Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 (edited) One thing people hate about using a fly press is that the ram will drift down by gravity if you let go. I see folks with their shoulder against the lever or they put a wedge or a block under the stop nut. Well, I got to thinking and looking at mine and decided I could counter-weight it. The end of the screw had a nice tapped hole so I put a little eye bolt in and attached a 3/16 aircraft cable. Ran this up to a little pulley directly above and then over to another pulley near the wall. After a little visegrip-CAD I found that it took about 110 to balance the ram. Now I can let go of the handle anywhere and it just stays there, cool. Of course there is never a free lunch, right? So if it goes up easier then it must be harder to bring down. Well, for the life of me it actually seems easier BOTH ways. I'm starting to think that it is because the counter-weight effectively "unloads" the screw from the nut, reducing friction in both directions. That and the fact that the ram is usually traveling up and down less than an inch anyway. So, maybe I did find a free lunch! Hear that, Frosty? Free Lunch! Edited October 4, 2009 by nakedanvil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 That might wake Frosty up! If friction is the major loss of energy in a fly press, then reduction of friction could be a greater advantage than the force due to the weight of gravity acting on the ram that you loose. If the reduction of friction allows for a faster moving ram, more force (energy?) can be generated (transferred?). So if you have a #5 press, with a 110# fly, it is rated to generate 5 ton of force, if I understand the sizing correctly. The weight of your ram is less than 3% of the total force generated, so the increase in velocity needed to add the force lost due to removal of weight will be small. I think you are getting a better spin every time. I am no expert on fly presses, but think they are a bit "cooler" than hydraulics and other mechanical presses. If I made faulty assumptions let me know. I might be tempted to do some (more) research and (GASP!) math on them. Wouldn't really be "free" though, you did have time & effort involved in making the improvement. Might be like $5.00 all you can eat lobster tail though. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver Posted October 4, 2009 Author Share Posted October 4, 2009 Again, the major advantage and the reason for doing it is so the ram stays where you leave it. I would even accept a little downside for that. So, all the work (time and effort) was to achieve that alone. So the other part is the "free lunch". More like "buy one, get two"! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 Yea, but "all you can eat" keeps giving! Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteveW Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 I have to admit, I've been thinking about pimping my press into a part time cider press...shame to waste all those Apples :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene Chapman Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 Have used mine to crush glass for frit, think thsts what it's called, you need to set the depth stop nut open a bit, otherwise it will literally powder the glass. My wife was making glass beads for a while in a class. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Budd Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 mine is currently acting as a clamp on a batch of homemade micarta. I couldn't find my large G-clamps so had to improvise! :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 Unfortunately the press numbers are not necessarily correlated with force generated with all brands of flypress; my Hopkins #2 H frame stands about 7' tall with a 42" torus on top. Generates way more than 2 tons of force; of course it's about 60 years old now too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Woolsey Posted November 11, 2009 Share Posted November 11, 2009 I finally took the time to apply your modification to my P6 Flypress.I knew it would be advantagious when you first posted the mod, but...WOW! Thanks Grant,for this and all the other great info you and others so generously share. Johnny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver Posted November 11, 2009 Author Share Posted November 11, 2009 (edited) Glad you like it. It's really one of those things ya gotta try before you believe how well it does work. Few things work out as well as you expect (or hope), this one works better! Edited November 11, 2009 by nakedanvil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGropp Posted January 8, 2010 Share Posted January 8, 2010 Hey Grant , Thank for the heads up on the fly press counterweight. I just rigged one up on my #6 press and it is nice that the ram stays put where I leave it. Definitely much easier on the up swing as well, which is where the most of the effort is anyway. I'm not sure how much the counterweight is, but it is quite a bit. I welded an end on a 16" length of 10" pipe, made a chain bridle to hang it from and filled it up with steel punchings and trimmings from the ironworker. I haven't put it to the test yet for forging, but I've got about 100 railing pickets that need two exactly located hot countersinks bobbed in. This is a job perfectly suited to a fly press, with both the depth stop and an end stop to locate the countersinks. Another modification I've made to my press is a longer handle with a rolling grip. The handle screws into the flywheel and hangs down even with the bottom of ram. This puts your operating hand lower at an easier work position, which makes a difference on production work. The rolling grip is a piece of 1"iron pipe slid over the 1" solid rod handle with a washer welded on the bottom to hold it place. An occasional drop of oil down the pipe keeps it rolling smoothly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mondloch Posted January 21, 2010 Share Posted January 21, 2010 Just did the pulley thing to my #8 flypress. Took about 300 pounds to counter weight it but works great! Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted January 21, 2010 Share Posted January 21, 2010 My "major" modification was to slide some pipe insulation onto the handles so when I clonk myself in the head with one it doesn't damage the handle as much... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rutterbush Posted January 25, 2010 Share Posted January 25, 2010 Thomas, That, in all seriousness, will be the next modification that I do to the #6 at the college of welding knowledge. Thanks. My modification was to attach a C-clamp made of 1/2" X 2" plate with a 5/8" bolt on top opposite the handle. This C-clamp attaches over the outer diameter of the wheel instead of threading into the supplied handle holes. I can now move the wheel handle to any position needed. (As seen on another forum.) Let's see... 1-Infinite handle position adjustment. 2-Pipe insulation on the handle to protect against teeth imprinting. 3-Rotating hand grip. 4-Extend the handle lower for the short students. Now if I could see a picture of the counter balance I will have five stolen borrowed modifications. That counter balance may be the modification that my older students who have shoulder problems need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver Posted January 28, 2010 Author Share Posted January 28, 2010 One thing that hasn't been mentioned is that our arm can exert much more power flexing than it can extending. This might help a lot for what you're talking about, Rutterbush. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David E. Posted February 4, 2010 Share Posted February 4, 2010 I mostly use my flypress for bending up brackets and handles for the grit blasters that I make. The best modification I came up with was teaching my wife how to use it :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youngdylan Posted July 3, 2010 Share Posted July 3, 2010 gotta say this is a real useful idea (amongst his many) from Grant. It reallly makes it so much easier to use the press. No more throwing the handle away, rushing to change the work before the ram come down again .... and usually getting smacked in the head by the balls as you're bending down to look at the work. Only thing was when I first rigged it up I had the counterweight on the "user" side. Kinda got a bit nervous about 65kg of steel right above my head Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstermetal Posted July 3, 2010 Share Posted July 3, 2010 Where you been Captain? Haven t seen you around much, been busy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver Posted July 4, 2010 Author Share Posted July 4, 2010 Petty fancy rigging there boy! Safety hook and swivel and all. Good to see ya know the right way to put on cable clamps. Everyone please note the foam padding on the handles. I think I got 1.5mm cable on mine with a "Molly Hogan" eye in the end. Good to have ya back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youngdylan Posted July 4, 2010 Share Posted July 4, 2010 Where you been Captain? Haven t seen you around much, been busy? Hi Larry Kinda got sucked into a black hole of a job and kinda got out of the habit of posting. I've been following some of your posts and kinda suspect you guys have 36 hours in a day up there. How on earth do you get time to hunt down all those wonderful toys tools you keep finding (was very impressed by the hammer die sized 4340 you found) and play with the power hammers and run a business!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youngdylan Posted July 4, 2010 Share Posted July 4, 2010 Petty fancy rigging there boy! Safety hook and swivel and all. Good to see ya know the right way to put on cable clamps. Everyone please note the foam padding on the handles. I think I got 1.5mm cable on mine with a "Molly Hogan" eye in the end. Good to have ya back. Hi Grant Good to be back, looks like I might be moving the hammock out of the workshop. Flypresses and foam just seem to be made for each other. Note the liitle spacer between the top of the ram and the swivel. When I first rigged it up without it, it meant you couldn't lift the arm up to change the location of the handle. You guys seem to have flywheels and screw in handles rather than flyballs Yeah, definetly not something to quickly lash up with that unseen unwatched silent "lump" of damaclese hanging up there. Hey everybody with a flypress, you HAVE to try this. Flypress are wonderful wonderful wonderful tools in their own right but this makes them so sweet to use. As Grant says there's no real downside... they use inertia rather than gravity and inertia don't suck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SGropp Posted July 4, 2010 Share Posted July 4, 2010 Rather than have the counterweight hanging over your head, use two pulleys and a longer cable and locate the counterweight somewhere safe and out of the way. The weight for my #6 must be all of 200lbs, but if something lets go it will fall harmlessly into the bushes behind my shop. Putting a counterweight on a flypress is definitely a modification that is worth doing. Putting the weight somewhere else makes it even better and safer and doesn't require extra headroom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted July 4, 2010 Share Posted July 4, 2010 Rather than have the counterweight hanging over your head, use two pulleys and a longer cable and locate the counterweight somewhere safe and out of the way. The weight for my #6 must be all of 200lbs, but if something lets go it will fall harmlessly into the bushes behind my shop. Putting a counterweight on a flypress is definitely a modification that is worth doing. Putting the weight somewhere else makes it even better and safer and doesn't require extra headroom. You could put it into a tube of some type then even the space it would fall into will be clear in case of mishap. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J W Bennett Posted February 5, 2011 Share Posted February 5, 2011 Got around to counter weighting my #5, Man that's great..makes it a lot easier to use multiple dies and stock changes. I ran my cable straight up and then over to just behind the press then ran it down to the floor. With the Ram all the way up the weight just sits on the floor and takes the weight off of the trusses so they aren't loaded all the time. If the cable were to snap when in use the weight won't fall very far. Thanks for the idea Grant. I already had the adjustable handle but I believe I'll have to add the rotating grip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fciron Posted February 6, 2011 Share Posted February 6, 2011 I made this video to show a friend his 'new' flypress. It seems there is nothing new under the sun, this baby came from the factory with return springs. It was only when I read Grant's post that I realized why I liked this little flypress better than the big one which I kept. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.