the sharpest people around. I used to deal with a NAPA store in New Braunfels solely because I never could stump the two veterans behind the counter - but it seems I've lost all patience with amateurs who can't be bothered to learn anything about what they are selling. Sorry for the rant but I'll wager some of you have had similar experiences.

[Mainely,Bob]

After I cut my hair(both head and face)went back in the service(Army reserves)and cleaned up my appearance I looked very much like everybody else as long as I was wearing long sleeves and gloves or hands in pockets.
I went into the local Harley dealership looking for parts for a build I was helping a friend with and was met by a surly parts man who looked like I used to(long hair,beard,etc)and had read enough chopper magazines to adopt an attitude when waiting on what he thought was another "farm boy"(me).Things quickly got out of hand between his attitude and my frustrations so he made the mistake of threatening me with bodily harm.
Out came the hands,off came the coat and around the counter I went.He got one look at the heavily tattooed hands/arms that were much larger than his thru years of metalworking and the gravity of his mistake sank in,he ran for the front office with me on his heels.
The owner was an old timer and I apparently was not the first disgruntled customer from the parts department(first to chase his parts man up front though).
Parts Runner got fired and I got a new part time job rebuilding old iron at home for the dealership. :D

[Dragons lair]

Yeh I hear ya Bob, Stopped at a big shop yrs ago. Big Bad John behind the counter.Asked for an override spring for a mouse trap(say what) How about a over ride spring for a foot clutch(say what) Was running a 42 flat head with a
suacide clutch and jocky shift. He never heard of such things. Was a little south of you. Coast of CT.
Ken. Back in the 70s.

[Dragons lair]

No BS content -

We live in the country so I plink a bit and tend to go thru a brick of .22 LR every few months.

A brick every 2 mos? My EX and I used to go thru 3 bricks a weekend plus 6 bxes of 45S. When the co worker joined in
it was 5 bricks .22 and 500 rds of 185 gr 45s. Thanks for the Lee 1000 loader.
Ken.

[bigfootnampa]

Well a few years back I was looking for some Janis Joplin music for a gift and when I asked if they had any of her music the answer I got was "is he country or what?". My jaw sorta dropped down as this was a dedicated record store and I just could not make excuses for youth stretch THAT far!

[Mainely,Bob]

Well a few years back I was looking for some Janis Joplin music for a gift and when I asked if they had any of her music the answer I got was "is he country or what?". My jaw sorta dropped down as this was a dedicated record store and I just could not make excuses for youth stretch THAT far!

No excuses,bad parents obviously.I blame it on video games instead of outdoor activity.
My kids all know and like music by the Doors,Jimi Hendrix,Janis,etc.My youngest even went so far as to recently put all my Stevie Ray Vaughn on discs for me(and made copies for himself too).
The flip side of the coin is that there`s a new wave and heavy metal rock station programed into each of our vehicles(usually the last button on the right) even though we only see the kids a couple of times a year. :rolleyes:

[ThomasPowers]

Experienced people *cost* more and today most businesses are cost driven. We still have one "old style" hardware store in town that people use as the last resort when all the other places are stumped. I'd rather pay a bit more both in time and money and keep them going---shoot they were the only place in town that had roach proof! (and could sell you a rifle or a 6 plate wood cookstove, fittings for things the other stores had never heard of and could brainstorm a fix for some of the oddest problems you could run into out in the big and lonely!)

Now on the use of jargon: traditionally is was used to show that you were experienced and so separate the old goats from the sheep; lots of folks out there will look at you funny if you talk about using a double lunged for a side blown tuyere

Young Folk: remember it's part of your duty to introduce young people to the great works of the past---we've started having a movie night to show our young friends some of our favorites: Cold Comfort Farm, Lion in Winter, the 1970's 3 & 4 Musketeers (makes the modern Disney version look purile!), Black Adder, Wooster & Jeeves, etc.

[pkrankow]

When I worked in retail, the phrase that commanded the most respect was "I don't know, how about we look it up?" followed by going to the large stack of product catalogs and looking it up. I found that this concept could be presented to younger people, and it did not sink in quickly for most of them.

Phil

[Mainely,Bob]

When I worked in retail, the phrase that commanded the most respect was "I don't know, how about we look it up?" followed by going to the large stack of product catalogs and looking it up. I found that this concept could be presented to younger people, and it did not sink in quickly for most of them.

Phil

Old timer check.
How many of you still have your "look it up club" buttons?The ones that said"We never guess,we look it up".Mine was red white and blue.
You can`t see it but I`m holding my hand up!
Wait a minute,The wife says it may be her brother`s. :(

[HWooldridge]

A brick every 2 mos? My EX and I used to go thru 3 bricks a weekend plus 6 bxes of 45S. When the co worker joined in
it was 5 bricks .22 and 500 rds of 185 gr 45s. Thanks for the Lee 1000 loader.
Ken.

I used to shoot a lot of .38 Special (maybe 500 a week) and a bunch of .22 but I've cut way back. A buddy of mine had a Dillon progressive so we could tear through the brass but he sold the rig when he moved. I have an old RCBS Rockchucker but it's a bit slow for production so I now shoot just enough to try and keep my eye sharp.

[JNewman]

I have to admit I am getting grumpier with things like that as well, I recently dropped a basket of product on the floor and exclaimed loudly I am going elsewhere when I got attitude after poor service. I then called the store manager to complain after I had got my stuff elsewhere and cooled down. BUT much as it's fun to complain about the current generation and how this generation of kids. The store clerk I got the attitude from after being sent on 2 wild goose chases through the store (second from her) was a woman in her late 50s. I often find that the teenagers who have part time jobs are more helpful in that while they MAY not have as much knowledge they do often know what they do have in the store and will TRY to help.

I find I am using my local hardware store more and more for misc. items, I may pay slightly more but I am in and out in minutes as opposed to MUCH longer in the big box store. I walk in the store and usually there is someone right there asking if they can help as soon as you walk in the door. They also keep my tax # on file so it is much easier at check out.

[CBrann]

... It is amazing the people that get into customer service, and are not interested in it. also remember that the young people of today were told "Go to college, become a rocket scientist, there will be plenty of jobs when you get out....!" So now they have rocket scientist diplomas, the student loans to go with them, and no job because the bottom dropped out and they have no experience. So now they work wherever for whatever.... feeling more than slightly misled... and though that is not an excuse.. it is a sort of explanation.

I still go to the local place and ask Have you got a.... and many times they either have one, or know where I can get one instead of getting the answer "I am in plumbing, not hardawre, let me see if I can find someone to help you...." and then watch the tumble weeds go by...

I learned that customer service is not my best thing when I sold lobster retail. The signs out front only had prices for lobster on them, the name on the front of the building ended with "lobster company", I can't tell you the number of times I was asked do you have clams, shrimp, mussels, crab etc, and upon finding that we only sold lobster leave... why is it people want to buy everything but what I have for sale? after dealing with that 20 times a day, anyone who sells things for a living might be a little raw around the edges......

but thats just me.... what do I know?
Cliff

[Mainely,Bob]

... It is amazing the people that get into customer service, and are not interested in it. also remember that the young people of today were told "Go to college, become a rocket scientist, there will be plenty of jobs when you get out....!" So now they have rocket scientist diplomas, the student loans to go with them, and no job because the bottom dropped out and they have no experience. So now they work wherever for whatever.... feeling more than slightly misled... and though that is not an excuse.. it is a sort of explanation.

Hey,I was told that if you worked hard,learned a trade and busted your butt for an employer they would treat you as a valued asset and you`d have a job for life.
Better they understand the fairy tales now while they`re young than face up to the lies when they`re at the age they can see retirement and are shown the door because getting rid of them after 18+ years of solid service is a quick way to curb costs according to the bean counters(who have college degrees BTW).
Or how about the kid who gets in on the ground floor right out of high school `cause his folks don`t have the money to send him to college.He works his way up by applying himself,going to night school as he can afford it and researching things on his own time.As a result his efforts help a fledgling company grow to a major corporation and he is just about to get a job off the floor and wearing a suit at a time when his body is beginning to give out on him after all those hours standing on a concrete floor in front of their machines.A buy out and new ownership snatches that job away from him and he`s laid off with the rest of the work force as manufacturing is shipped overseas where it`s cheaper.
There are a lot of curve and knuckle balls out there.Better to find out about them when you`re young and employable in another field than old and past your prime with few options.

Have I been grumpy enough for one morning? :angry:

[HWooldridge]

It's entirely my fault that when I started this thread, I should have made it clear that I wasn't picking on the age difference since I know a multitude of young people in their teens and 20's who have great work ethics and morals. I'm sure a variety of ages frequent this forum, so my story wasn't aimed at total time out of the womb. For example, I know a man who is 26 but has already done two tours in Iraq and one in Afghanistan (where he was severely wounded) and I will never know what he has gone through with regard to combat experiences and physical suffering from his injuries. Instead, what gets my goat are people who think they know something (that they really don't) and are not willing to learn/listen because of their own hubris, i.e. a "know-it-all". I work with guys in their 40's and 50's who have the same outlook so it's less about age and more about attitude.

