jlpservicesinc Posted December 11, 2023 Share Posted December 11, 2023 This will be a several post type deal.. I was invited to do a video for the EAIA " Early American Industrial Association". This would be filmed at the " Moses Wilder blacksmithing shop in Bolton, MA". I am a little tired of seeing the same thing in videos and with the plethora of newer smiths everyone has a yt channel and it seems they copy others' content.. Again, and again, and again.. Anyhow I said this to the EAIA rep.. That I wanted to do something different.. An auger or a double wing divider or a round draw knife.. Some;thing not seen nor shown.. It was agreed it would be a double-wing compass (aka Round head, Double Joint compass) copied out of the "A Pattern Book of Tools and Houshold Goods". ..Jane Rees and Elton Hall.. Of course, the caveat was it had to be steeled wrought iron.. I've never made a double wing/double joint in my life.. All the compasses (dividers) I've ever made were on the cheap.. Aka as fast as possible.. Never having made a pair before and having a filming session meant I had to sit down and figure out how to make them. I tried the flatten and bend into a U method.. No, go.. Not with wrought iron.. Steel would be fine.. Attempt 2 was the same technique but with higher heat and a little more lead-in.. Nope.. Was a bust.. Attempt 3 was welding on the wings to a main section.. This was also a failure.. If you know anything about this type of weld it's well known you have to be able to get back into the center to finish the weld after it shrinks.. (no way to finish the scarf.. So nope.. Failure.. It then hit me that I have to utilize the strengths of what wrought iron would offer and how easy it is to forge and forge weld.. Sample 4 came out perfect.. This was all I needed to be able to film and bring it to life.. I need to pick up a little angle gauge I can keep in my shop apron.. Having to remember what the angle is supposed to be from eye is no fun especially when filing.. This is where the filming left off.. It will resume next year in March.. With this said.. I will be making a new set and will film it in it's entirety. Here are a few photos.. You can see the failures and then that "aw ha moment".. Way easier now having figure it out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted December 11, 2023 Share Posted December 11, 2023 Don't you just love those AH HAH! moments? Weren't there plans for dividers like this in, "The Art of Blacksmithing"? How long do you have into the good pair? Well done Jennifer. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlpservicesinc Posted December 11, 2023 Author Share Posted December 11, 2023 The good pair was about 2hrs of direct forging.. there was a lot of material prep.. Had to forge 5/8" sq down to 1/2" and then prep a horse rasp for the steel. I dragged out the Alex Bealer book to look and did not find the information referenced.. Do you know the page? Love to look it up. All my life I have never had an original idea.. It's always just a rediscovery or progression on a theme.. Tong making and rings was from the Cosira series, Tulip hinges from Alex bealers book.. It is funny how all things get blended together. I think the main thing about doing this so long is I don't spend time on an idea once I see it's not going to yield the results.. All 3 samples were about 6hrs total. This included a lot of metal prep since I don't have wrought iron in standard sizes. Sample 4 was about 1.5hrs since I had to follow it thru to see the exact results. Having a dedicated angle gauge for making these would be the best time saver.. As would a proper hot cut chisel designed for this.. There are a lot of time saving tools that would have been in a MFG's shop.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Latticino Posted December 11, 2023 Share Posted December 11, 2023 Nice work JLP, as usual. Even the failures look viable, though not up to your high standards I suspect. Going for some form of ornamental rivet? That will be fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George N. M. Posted December 11, 2023 Share Posted December 11, 2023 Jennifer, I really, really doubt that you have never had an original idea. On the topic of originality I commend to you the song "Lobachevsky" by Tom Leherer: Enjoy. G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted December 12, 2023 Share Posted December 12, 2023 I'll take it that I didn't see the divider project in "Art of Blacksmithing" if you don't find it there. I remember the drawings, steps and WIP pictures but not which book. I had a library of about 40 blacksmithing and related books that was stolen by a long time good riddance associate. Dang, now I'm blanking on any titles! It was probably the book that was a composite of several general topics, one of which was tool making. Parts are coming back. He traveled the world and wasn't so much a smith, knife maker, caster, etc. but picked up enough to document the crafts in different countries. Something like that. Stupid TREE! No original ideas? Have you stepped back and looked at that truly polyfunctional school building you've about got polished and ready for students? HAH! It's more a campus than . . . well I guess "Learning Center" is synonymous but doesn't really fit the bill in my dented head. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jo_Bai Posted December 15, 2023 Share Posted December 15, 2023 I searched a bit and maybe this is helpful to you. If I remember correctly, he uses wrought iron a lot. The full video need to be bought, sadly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlpservicesinc Posted December 16, 2023 Author Share Posted December 16, 2023 Jo_Bai Thanks Those are the compass type I will be making.. I'm too cheap to pay for the video.. But with that said.. I might break down and rent it.. Always nice to see what others have going on.. Interesting that his preform and mine look the same.. HUH.. Wonder why.. Just kidding.. If I weren't so frugal I'd probably watch it.. My statement about not finding many videos with Double joints still holds true.. Did you find any others? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted December 16, 2023 Share Posted December 16, 2023 I loved the episodes of "The Woodwright's Shop" with Peter Ross, he and Roy tended to poke fun. Mostly Peter at Roy when Roy tried to do something His way. I'll bet there's an episode of "The Woodwright's Shop" Peter forged dividers. Frosty The Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jo_Bai Posted December 16, 2023 Share Posted December 16, 2023 14 hours ago, jlpservicesinc said: Did you find any others? Sure, but they are not working with wrought iron. And here 2 other videos, where a similar joint is used. So far these are the only one I remember. The rest use a different joining method. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlpservicesinc Posted December 16, 2023 Author Share Posted December 16, 2023 thanks for the videos.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillyBones Posted December 16, 2023 Share Posted December 16, 2023 Jennifer, back about 5 years ago John Switzer at the Black Bear Forge did a video on them as well. I looked but i am no very computer literate so some one more savvy than i could provably find it lickity split. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlpservicesinc Posted December 17, 2023 Author Share Posted December 17, 2023 Billy the Blackbear videos were already pointed out.. So just to be clear, everyone is doing the single joint or offset joint.. it's not the same as the double-joint compass.. Yes, yes I watched DF and a few others.. DF drilled his joint.. ARGH.. disgusting.. Thats not forging.. Never liked his videos.. I'm not interested in "just making a pair".. Anyone can do that with a given amount of time.. In the old days they made these in a very quick method.. Thats what I'm after.. Blacksmithing.. Anybody can make anything given enough time. Does it look professional (their method).. Is it a clean and concise forging? If you go back to the beginning you can see 4 attempts.. The 1st 3 were clumsy.. Would they work sure..Heck of a lot better than the videos I watched, But I'm also sure those were not the methods used.. It is interesting that people have not found a video on the subject.. Well other than Peter Ross's.. By the way.. I have it figured it.. I just thought it would be nice to watch someone else who's made a pair or 2... I'm actually pretty bummed about the whole thing.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlpservicesinc Posted December 17, 2023 Author Share Posted December 17, 2023 That sounded a little harsh.. Was not my intentions.. I have a great appreciation for anything anybody makes.. Blackbear, DF, etc, etc.. Glad they make what they make for them.. It's just not what I'm after.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlpservicesinc Posted December 17, 2023 Author Share Posted December 17, 2023 I did drop the coin to watch the video and he does them the same way I do.. Well other than in the video he used mild steel.. Go figure.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jo_Bai Posted December 17, 2023 Share Posted December 17, 2023 (edited) xxxxxxxx I am looking forward to your video (if it gets released on YouTube). I fell the same, that content has degraded. A lot of the same stuff and rarely something different. Edited December 17, 2023 by Mod30 Language & excessive quote Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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