horse shoe knives

[meco3hp]

Hello,
Went to a meeting tonight for the local gas engine show and met my reenactor customer there. He said he seen a new item for sale here at his last blackpowder meet that he'd like to see about having me make some to try to sell. They where knives made from horse shoes. He said they took a shoe and twisted it 180* right at the "toe" using one half as a handle and then forged the other into a blade. He said the handle looked just like a store bought shoe, with the holes and groove for the nails. He also swore they where tempered. I didn't think they made horse shoes from high carbon steel or something that could be tempered into a blade. Could this somebody making shoes out of something you would use for a blade, to get around that problem, or are they adding carbon to the shoe some how. This guy used to mess with BS years ago before he got into blackpowder, but not to much of any extent. I'm sure he asked about the tempering and would know if somebody was pulling a fast one. Any ideas? Anybody seen one of these knives?

[GobblerForge]

I think the idea is a good one. Makes for a nice mental picture. Something some may want to consider is that not every knife has to be a scalple. You can take any steel and sharpen it. The higher the carbon is just helps keep it sharper longer. If this reenactor was only using the knife for cutting cloth patches an such it would work fine. I can, and have on a bet, sharpened a tea spoon sharp enough to shave with. For years I had around the shop a bench knife that got used for any abusive cutting. Made of soft metal and sharpened with a grinder. Worked fine. On a previous post I stated I used old horseshoe wrought for the low carbon portion of my demascus and it was pointed out that this lowered my total carbon content. True enough. My point here is that as it is, I have never broken a knife and every knife I make for skinning will do the job on one sharpenning. When I'm done with a deer, it gets resharpened and is ready for the next one. This is my experience and opinion only. Thanks. Brad

[ThomasPowers]

I have never heard of a shoe that was high enough carbon to harden to make what I would call an acceptable knife. Like RR spike knives it's "cute" but not something I would want to admit to carrying. I know of no evidence that it was ever done historically and I've been looking at knives from pre-horseshoe days through the advent of modern steels.

A lot of early blades are just plain wrought iron, though even in the iron age there is evidence that they selected for harder alloys for blades ("The Celtic Sword", Radomir Pleiner) even before they were heat treating them, (high C or P alloys are harder just out of the bloomery than plain wrought iron). By the time they were doing blackpowder even low grade knives had some claim to carbon---though case hardening them is documented. (See some of the indian trade knives and why chisel edge sharpening was used)

Thomas

[meco3hp]

Hello,
I found these on the web late last night. The second knive down, on the first url, might have been what he seen, maybe. This guys got some interesting knives. The second url is his main page, with sub-links on the bottom of the page

http://www.mountainhollow.net/a%20bit%20different.htm

http://www.mountainhollow.net/

[bruce wilcock]

in the uk we use a rolled section ,concave shoing steel, thats for the men that still make there own shoes,some of the bar can be very steely and will harden ,i have some that is a problem in that i cant sleck out or it will snap if you try to alter them cold , i have to let them cool of and cold shoe, if you can make a knife out of it is another thing ,,but i will be shoe making towards the end of the week ,will give it a try ,

[sandpile]

MECO3HP-- We have made a lot of stuff from used shoes. In playing around with them, we found that Evantor shoe from ST CROIX has the most carbon in them. I have no idea wether this was just one run of steel for the shoe company or if they planned to have a little carbon in the Evantor shoe. They will harden a little, we never tempered them.

I use to guide and pack hunters from all over the country. Once a man from Okla. came to hunt with me and had shoes on his horse, made from oil-field SUCKER-ROD. The shoes were so hard that they were too slick for the horse to stand up on. Had to reshoe him for the hunt.

Chuck

[Rich Hale]

Dont worry about the carbon content,,,,make a handful of them and call the letter openers,,,For those shoeing horses,,,make one right from your clients horse for holiday present,,
My thoughts on knives are simple,,if you want to make a knife use good steel,,,

[ThomasPowers]

We make hoof picks from horse shoes; never met a horse owner who complained thay had too many of them!

To fancy them up you can make the handle in into a horse head...

For upscale owners a horse head bottle opener from a horse shoe will generally fit the bill.

Thomas

[Quenchcrack]

If you actually read the text under the knife, the man has forge welded some 1084 onto a half horse shoe. It looks like he hardened it with a hamon line, to boot. This is a real knife, not a wanna be.

[meco3hp]

Hello,
Yep, I read it. Yes, thats a real knife for sure. I'm assuming this is kinda like what my customer seen. Well beyond my capabilities for sure. It is a really nice looking knife though. I'd love to watch one bying made.

[ThomasPowers]

Meco3hp; read your sig line...

Thomas

[meco3hp]

Hello,
Oh I"ll get those capabilities one of these days, just got to make a living at BS first, before I can play much.