OK, so I've searched the forums (probably missed something somewhere though ) and I can't seem to find anything on leaves and vines...

I'm not have a problem with the leaves so much...getting those down pretty good I think.

The vine/stem on the other hand...

I usually start the leaf/vine combination with either 3/8" or 1/2" diamter round stock (scrap yard find, so no clue what steel it is).

I taper the end about 1" to 2" from the end, then fuller on the edge of the anvil to make the "neck" or beginning of the stem.

Cut it off about 3 or 4 inches long (from the base of the leaf) then start drawing it out.

Frustrating part is, I can't seem to get the stem to reduce in diameter very far.

Don't know if I'm just being impatient, need to work on hammer control, tong control, or what.

Getting the piece plenty hot (very bright yellow. hard to look at sometimes), so I know that's not it.

Any ideas?

Start with a square taper on the end of the stem and work it to the size you desire, as you do that work it back to the leaf. When you get to the rough size you desire for the full length of the stem, start to make it octagon then round for the finished stem. - JK

Edited November 22, 200916 yr by jeremy k

Makes me wonder what kind of metal it is assuming you know how to draw it out

What comes to my mind is, use the pien end and make a series of divots in a fairly ordered progression, on all 4 sides. Then come back and forge the divots out. It's also fun to use a rounding hammer on the horn, you get actions on 2 sides of your work. Square, Octagon, Round.

Makes me wonder what kind of metal it is assuming you know how to draw it out

Well, I'm fairly certain it's mild steel.

I'm also assuming that I'm using the right definition of the phrase "drawing out". Longer and thinner.

Is this done in other ways as well? (no power hammer here, by the way)

David

A lot of it is hammer selection, or where on the anvil.
You have to understand HOW to move the metal.
To make my stems, I either use a rounded corner of the anvil or my cross peen, to PUSH the metal in the long direction, then use a rounding hammer to round and clean it up.

What happens when it stops getting smaller? Is it flattening? Do you rotate the stock 90 degrees ocasionaly?

definitely use a fuller, and work between the divots, it goes wayyyyy faster!

For that size material you hardly need a fuller. Your hammer will draw it out fine. But in drawing out always hammer out a square taper first, then octagon and then round. Actually for vines it looks great to stop at octagon and do some back and forth twisting. That will give it more life.

Don't have a fuller or a rounding hammer (not even a hardy hole on my anvil).

Coal forge, Anvil, cross peen hammer and a couple of ball peens. Just starting out in blacksmithing. still building tool inventory.

I think I'll try Mr. Larkin's idea of "use a rounded corner of the anvil or my cross peen, to PUSH the metal in the long direction" tomorrow. I'll let you know how it goes.

Thanks for the advice all.

David

May I suggest reading Hofi's hammer techniques?

BP1001 Hofi Hammer Technique

BP1002 Hofi Hammer Technique

BP0344 Hammer Technique

I think you will find it very useful and helpful considering your available tools.

Don't have a fuller or a rounding hammer (not even a hardy hole on my anvil).

I think I'll try Mr. Larkin's idea of "use a rounded corner of the anvil or my cross peen, to PUSH the metal in the long direction" tomorrow. I'll let you know how it goes.

Well, I took the advice that I *could* use (it was all good advice, but some didn't apply to my situation)

I *think* I did ok. the stem/vines seemed to turn out a bit better, although I'm still not *quite* happy with how they came out. Probably just need to be a bit more patient (you would think that after 15 years of weaving thousands of tiny rings into clothing, I would *have* enough patience. lol)



The viening on the leaves aren't as good as they could be, I think because I don't have any way to hold the piece on the anvil while I get the chisel in place before striking. Working on figuring out a hold down tool that wouldn't require a hardy hole. Tried using a C-Clamp, but can't get it to hold tight enough :confused:

comments? Suggestions?

Thanks, David

Working over the rounded horn of the anvil can help speed up the drawing out process.

There's a definite improvement there! Well done!

I've got an effective and simple hold down tool on my anvil. It consists of a section of motorcycle chain, which is nailed to the stump on the opposite side from which you normally work. Then it's draped over the top of the anvil, and the other end is attached to a square of steel big enough to put your foot into.

How it works is you position your workpiece on the anvil, with the chain across it. Put your foot in the "stirrup" to apply pressure, which holds the piece, leaving your hands free.

I bought my anvil with the "hold-down" attachment already in place, and it's really handy. Can be made easily from scrap!

Take a piece of chain long enough to go over your anvil and much of the way to the ground and fasten the chain to your stump. Put the chain on top of your work, or a piece of flat stock that you slide your work under.

Not ideal, but it keeps stuff from leaving the anvil. If you don't like it take it off. You probably have a chain in your garage to try with.

Phil

Tzonqua has it better. I just used a piece of chain I use landscaping 5/16 inch.

The left leaf does look really good, better than mine.
Phil

Edited November 22, 200916 yr by pkrankow

http://www.iforgeiron.com/forum/f11/hold-down-11139/

Think you might get some help from this thread.

Arftist, I really hate to be a jerk, but how would a thread about several different hardy tools help someone with no hardy hole?
If I *had* a hardy hole, I probably would have come up with these already (or read the threads on hardy tools)

Thanks for the thought though.

You could probably alter that spring loaded job to bridge your anvil with 2 springs instead of one. If you have a couple of springs around, or even weights and string, making a U shaped bar to go over the anvil would be quite easy.

Phil

Hey Dragon Dropping,
you DO have a fuller. the pein on your hammer and the edge of your anvil!

and even with mild steel you can easily (more practice here) draw your 3/8 rod down to way less than 1/8 inch. Practice being the key

With practice you can put a sharper point on that rod than you could with a file. And then stick your self repeatedly with it while finishing the handle end of the steakturner :rolleyes: