Gorlimtouk Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 Hello all, I am new to forging iron/steel and decided to make the leap and give it a go: after many hours watching other blacksmiths at LARP-fair's and Historical Reënacting on several occasions. From my study: Mechanical Engineer (i'm still a student) i have basic knowledge about iron, steals, quenching and iron-carbon structures (austenistic, martensite etc.) From my first project: forging a coal noun (to stir up the coles) from an iron rod, to forging a crude cross for a friend of mine. I experienced i could not weld the irons together (yet) with my woodstoked forge using a square brick of granite for anvil (its crude but it does the job) With deep respect i now look upon the blacksmith's work and hope to learn a lot on these fora. i'll be trying to fireweld the cross next (think i'll use a gass-burner + wood or "cheat" by regular welding) and would like to thank everyone in advance for the knowledge i've already gained from these fora. Yours sincerely, Gorlimtouk any tips on projects to start on (for educational means) are welcome! a Rooky, hobby 'blacksmith' (cant call myself that yet before i get all basic skills atleast) P.S. english is a 2nd language so i'd like to apoligise in advance for any language/vocabular mistakes i make Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marksnagel Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 Welcome to IFI, No apologies needed for the language barrier. Most of us have english as our first language and we butcher it badly. First things to start with are small things that won't get you discouraged. Things like leaves, nails, random twists and curls to learn how metal moves when hot. I was told when I first started to get some modeling clay and use it to learn how metal moves under a hammer. It really does help. The most important thing to remember is safety. Look at the safety topics and read through them. There are a lot of goot things to learn there. Enjoy your new found hobby. It is great. Mark <º)))>< Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yves Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 Hi, Please tell us where you live. As for first projects, being a beginner, I looked at what I needed in my home, hooks for my pots, hooks for all the keys, mine and my woman's,bars around my butcher block to hang towels, all my shop doors have pulls now. I also attempted welding and try to do so (one or two) every day I work. I made tools for the forge, to handle the coal, the fire, hold ons for the anvil. I watch videos of brianbrazealblacksmith and try to copy his horse head. There are also the videos of Mark Aspery to copy. Copying the moves of experienced blacksmiths is, in my mind, a good way to learn while doing. Beginning in blacksmithing is like beginning to sell insurance : the apprentice buys some, sells some to his family and then to the neighbors and then... and so on. Start with your needs. You already do things for friends, you have a good start. Keep on. Good luck. Yves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorlimtouk Posted June 17, 2011 Author Share Posted June 17, 2011 Welcome to IFI, No apologies needed for the language barrier. Most of us have english as our first language and we butcher it badly. First things to start with are small things that won't get you discouraged. Things like leaves, nails, random twists and curls to learn how metal moves when hot. I was told when I first started to get some modeling clay and use it to learn how metal moves under a hammer. It really does help. The most important thing to remember is safety. Look at the safety topics and read through them. There are a lot of goot things to learn there. Enjoy your new found hobby. It is great. Mark <º)))>< I'd like to thank you for your early reply and advice in particular I'll definetly try to make some leaves and twists and nails for the iron/steel i work with (i now recall i have to make some nails to store some (bought) blacksmith made tools in the shed in a way they should be). all i need to find/make is a hole to "crop" the flat end of the nail while keeping the point sharp..(i saw the flat end made that way a few years ago) maybe i'll also try to make a mold for that precise purpose. Gorlimtouk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 Sounds like a nail header is one of you projects in the near future. Drive hooks are easier, if they are suitable to your needs. Welcome aboard. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 Forge welding is considered one of the more advanced skills; trying it out on a beginner project is rather like entering a race the first time you drive a car. There are a large number of projects described in the blueprints on this site and in the i-forge forum over at anvilfire.com. I'd suggest having fun with them for a while while you get your grounding in working hot steel. Note that all of the migration and early medieval swords were forgewelded up using charcoal. Coal wasn't a smithing fuel until the later High Middle Ages and charcoal was/is still used through today! It works better to ahve the wood fire in a different container and just move the hot coals over---or to make your own charcoal and use that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yves Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 I agree with Mr Powers. However, Mark Aspery says that you are not a forge welder until you have done 1000 welds. He adds that the ones you miss, the ones you drop, count. I only try to add a few, checking all that is said here an elsewhere and trying again the next day. I must say that if not succeeding is a frustration, you might want to stay away from welds. But being alone up here I must try and try again. And I am not frustrated with the misses, not yet. It's the only way I have, reading and trying. And I enjoy it. That is why I recommened it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 Just because forge welding is an advanced technique doesn't mean you shouldn't try it. If you succeed in welding scrap metal together then you have more useful stock for other projects! However trying to weld a project that you want or need without prior experience may lead to more frustration than necessary. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 Things you should know *first*: How to build and maintain a good fire. How to recognize the reducing part of the fire How to recognize low carbon from high carbon from high alloy steels. How to hit fast, smoothly, firmly and accurately! (Hitting too hard can bounce a weld apart or make a dry weld that fails easily) How to recognize the various working and welding temps of the various steels in practice! How to scarf a proper joint to extrude the crud when welding. The more you know the easier it is to "cheat"; but If I have a problem making a weld it's back to first principles! (I had a forge welding class in 1984 and have been welding since then. BTW) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorlimtouk Posted June 19, 2011 Author Share Posted June 19, 2011 I'll take the tips to heart, and am glad with the link provided to make nails (making the mold is a nice exercise aswell. Following the point i do need a working weld for my friend, i'll use the "electrical way" for now and try the other on scrap for a 'desert' (just let it be in the fire and see it get hot enough to weld, while forging something else as the job and reason to keep the fire up). I'm looking forward to the free-time before going off with the caravan. Thank you all for the advice and tips, i hope to report some progress and in any case: 'failures' are a succesful learning method to see what not to do, and no iron/steel is lost Yours Sincerely, Gorlimtouk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tagkver Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 hey Gorlimtouk welcome to the forum. just out of curiousity where are ya from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 A regular working fire won't get you to welding heat and just leaving your welding experiment in it while you do other things will likely oxidize it enough to make it very hard to weld indeed! On the other hand: a welding fire with "other" work in it will most likely end up with the other work burning up while you work to get the welding heat. You don't drive a formula one race car to the store to buy milk and you don't drive a regular car in a formula one race. However after your other work is done you may have a fire that will then be suitable to bring up to welding heat---lots of coke instead of green coal. It does need to be clean of clinker build up though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorlimtouk Posted June 21, 2011 Author Share Posted June 21, 2011 A regular working fire won't get you to welding heat and just leaving your welding experiment in it while you do other things will likely oxidize it enough to make it very hard to weld indeed! On the other hand: a welding fire with "other" work in it will most likely end up with the other work burning up while you work to get the welding heat. You don't drive a formula one race car to the store to buy milk and you don't drive a regular car in a formula one race. However after your other work is done you may have a fire that will then be suitable to bring up to welding heat---lots of coke instead of green coal. It does need to be clean of clinker build up though. Does make sense when u state it like that, unfortunatly its hard to make it to that heat normaly spoken as i usually stop forging after 2-3 hours to allow the neighboors to get some sleep, instead of tinkering on the workpiece. After browsing on the internet i've also seen some butane/propanegas - brick forges, wich might be the solution for it once i'm a bit more capable at the basic principles first. I'm currently trying to make some simple blacksmithing tools (currently trying to find out if i should give them a heat treatment instead of making 'm hard and brittle with quenching. Secondly i'm trying to find an interesting design to use the leaves for. In answer to another question posted: I'm from holland, nearby amsterdam (11km) Again my regards for the helpfull suggestion and tips i'm receiving Yours Sincerely, Gorlimtouk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 What a surprise; my Parents spent 4 years in Naarden and I was able to visit them several times. Leaves are often used as ornamental items for fences, railings, even mirror frames. They can be mixed with wood too if you have made a number of individual leaves and do not have a method of attaching them to steel. Nails: find people in historical houses that want hand forged nails to mount items There are several other smiths in the Netherlands, often involved in historical recreation. It would be great if you can find someone local for you to talk with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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