Britguy Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 I’m considering a 75kg Anyang power hammer for my shop. I know there are so many threads on here which talk about foundations and isolation pads, but there are so many variables, it seems impossible to have a one fits all solution. The Anyang is a one piece unit, which I would think is a bit more forgiving than having a seperate anvil, but then I’m not sure! We are very rural, but I have one neighbouring property, which is only about 50 meters away from the workshop. The couple who live there are not very forgiving about noise. Any noise. Last week whilst I was working in the shop, the guy shouted over and asked me if I could turn the radio down, as they could hear it in their house! Okay, it has a good base sound, but even so, he must have ears like a fruit bat. I obliged, but at the same time, I pondered my decision that is to have a power hammer within the coming year!!! The only option I can think of, other than having them “run out of town”, is to have a good isolation pad beneath the hammer. I realise that it will still be heard, but if I can at least stop the vibrations being transmitted through the ground, I’m sure I can argue the rest, as hell, we are on a rural 10 acre property, and we could be running heavy farm equipment if we so should wish. So, without having to sell a kidney to pay for design of a isolation pad, would any of you fine fellows know where I might get some good ballpark advice about what might be a sufficient type/mass of pad to be aiming for? I realise that when I dig out, I might need a water pump if the groundwater table is high, or, to pump out any ingress of water between the pad and the wall etc. But also a decent idea of how big this thing needs to be would be a great start. The 75kg is only a possibility, else I could even go with a 44kg hammer. I know the 44 doesnt need anything other than to sit on a standard workshop floor, but then I know ill have the same issue with the darn neighbours. So, ill have to try and isolate in any case I guess. A friend of mine runs a 15kg hammer, and his neighbours (who don’t mind) can hear it working, and they are maybe 80 mtrs away. That said, his is just sitting straight on the slab floor. Thanks in advance guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swedefiddle Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 Good Morning, Welcome to our world, from the left coast of the big Island (some call it North America). Actually, we are surfing on the Continent of Vancouver Island!! Sometimes the ground is a little wiggly. When we wiggle, California gets concerned. Only in Canada, Eh!! NOT!! There is no magic bullet. No matter what you do or how you mount a Power Hammer, your neighbours will hear it. A Hydraulic Press won't make the thumping sound, It will make a humming sound from the Hydraulic Pump and Motor. Might be easier on your neighbours. There must be someone on your side of the puddle who has a hammer that you can listen to, in operation. The force of a Hydraulic Press goes straight to the center of the material. The force of a Power Hammer stays more on the exterior of your workpiece. There is no perfect!! There is more heat loss into the Press Dies than the Power Hammer Dies. An Induction Heater/Forge removes the roar of a Propane Forge and/or the smell of a solid fuel Forge. I started out with a Press that I made for a specific type of job. I bought a 50kg Hammer thinking it would be faster. It isn't. It just is different. Get used to your way of doing something, don't worry about all the naysayers. Please yourself and try not to annoy the neighbours. Rule #1 Neil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 I'm guessing from your screen name, you are somewhere in the UK. If you edit your profile to show your location, you may be surprised how many Brits are near enough to visit and offer advice and help. Sound proofing the shop would go a long way in reducing the sound heard by the neighbor. Are there any regulations about noise in your location? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Britguy Posted September 7, 2019 Author Share Posted September 7, 2019 I'm actually not in the UK. I'm in New Zealand (Ex Pat). The 75kg is very much a long shot (a long story), but more likely possibility is a 44kg. Either way, Im aware that it will upset the neighbouring property owners. They are not the nicest of people. To give you an example, he has a personal car numberplate that says something similar to AGGRESSIVE (I wont divulge what it actually is) The previous occupiers were just lovely, a dear old couple who have since passed away, and who wouldnt have had any issues I'm sure. Anyway, I'm not looking to bend over backwards to appease them, but, just to be reasonable. That to me means not making noise too late or too early of a day. But, also