Is Epoxy Necessary?

[Nihonius]

Hi, I've been wondering if epoxy to hold the tang to the handle of sword/knife is always necessary. When in comes to a gladius, on Romanarmytalk.com nobody has ever mentioned the need for, or use of an epoxy to make a gladius (at least that I've ever seen). All I hear is to slide on the guard, handle, pommel, then peen the end down. I may have to ask them about that, but I always assumed that if everything was put on snug, it would all just fit fine.

One other thing. For my knives I would prefer not to use any artificial substances to make them. So for a wood handle, do you just soak the block, carve it, then burn it on? Is that enough? Would power tools like a dremel be able to work on this oil or would it start a fire? Can you still burn the tang through with oil in the wood, or should that be done before soaking?

Thanks,
-Nihonius

[new guy]

i usually drill a hole, make the tang tiny and burn in the handle.

[dablacksmith]

ok the reason most people use epoxy is to make sure the handle dosent loosen with time... if everything fits exact and tight then its not nessary but most people use it ... it allows you a bit of room fitting handle and allows for srinking and expanding of wood without loosening..the originals didnt have epoxy but ... i read accounts of soaking handles in water to swell them so handles wernt loose... also burning out handle will make hole too big you will need the epoxy to fill where the char is ... you could start the hole with a hot wire burnt hole then file to fit ... fit it exactly and there is no need for glue! good luck!

[Frosty]

Use hide glue if you wish to be historically accurate. You can make it yourself if you like, it isn't all that hard. A google search will tell you all you need to know.

Frosty

[markb]

Although you don't want to use atificial means here's some info if you change your mind.
Glue Wars 2 - BladeForums.com

[dablacksmith]

now that was a interesting read! it had a interesting final recomendation also....

[Nihonius]

Hey hide glue sounds like a pretty good idea, and it sounds easy too! I buy my dog rawhide all the time already, so that shouldnt be a problem at all. Thanks for the suggestions!

[new guy]

dablacksmith: i do not compelteley agree with you on burnin the hole to big. i f you do it at a red heat then yes, but if do it lower at like 500 degrees. but yeah the hole can get to big. i often just glue it on too just to be safe. but i dont like too much glue. hide glue soounds pretty do able to me.

[ThomasPowers]

I'd look into cutler's resin/pitch before I'd use hide glue as hide glue softens when exposed to moisture---can make things slippery too!

One thing to consider is that in earlier times people would *EXPECT* that a sword would need regular maintenance and that the grip might be expected to be replaced a number of times over it's lifetime.

For burning in tangs we used to make a smaller tang "tool" and used that for burning---less wear and tear on the tang, no problems with tang heat treat and with skill a good fit when you drive on the real tang.

[Dave Budd]

funily enough I have a knife held together with hide glue.

Field maple handle and a half length stick tang. the tang is burnt inplace and the coals cleaned out. Then hide glue (water and gelatine sheet) poured in hot to size teh wood, then slightly cooler (thicker) glue aplied to the tang and the whole assembled. before the glue had set I pushed it into the hole a little and melted a bit of beeswax into the void.

I dropped the knife in the woods (in november) and then found it the following march. The blade was nice and rusty and teh handle had mould on it. I clamped the blade in a vice and pulled and twisted but the handle never moved a bit! Two years on I still use the knife and it is stored in a shed in my damp Devon woods :)

[panzertank27]

look to see how kukris are made. i believe they use natural sap or resin of some sort.