The owner of the company where I currently work often uses the term "life-learner", which signifies someone who never closes his or her mind to new information and opportunities. I believe I've had those characteristics since I was a small child and hope to never lose the willingness to listen to someone who really does know more about a subject than I do, regardless of their age.

And Bob, I've been in manufacturing my entire life and I hear what you are saying. The scenario you painted has happened all over the country because of the opinions held by the financial community regarding manufacturing as a whole. Although the subject likely belongs in another thread, I was once told by a Wells Fargo group president sometime in late 2002 that "all manufacturing will soon go to China and there is no future in it." That happened during a conversation where I was trying to keep three plastic injection molding plants viable, which generated $60 million a year in sales and employed over 400 people. If top management in a large bank believes that, then there is little long-term hope for our economy because manufacturing is the foundation that everything else is built upon.

Unfortunately, I ultimately failed in my efforts so all of that work and equipment is gone; I was bitter about it for a year or so but finally had to let it go or destroy my health in the process. Sounds like you may have endured a similar experience so I hope you don't let it ruin your outlook.

[Mainely,Bob]

Not in the least.
Perhaps I was remiss in not including a point/moral to the story and that would be you can either let those curve and knuckle balls strike you out and walk away bitter and sullen or you can say to yourself "What can I learn from this that will keep me in the game".
I posted two opportunities that have come my way in another topic.I am seriously considering one of them.It`s not the way I had thought my life would head or what I would have chosen for myself but it`s an option.
Life continually throws opportunities at us and if we follow the combination of an open,rational mind and listening to our true heart then those opportunities become options we can work with to improve both our lives and the lives of those we come in contact with.

One universal truth is that you get back what you put out.
An opportunity for me to become a temporary gardener combined with one mans willingness to overlook a disability led me to a new friend and a chance to keep my bills up to date long term.
See The new topic I posted if my last statement doesn`t make sense to you.

[ThomasPowers]

Not only folks on the floor; I worked for a company that was run into the ground by management in the early 2000's. World famous name. We were told that the standard work week for exempt people was 50 hours, no increase in pay; then they started laying off staff while keeping or increasing workloads. They kept telling us that we weren't making the numbers that places like Enron was, (Guess what Enron wasn't either!)

The company had gone from about 130,000 (yup thousand) people to about 30,000 people when I finally got caught in a layoff. Our group went from 6 people to 2 and one of those was scheduled to retire in a couple of months, leaving *one* fellow. I talked with him a while later---he said we were the lucky ones---he was tied to the company by a pre-existing condition that he couldn't leave the medical plan and was starting to worry about his health holding up trying to do the work of 6 people under constant management strain.

I was 2 months from my 15th year and had gone way above the "standard" trying to help out before. At least in my current job they told me it would probably disappear next year...

[Mills]

Thomas, next year you gonna need to start looking again? I hope I'm reading that wrong. You just about have Socorro trained.

My wife and I are going thru a grumpy time. She is in customer service dealing with credit card calls. She has to field complaints and abuse from idiots who are unable to understand that even tho they make a half million a year, their credit is no good due to being overextended and overdrawn six ways from sunday. I have a difficult time not being cranky when I explain something for the third time.

As for help at the stores, mostly I have fun when I get attitude from a surly clerk. I WILL brighten someones day, either when I meet them or when I leave. It is their choice. I have made a couple of good contacts that way. Mostly I become the old fart its best to leave alone type. And age is not criteria.

I also am spending more time at the local supply houses because of competent help and a knowledge base that is unheard of from the box stores.

[Mainely,Bob]

Sales personel with attitudes can be fun if you remember that in order to keep getting their paychecks as long as you remain calm they HAVE to deal with you.I try to look at it as both a mental chess game and an opportunity for a little intellectual sparring.
One of my favorite things is when I get an attitude from someone when I`m bringing back something which has failed and has a "lifetime warranty".I do things like ask the person for the definition of lifetime and what the word warranty means to them as a company.Once I get the explanation I ask to see it in writing.I ask to talk to a supervisor and if that person gives me an attitude I ask them to call corporate headquarters so we can speak to someone there in the warranty department on a conference call.
I`m self employed and things are slow so I can spend HUGE blocks of their time and make repeated return visits and ask for them personally when I do.I have been known to come back on their days off and then have the person on duty that day call them at home because they failed to follow up as promised.
I collect things like broken discontinued Craftsman tools so that if a Sears employee doesn`t get with the customer service program the next time they see me it will be to warranty something they no longer carry and can`t possibly replace,that usually gets their wires frying.I will keep them cruising the catalog and computer files in an attempt to find comparable items.I have them get on competitor`s web sites to find things that match the function of the broken item and then suggest they can either order me one from them(if it has a lifetime warranty)or refund me the list price.I love these types of teaching/bonding opportunities.
There are two types of employees at the stores I regularly shop at,those who know me and are glad to help me and those who have history with me and run and hide.The ones who run I ask for by name.
Attitude makes all the difference in this world,especially when you`re dealing with someone like me. B)

[ThomasPowers]

I brought a craftsman phillips screwdriver back to seas once cause the end was messed up and wouldn't drive screws. The clerk refused to replace it cause "it wasn't broken". Took it outside, put it on the curb, wacked it with na hammer (I'm always wearing safety glasses save for asleep in bed!) brought it back in and said "my screwdriver is broken". He decided not to mess with me any more...