any constant noise could be considered a nuisance. I have already spoken with the local authority, and they say that usually, its above 50 decibels, obviously not at source, but at the complainants dwelling or property. Now I'm sure the hammer would not create this, but, Im thinking a dull thud thud thud through the ground would be annoying to anyone, and in that sense I want to be a reasonable guy and try to eliminate as much as I practically can. I'm also only looking to operate the hammer during usual business hours, and my neighbours both work, so in that sense there wouldnt be any issue at all. However, they do sometimes seem to work odd hours, and the man has taken to coming home early afternoon. He once told me he starts very early, before 5am, but likes to come home and sleep in the afternoon some days. This could potentially be a problem, but, if I can do everything possible, it shouldn't be MY problem. We all have to live and work, and, if I was to run heavy farm machinery, a wood shop or motor shop, Im sure I would make much more noise! Being as we are a rural smallholding, we are entitled to work the land, and have heavy machinery working. One of our neighbours runs his earth moving business from his property, and has HUGE plant and equipment moving on and off all the time. No issues! Again, if I take the time to do this right, and to show that I have done my best to eliminate the noise problem, making significant difference, then I cant see a problem. Hence my initial enquiry. I am informed that the smaller hammer doesn't require special foundations, but, it sure would make a difference as far as vibrations are concerned. It can only be a good thing to eliminate this, for both the neighbours and myself, and workshop foundation which is 6" concrete. This is all for an exercise in what is possible for now, as I have neither hammer as yet, and no concrete idea on which I might be getting. But, before I do, I have to try and have an informed best guess at what I could achieve given the right approach. I also realise that, it wont be truely apparent, the noise and vibration levels that is, until its up and running, and the neighbour hears it. All very exciting huh! But given they cant stand a radio playing in my closed workshop, as the BASE annoys them, I can see a few fights looming over the horizon, no matter how much I try to do. As for the hydraulic press idea, yeah, Im building one right now, but it cant exactly do what a hammer can do, and vice versa, and I don't like limiting myself in my own workshop. Its good to be reasonable, but beyond that, sorry, go take a hike! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judson Yaggy Posted September 8, 2019 Share Posted September 8, 2019 Look into Fabrika isolation pads. Extreme price warning here in case you have a delicate heart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Britguy Posted September 9, 2019 Author Share Posted September 9, 2019 Judson, I do, so I wont, but thank you anyway. I'm guessing from their website, that they will be horrendous in cost. I have to be practical here, and, as I said, I will try to be "reasonable" about it if I can. I'm sure there must be cheaper options out there for those of us who don't have bottomless pockets. I'm even thinking if the pad is deep enough, and has enough mass, then that must surely help a lot. I would have thought that isolating it from the slab and walls is one of the most effective first solutions. However, Im no expert, hence my enquiry. But, if it comes to having to spend $$$$$$$$$$ then its not going to happen. One thing I might have to consider, is a high water table. Sump hole or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted September 9, 2019 Share Posted September 9, 2019 The Big Blu Max 155 hammer at ESSA is mounted on one inch thick horse stall mats. The isolation the mat provides, I can't feel the floor vibrating when standing next to it in use. However no isolation mat will deaden the sound of the hammer hitting hot steel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swedefiddle Posted September 10, 2019 Share Posted September 10, 2019 Good Morning Kiwi, I didn't pour a huge foundation. I formed a frame on the shop floor, 4Ft wide, 8Ft long, 8" high. I wanted to be able to move it around, so I put 2 pieces of plastic pipe +/- 1.5" id, sideways in the form. I wanted to be able to slide and axle in each side and roll it across the shop, if needed. I put a piece of plastic vapour barrier in the form so the concrete wouldn't stick to the floor of the shop. I have moved it a few times and there is no fretting on the finished concrete shop floor. I have high density rubber mat between the bottom block and the block that the hammer sits on. Yes, it all lifts apart. Threaded bridge rock anchor sticking up from the bottom block, have to lower the top block