Rob Gorrell Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 I am learning tinsmithing and some very basic blacksmithing. A problem I am running into is that no matter what I try, my rivet bends over to one side before I can get the head to start spreading out properly. I do not have a rivet set. Any advise? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southernforge Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Either you are using rivets that are too long for your application, or you are not hitting them squarely in the center for your initial blows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Hale Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 You did not say wot the material is you are using for rivets...but my first thought when i read this is to just post: rivet a hudred or more and get back to us....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peacock Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 What shape head? What diameter? What thickness of stock? What material are the rivets? In my experence the thinner the stock the harder it is to get a nice job. If the heads are anything but flat I use a backing bar with shape of the head in it to help hold the rivet square with the work, then be sure you hit it square. 1 or 2 good blows is much better than several light ones on small rivets. One and one half the diameter is the correct amount to have sticking thru thru tin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Have you tried riveting with a very small crosspein instead of a ballpein? A jeweler suggested that to me when I was worried about riveting two pieces of amber onto a piece. Of course the rivet too long is the most likely cause. One hardly ever gets to use a rivet without sizing the length in my smithing experience as the "standard" sizes are not as much use when you forge the stock "non-standard" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 The rivets are merely bowing to pressure, you are probably not hitting them square, and they are of excessive length. What material are you using for the rivet? and what diameter are you using? Usually rivets for tinwork should be soft iron, or copper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Gorrell Posted February 7, 2012 Author Share Posted February 7, 2012 I have some that are 1.25" and some a touch longer I think. One batch is steel and the other is listed as tinner's rivets I think.... The are 1/8" diameter and I am trying to rivet two or three layers of 28 guage tinplate. The other thing I am using them for is to connect my bucket bands which are 2 layers of 16 guage steel. Having a little better luck there. I'll work on the hammer blows tonight. I doubt I get a hundred done though... :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Gorrell Posted February 7, 2012 Author Share Posted February 7, 2012 I think I have a couple bags of shorter rivets somewhere that I will try on the tin also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 You could try using a hacksaw to cut them to the required length. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Turley Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Rule of thumb is to leave 1.5 x the rivet shank diameter protruding above the work pieces. To prevent work hardening cracks, file a chamfer around the protruding end edges before hammering. If using a ball peen, AS SOON AS you see the shank begin to bend, use angle blows going against the bend, trying to center it as you go. If the rivet shank is small enough in diameter, you can cut it down with nail nippers (end cutters) such as horseshoers use. Otherwise, hacksaw, as John B mentions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Hale Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 I can only hope that the length of one and a quarter inches you said above is a typo!!! No for some better help than I posted above: Take some mild steel or copper stock the diameter youi are wanting to use. put it tight in a vise with a littl ebit of the end sticking up. see how much youileave up or measure it.. then after chamfering like Franks suggested, pein the end and form a head. if it fails cut the stock off and do it again..same same until you find wot hammer shape works best for you and get the moves down. and make a lot of them. A foot of material will be enouigh to get things going your way. try with different amount os stock above the vise..Keep the ones that are nice. put them in the tin and use a bottom die of the right shape for the head you shaped. then cut to the lenght you found worked on the other side. For copper or nickel I use ,again like Frank mentioned a pair of end nippers. I have modified the cutting edges so I can put the end of the nippers flat on the stock and the edges will cut the corredct length, I cut a part way into the stock and then move the nippers and finish, that leaves a little peak on the end like a long chamfer. you gott make a bunch of rivets to learn how to head rivets. Then your set. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Hale Posted February 7, 2012 Share Posted February 7, 2012 Rivet header: Take a old center punch or a piece of spring stee or even mild steel and make a punch that has the same look as the heads of the rivets you formed from post above. Then take a piece of steel like abouit half inch by one inch,,smaller or larger to be able to use something you have. heat the piece up tpretty hot and hold in vise. p;unch the end with the tool you made..make it just deep enough for your rivet heads. When all is cool Put the heading tool in vise. leave alittle stick up and tighten it real good. put one of your handmade rivets throiugh th epieces of meteal you wish to rivet. and put bottom in header. cut the protruding piece to lentgh and pein the other end. If you want to get real fancy make a top header the same way as teh bottom.. finish the rivet by hitting that tool to final shape the top of rivet...check and see if rivet is tight...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Einhorn Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 I have some that are 1.25" and some a touch longer I think. One batch is steel and the other is listed as tinner's rivets I think.... The are 1/8" diameter and I am trying to rivet two or three layers of 28 guage tinplate. The other thing I am using them for is to connect my bucket bands which are 2 layers of 16 guage steel. Having a little better luck there. I'll work on the hammer blows tonight. I doubt I get a hundred done though... If I understand correctly you are trying to rivet .014"/ 28 gauge and .065"/16 gauge sheets using rivets that are 1.25" long and 1/8" diameter. --- The rivets are much too long and too thick for what you are trying to rivet. What you need is to get much shorter, much smaller diameter, and softer rivets, and tooling that are intended for the application that you are using. Trying to use rivets that are too long, too large a diameter, too hard and without the right tooling is defeating and frustrating yourself before you start. Be kind to yourself and reduce your frustration by using the right rivets so that we can enjoy hearing from your continuing progress over the years ahead. ;-)http://www.ullrich.c...lind_rivets.phphttp://national-stoc...120-00-222-3663 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 8, 2012 Share Posted February 8, 2012 Note that if you don't want the shape of a drilled hole for your rivet head you can drive the hot stock onto a ball bearing to get a more hemispherical one. (or pre-drill and then "drift" with the ball bearing) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Gorrell Posted February 8, 2012 Author Share Posted February 8, 2012 Hi guys. I dug around in my supplies last night and found some smaller, shorter rivets. I did not measure them but they are much smaller and worked much better on the tin. I forgot that I had them. The next time I get into my bucket projects I will concentrate more on getting the right length rivet figured out. It sounds like I will be cutting off a pile of rivets to the right length some time. Thanks for all the advise. I'll keep you posted. Too many projects, too little time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.