Anvil Rehab

[Toreus]

I bought this anvil yesterday for $60 (Canadian )




The heel was broken off and welded back on and some supports were added. The tip of the horn was built back up. Most of the edges have been welded up as well, but there is a nice section about 4in long near the horn with a nice small & smooth radius.

Question #1: What kind of makover should I give it? I'm still a beginner and I don't want to ruin the anvil by being overzealous, and so I was thinking of simply grinding smooth the tip of the horn and leaving the rest as is.

Question #2: It looks like whoever fixed it up welded it up good- what do you people think of using *some* hardy tools on it? I'm thinking it could bear hotcuts and the like- no heavy pounding.

Question #3: What on earth is it? I see a "B" on the bottom row, a "185" followed by what looks roughly like a "k" in the middle row. In the top row, I can see what looks like a "P" followed by something that could be either a "U" or an "O" and at least 3 more letters. I haven't found any markings underneath or on the feet, but I haven't completely cleaned it yet. It seems like 185lbs would be about right for the weight, but for the rest I have no clue.

What do you good people think?

[Timothy Miller]

At some point the heal broke off of that anvil. A person I would loosely call a welder reattached the heal. I doubt if those welds penetrate more than an 1/8" into the body of the anvil. under repeated heavy work it will fail but were talking about sledge hammer work most likely. It is an old English anvil probably a mousehole. I would say the welding job was a poor one judging by the irregular quality of the weld bead and the slag inclusions. This anvil is already pretty messed up It would be hard to make it worse. The face must be soft because of all of hammer marks. It was probably over heated at some point in its life. I would feel free to do anything you want to it. It could be restored but it is a big job not for the inexperienced or unmotivated not that I am saying you are. The easiest thing to do and probably smartest is to just grind it flat and clean up the edges and use it like that. It will be a good learning anvil and you can make your mistakes with out dinging up an expensive anvil and if it falls apart just weld it back.

[Sask Mark]

I 'think' I can see part of the name 'Foster' in the 2nd picture. It might be an old William Foster anvil.

[edge9001]

looks to me like in the fourth picture the "weld" (I'll call it that for now) that shows at the top of the picture is already starting to crack. it might just be the quality of the weld though. by that i mean it could be the weld quality or a crack...or both.

your right it does look like it used to say foster on the second picture


i agree use it as is. I would put as little effort into making that anvil usable as possible and devote the unused time and energy into finding an anvil that is in better shape, learn on what you have and then upgrade.... I am.

[Toreus]

I don't intend on using anything heavier than my 2.5lb regular hammer on the heel so I should be good.

Edge and Southshore:

I thought about grinding the surface smooth, but would that affect the temper or thin out the faceplate too much?

For the edges, do you suggest radiusing them until they're smooth, or...?

Sask Mark:

Now that you've named it, Foster fair jumps out at me- thanks!

[MattBower]

I think what they're saying -- and I agree -- is that this anvil is so badly banged up that nothing you do is likely to hurt it any worse. Feel free to grind yourself a smooth(ish) spot without feeling guilty.

[Mainely,Bob]

Enjoy the heel while you can,doesn`t look like it`ll be hanging around for long.Those "welds" are almost as ugly as the anvil face and look to be cracking at both corners.
A fine example of why you need to bring something to a professional when you`re in over your head.That anvil has had a hard life at the hands of someone who either didn`t know or didn`t care how to use it.
But you got it for cheap and now that you`ve taken ownership of it the future looks brighter for you both.
Hopefully your luck and that heel will hold and further down the line you`ll run into a competent welder/blacksmith who will see that anvil as a challenge and help you to stitch it up right.You will learn a lot when that happens.

[pkrankow]

Try it the way it is, see if the marks in the face transfer to your work. Edges look "good enough" to work with, but all of this can be adjusted as necessary.

When you get around to fixing it properly, you are going to remove the heel at the break, and all the attached "reinforcement". Then the heel will be cleaned and either fire welded back or full penetration electrically welded. After this a new face will need welded onto the anvil, and then hardened by heat treat, or an appropriate hard face build up and rod used.

For the size of anvil you did OK in that condition for the price. Hopefully it will help attract a better anvil.

The break is rather odd in that it does not pass through a hole like the hardy or pritchel, instead it is in a thicker piece of metal, and rather straight across.

Phil

[edge9001]

use the anvil as is or make any repairs you feel confident in doing. there really is much you can do to that anvil that already hasn't been done to it. It is a great on to learn on as there isnt much you can do to mess it up.

I would learn on it and look for an upgrade. this way you get the use of what you paid for, you get to learn, and at the same time be on the look out for a better cared for used anvil.

always remember a bad anvil is better than no anvil. atleast it's steel not stone. although that wouldn't really be bad as long as it was servicable

[Timothy Miller]

I don't intend on using anything heavier than my 2.5lb regular hammer on the heel so I should be good.

Edge and Southshore:

I thought about grinding the surface smooth, but would that affect the temper or thin out the faceplate too much?