over the threaded rod (yes, I used plastic guides as well, in the top block). I have conveyor belt between the Anvil and the top block, rubber mat between the top block and the bottom block. Yes, you can feel the hammer working, No, it is not silent. If you listen closely, you can hear it at the street 90 feet away, but you can't feel it. Don't dig a big hole, stay above your workshop cement floor. Make things so you can move it when you need/want to. Neil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Britguy Posted September 11, 2019 Author Share Posted September 11, 2019 Wow, thats quite different. I dont plan moving my hammer when its settled, so thats not a concern for me, but I do understand your logic. I cant understand why/how it doesnt break the 8" concrete up though! It all sounds too cumbersome for my taste, but each to his or her own. Also, i'm sure it would still rattle the existing foundation slab (in my shop anyway). And your movable slab is a mere 0.6 cubic meters, which isnt a lot of mass when compared to a deep isolation pad design, which might be around 2 or more cube. Not only that, I'd probably trip over the darn thing and end up with my head in the hammer! :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zachary Posted September 11, 2019 Share Posted September 11, 2019 I have the 55kg Anyang absolutely love it! The dealer recommended a pad below the frost line and 3’ x 7’ with 1” styrofoam insulation around it to isolate it. So mine is sitting on a block 4’ deep 3’ wide and 7’ long. If I’m running it flat out you can feel it just a little on the cement outside 20’ away or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Britguy Posted September 11, 2019 Author Share Posted September 11, 2019 4 hours ago, Zachary said: I have the 55kg Anyang absolutely love it! The dealer recommended a pad below the frost line and 3’ x 7’ with 1” styrofoam insulation around it to isolate it. So mine is sitting on a block 4’ deep 3’ wide and 7’ long. If I’m running it flat out you can feel it just a little on the cement outside 20’ away or so. That sound great! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swedefiddle Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 Good Morning, Its always interesting when the newby is the expert. Sorry to hear about your expertice. You asked about simple suggestions, I replied with a simple answer that works. Good Luck on your Journey. Maybe you can grow a little humble. Neil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 Brit Guy, have you seen this thread? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Britguy Posted October 28, 2019 Author Share Posted October 28, 2019 This looks great. Sorry for the late reply by the way. Lost a HD on my comp. Took me ages to get sorted again! Anyway, looks like the 75 could still be happening, so fingers crossed. On 9/12/2019 at 1:29 AM, swedefiddle said: Good Morning, Its always interesting when the newby is the expert. Sorry to hear about your expertice. You asked about simple suggestions, I replied with a simple answer that works. Good Luck on your Journey. Maybe you can grow a little humble. Neil Wow Neil, you're touchy my friend! I'm no expert, and I never said I was, but I was only stating the facts re the mass of your 8" slab compared to a deep foundation slab construct. Why did you get all narky? Besides, if I read your reply correctly, it means that your working height has increased by a considerable 8", which to me would not be comfortable at all I'm afraid. Also, the new 8" slab is still sitting on the foundation slab, so I cant see the advantage really. As for me "growing humble", well I always appreciate help or suggestions, gratefully so, but should that mean that I have no right to comment on them? Maybe YOU could grow a little less sensitive! Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irondragon Forge ClayWorks Posted October 28, 2019 Share Posted October 28, 2019 On 9/7/2019 at 3:51 PM, Britguy said: I'm in New Zealand We won't remember this once leaving this post, hence the suggestion to edit your profile to show location. Happy to see ya back on line, I hate computer problems. If you haven't seen this thread, it will help you get the best out of the forum with many tips. READ THIS FIRST Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Britguy Posted October 28, 2019 Author Share Posted October 28, 2019 2 hours ago, Irondragon Forge & Clay said: We won't remember this once leaving this post, hence the suggestion to edit your profile to show location. Happy to see ya back on line, I hate computer problems. If you haven't seen this thread, it will help you get the best out of the forum with many tips. READ THIS FIRST I'll do that right now. Also, i'll read the tips. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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