[Mainely,Bob]

I brought a craftsman phillips screwdriver back to seas once cause the end was messed up and wouldn't drive screws. The clerk refused to replace it cause "it wasn't broken". Took it outside, put it on the curb, wacked it with na hammer (I'm always wearing safety glasses save for asleep in bed!) brought it back in and said "my screwdriver is broken". He decided not to mess with me any more...

My teen age sons were notoriously hard on tools so I bought mostly Craftsman tools for them to keep them off my good stuff.
One of the standard exchanges was 20/30ft tape measures with the hook broken off.One of my sales buddies would see me coming,I`d hold up the tape as I approached and he`d just nod and go get another.I followed him one time and noticed Sears had replacement tape coils for sale right next to the complete tapes.The clerk froze when he saw me staring at them.
What followed was an entertaining (for both of us) discussion of why a company would try to sell replacement parts for something that had a lifetime warranty.More importantly why would someone buy those parts.
I also asked why he didn`t just grab a replacement coil and give that to me when I showed up.He said he had briefly thought of that but knowing me I`d want the tape installed and he wasn`t willing to go thru that in public.
Smart fellow,I knew then our time together was well spent. :)

[Mills]

LOL around here folks wonder why I refer to myself as a Crusty Old Fart in Training. It is because I still have so much to learn from Masters ThomasPowers and Mainely,Bob. LOL!!!

[CBrann]

Tell me this: Must you be old to be grumpy about things like poor customer service? It would be one thing if I was a pain in the butt and demand that everything be brought to me on a velvet pillow. There is not much I want, help me find item X in your store, help me replace item X I bought from your store, its not like I go to the auto parts store for kitchen cabinets, and throw a fit when they don't have them.

Cliff

[Sask Mark]

Funny thread! I can visualize some of the situations and I chuckle.

We have to remember that 'customer service' can really be abused by the customer. My wife used to work retail for a large craft store chain with it's headquarters in the U.S (Michael's). At the time, the Canadian dollar was worth more than the U.S. dollar. There was a lot of public outcry in Canada because retail prices for many goods were significantly higher in Canada than the U.S. and the excuse had always because the Canadian dollar exchange was unfavourable to the U.S. dollar. That excuse went out the window yet retail pricing wasn't affected.

After the outcry and a lot of cross border shopping for things like vehicles etc. many Canadian retailers 'adjusted' their prices downwards. My wife's store refused to do that. She had many middle-aged women roll up in their BMW's and Mercedes, wearing huge diamond rings lambasting her at the cash register because she wouldn't lower the price for them. She had NO control over the pricing. She had NO power to adjust prices. She couldn't do anything to help these wealthy people that were buying purely non-essential luxury items get their items for cheaper. All these variables were corporately controlled in Texas, not in small-city Canada. Self-entitlement has become par for the course whether it's deserved or not.

I'm all for getting good customer service and I will support stores that provide better service, regardless of cost. However, I have to be careful of the battles I pick so I don't wind up like one of those people that my wife complained about.

[Mainely,Bob]

I hear you about not holding individual employees responsible for corporate policy.
Just as I hold individuals responsible for their own attitudes and actions I will also go to bat for them when they are having their hands tied by unreasonable corporate policy or being unreasonably abused by other customers.I especially dislike unruly drunks and will run them thru the ringer just like a bad employee.
I have been known to also ask to see the manager and when he appears walk him back over to an employee who has been exceptionally helpful or gone above and beyond to see I get what I need and praise that employee in front of him and list all the things they did right.
On occasion I have also asked for company paperwork that I can fill out and send up the chain letting them know what a good job that one particular person is doing.

Good conduct gets support,excellent conduct gets rewarded.
Sub standard performance gets counseling and a report up to higher.Attitude gets taken for a run till they expend that negative energy and either come around or quit.
Who says military training has no place in the civilian world?

[Mills]

Rather than age it is alert positive attitude conflicting with dull negative attitude. Kinda like matter/antimatter coming in contact.