smokeyptbob Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 Hi all. New here and new to everything having to do with blacksmithing. I have a question i have looked into building a washtub forge and only thing i could come up with was a galvanized washtub. I know about the zinc in the tub is bad but if the tub has a thick wall of refractory cement will it even get hot enough to release the zinc from the galvanized tub? anyway thanks in advance and i have already learned a lot from this site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimsShip Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 Hey Smokey- Welcome to the site and the new hobby/addiction! I'm new to both as well, but I have learned enough in my short time here to know that you really need to stay away from anything galvanized. A wash tub would be too big for a fire pan anyway, if you want to make your own I would suggest using the excellent brake drum forge plans found here. While learning all the different tricks of the trade, I became fond of the writings of a man named Jim "Paw Paw" Wilson, only to be saddened to hear he had died recently from exposure to fumes from working with galvanized pipes. (You can read about about him here. ) and I for one will take his hard learned lesson as a rule never to be broken. Have fun, and be safe.Mod addition: Nothing wrong with the wash tub forge idea, also Jim had other serious health problems, while we admit that zink is a danger, he was not killed by the zink. Jim Wilson, to the best of my knowledge, did not die due to breathing zinc fumes (zinc oxide). Jim had COPD* and I have seen first hand his impaired breathing. It is my non-medical opinion that the exposure to zinc fumes further weakened an already impaired respiratory system and pneumonia set in. From the zinc exposure to the time of death was about 2 weeks. Although, as best I can tell, zinc did not cause his death, the zinc fumes and COPD were, most likely, the primary contributing factors. Yes it is splitting hairs, but as best I can tell, zinc fumes (inhalation of zinc oxide) causing death is not correct. I can find no articles to support a build up of zinc in the body (heavy metal poisoning) from inhalation of zinc fumes (zinc oxide). If you can provide me with a URL, please do, as I would be most interested.His shop had a lot of ventilation being open on the sides., While warning others is encouraged, the spreading of rumor and myth as so-called fact is not. see more about zink here http://www.iforgeiro...oxic-compounds/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Einhorn Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 I recommend finding and joining a blacksmithing group local to you. Then you can hopefully try out forges that other folks have before investing time and money. I also second the suggestion to stay away from heating anything galvanized, the vapors can kill you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurlyGeorge Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 Welcome to IFI. As the others have already stated, stay away from the galvanize. You surely have a car repair shop near you. Ask them if they have an old brake drum that you could get. That would make a much better forge. Also, go to your profile and update it to include your location. There's probably a smith, or six, near where you live that would be more than happy to help you get set up. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 The Tim Lively washtub forge is a well known and tested item. The metal sides will never get hot enough to burn off the galvanization. It is a much better system if you plan to make blades than a brake drum forge. as it's a linear system rather than a round one. I'm still a moderator at the neo-tribal forum Primal Fires and have know folks using a washtub forge for about a decade now. Folks it's nice to help; but if you are not familiar with something; perhaps waiting to see if someone else answers might be a good thing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurlyGeorge Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 Thomas, sorry that I spoke out of turn. But, like Jim, I don't even want to take a chance on making a freak mistake like PawPaw did. He knew what he was doing, too. And it still come back and got him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigfootnampa Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 I'll second what Thomas said. I have one of Tim Lively's videos and I am considering making one of his washtub type forges as a specialist forge for heat treating longer blades. This would be in addition to my traditional forge with cast iron firepot. I have a dream of making myself a "naganata" of 18" to 24" and mounting it on a 7 foot pole for trimming my trees! So my forge may have to be built in a trough rather than a washtub to get the required length. BTW my brother-in-law is a lifelong martial artist and has also asked for a "naganata" so I may be making at least two! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 I gave the memorial toast for Paw Paw Wilson at the Quad-State that year and I'm pretty fierce on the subject of metal fume fever; but there are times and places and warning someone off unnecessarily can be almost as bad as not warning someone as it dilutes the warning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimsShip Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 I apologize if I passed along any misinformation, but so far everyone i've mentioned my new hobby to has warned me of doing anything with galvanized metals and the dangers of fume fever, so I was just trying to pass what I thought was good information along. In Paw-Paw's last post he himself blamed his demise directly to the accident, and although I did hear he had asthma, I didn't know he had COPD. Consider my hand slapped, and my lesson learned. In the future I will keep my posts on the question side and leave the answers to the experts.Mod: Since you have learned your lesson, then you may take off the pointy hat and go play with the other smiths again :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old N Rusty Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 I am still working up the idea of using a NEW 3" sewer pipe lateral,ductile, or cast, to be the piping for a bottom blast forge the 45% leg is turned up and a blower is piped into it with 3" pipe made from a driveshaft. the bottom of the fitting can make a ash dump flapper gate . A flange for the tueer is to be found on a BIG wooden cable spool. and a rotating chip breaker fitted there. A washtub seems to be right in line with this cajun engineering. Every one now knows about the Turley mix of sand and cement 3-sand -1 part portland cement to line the washtub forge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted August 16, 2011 Share Posted August 16, 2011 Welcome aboard Bob, glad to have ya. If you'll put your general location in your header you might just be delighted to find other smiths here on IFI living within easy visiting distance. It's also really handy for us old farts when we're traveling, we don't have to rely on our memories when we're in the neighborhood and want a snack or place to nap. About galvy, it's only dangerous if heated to ignition temp in an oxy containing atmosphere. This isn't likely to happen on the outside of a forge, it's old timey normal to make the forge out of wood with clay or dirt liner. Sure it's better safe than sorry so nobody is going to raz you for being careful. AND I'm not getting on anyone who advised you to stay away from galvy, there's just a lot of over reaction. Heck, you aren't going to get zinc oxide smoked without clear and bright warning, zinc burns with a bright blue green flame seen as a flare on the surface starting in the hottest spot at around a high red or low orange. Too hot for proper brazing. It gives off a bluish white smoke that looks kind of like floating down or paper ashes or something not smoke. simply remove the work from the fire and leave the room, leaving the doors open on the way out. It's also not as toxic as it seems according to popular belief. Don't get me wrong I'm not saying it's okay to breath but it isn't going to kill you at a couple wiffs If it were I'd be dead some 50 years ago or more. Jim - Paw Paw - Wilson put himself in a massive overdose condition by loading his propane forge with cut pieces of galvy pipe to burn the zinc off. Even though he had doors open he stayed inside breathing the smoke for a sustained time. Worse, he had COPD AND didn't get help till he was hauled over his protests to the emergency room. It was completely avoidable and I'd like to have a few words with him to let him know how POed I am at his sillyness. Anyway, stay out of zinc smoke. Don't sweat galvy pipe so long as you don't put in the fire. If something makes you sick, get help and DO THAT AGAIN! Frosty the Lucky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokeyptbob Posted August 17, 2011 Author Share Posted August 17, 2011 thanks for all the replies people, but so happens that someone i work with has some ideas and is going to help me put together a coal forge pretty soon here no galvy metal or anything haha. Ill post pics up when finished Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.