For the edges, do you suggest radiusing them until they're smooth, or...?

Sask Mark:

Now that you've named it, Foster fair jumps out at me- thanks!

I don't think that that anvil has any temper left to it. For a anvil face to get that beat up it has to be somewhat soft to begin with. If there is still some temper left in the steel face as long as you don't over heat it wile grinding you will do it no harm. I would agree it is probably a foster anvil.

[ThomasPowers]

I agree; I'd bet it's been through a fire---might see if you could get a local VoTech to preheat and hardface that anvil!

[Bentiron1946]

Build a nice fire in the forge, get a piece of steel hot and start forging, learn all that you can about hammer control and then find a better anvil. As to grinding it smooth, well you aren't going to hurt it any, someone else already did that for you. Heck yeah I'd dress that horn up some and radius the edges some you don't want that ugly welding transferring to your work but I don't know that I spend a lot of time on the face, it'll just get all beat to pieces again it's so soft. Trade up later of keep for an upsetting anvil to set on the floor when you start to work big 2" pieces of bar stock. It'll be real handy sitting on the floor. I just don't think I would ever spend the money to make this anvil right again, it's just to far gone and you got better things to spend money on. <_<

[Dragons lair]

Some of you would really be suprised what a 300lb idiot with a 8lb sledge can do.
had one show up at my welding/smithy shop. Broke off the horn and the heel on a 72lb H-B using said 8lb sledge. Wanted to know if I would weld um back on for $25. Told him I would fix it for $500 plus any heat treat. Glad he walked. Put a horn on my 88lb H-B nobody has found the weld yet. I will share the trick with ya all. for a horn drill and tap both pieces(my horn was a 3.5" rb)Screw toghter.
grind a groove to the 3/4" stud then weld. Would think 2 studs for a heel. Use may snap a weld but the stud(s) will hold.
Ken.

[Timothy Miller]

Some of you would really be suprised what a 300lb idiot with a 8lb sledge can do.
had one show up at my welding/smithy shop. Broke off the horn and the heel on a 72lb H-B using said 8lb sledge. Wanted to know if I would weld um back on for $25. Told him I would fix it for $500 plus any heat treat. Glad he walked. Put a horn on my 88lb H-B nobody has found the weld yet. I will share the trick with ya all. for a horn drill and tap both pieces(my horn was a 3.5" rb)Screw toghter.
grind a groove to the 3/4" stud then weld. Would think 2 studs for a heel. Use may snap a weld but the stud(s) will hold.
Ken.

That still wont give him a hard face on the anvil.

[Dragons lair]

No it woun't give him a hard face If he lost it. My H*b only had the horn snapped off . No losse of hard face. IF ya snap off either end It do not affect the HF. If that were the case ya could never repair a frame or assy. As said before I have had senior smiths not find which anvil has the horn replaced.

[Mainely,Bob]

The beauty of something like this anvil is that if you can pick something like this up for scrap price then chances are the worst that can happen is you take a small loss if scrap prices drop.
The hard part is convincing the seller that the object in front of him is not really an anvil but is only scrap steel and should be priced as such.There are people who haul better than this to the yards in Portland so it happens more than you think.

Once you get it home you can use this as a test bench to test and gain skills and practice techniques for both repair and heat treating.If it fails you lost nothing but time as opposed to sacrificing an easily repairable anvil to questionable techniques.
Tools that were once hardened and tempered and have been annealed by a shop fire can be brought back.Heat treating is not a one shot deal as any tool maker or bladesmith can tell you.As long as the surface steel hasn`t been oxidized too deeply you still have the potential to bring a good tool back from the dead.

There are those of us that have an excess of spare time but a shortage of cash(commonly called retirement)and anvils like this one are a fine challenge to pit yourself against.Luckily the challenge also requires a young assistant to move things around and position things.
Anvil gets saved,youth gets education and smokin` deal(perhaps trade for labor) on his first "real" anvil,win-win in my book. :)

[Timothy Miller]

No it woun't give him a hard face If he lost it. My H*b only had the horn snapped off . No losse of hard face. IF ya snap off either end It do not affect the HF. If that were the case ya could never repair a frame or assy. As said before I have had senior smiths not find which anvil has the horn replaced.

What i am saying is that the face of this anvil is soft you can see this by all of the hammer marks on it. Even if you weld the heal back on using correct welding procedure it is still a soft faced anvil. To correct that he would have as far as I know 3 choices all very labor intensive and highly skilled processes.

1. Reharden the anvil face If the steel face in fully intact you will need a large fire and a fire hose to get enough water. You would have to know the proper harding temp for this unknown type of steel though it is probably shear steel.

2. Hard face the whole face of the anvil with hardfaceing rod expensive and time consuming . You rae talking about a full days work at least and about $150 consumables.

3. Weld on a new hard steel face plate. If done by forge welding this takes a team of skilled strikers and a very large fire this has only been done a hand full of times in the last 75 years. then go back to step 1. Some people arc weld on the steel plate using studs and a deep penetrating weld around the edge this is probably your most attractive option.