farmer12888 Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 My Fairbanks Model B arrived today. What a hammer it is. However, it was completely covered in grease, and I spent the day spraying engine degreaser, scraping and wiping. I did not find a single grease fitting on the hammer. I found some holes where I believe there should be lubrication points, but no fittings. Do they have grease fittings and where or are they oiled somehow? I don't understand why someone would remove the fittings, if that is what was done. Any information would be greatly appreciated. I am considering tearing the hammer down and completely rebuilding it, after I use it for a brief time, just to have it as close to new as possible. Has anyone ever rebuilt one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Einhorn Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Is it possible that they were afraid that grease fittings would break off in transit? If you have some extra standard grease fittings laying around, you could see if they fit/screw-into the suspect openings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farmer12888 Posted October 9, 2009 Author Share Posted October 9, 2009 I will ask the seller/shipper if they removed them, but it does not look like anything was recently removed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Einhorn Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 In my humble experience old equipment seem to loose parts. I recently acquired a metal lathe that is missing a lot of parts due to both the efforts of the second owner to modernize it, and from just plain loosing parts and attachments each time it changed hands. I would not be surprised if someone removed grease fittings or oilers from your hammer either to prevent catching themselves on projections, or when moving it at some point in time, or due to some quirky and/or creative reasoning. Perhaps someone can clarify for me. Do I remember correctly that some older equipment routinely had its oilers and lubrication fittings removed during operation, perhaps for safety reasons? That seems to bounce around the back of my head for some reason. Years back I purchased a wood lathe from a batch of lathes for auction that day, and just about all the missing parts and attachments were for sale in a separate single box (that one of the "gentlemen" sort of pushed behind some junk). I talked to one of the auction guys and he assisted me in putting crucial parts back on each of the lathes, much to the upset and vigorous protest of two of the gentlemen there. It just seems that the older a tool is and the more it change hands, the more parts that tool has an opportunity to loose. :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farmer12888 Posted October 9, 2009 Author Share Posted October 9, 2009 Any idea where the lubrication points should be? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Einhorn Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 From these photographs, one can see what you mean my some pretty interesting holes at what appears to be lubrication points. At least in these 10 photographs they look like oil holes because of how the parts attached to those pivot points would appear to move. Fairbanks power hammer, Fairbanks forging hammer, Fairbank hammer, Fairbanks model B - Marteau-pilon Fairbanks, marteau pilon m Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 (edited) The factory literature shown in "A Blacksmith's and Hammerman's Emporium" By Doug Freund, does not have any oilers or grease fitting as far as I can see. Many of these old machines just had drilled holes and you were expected to give them a squirt every once in awhile. I have had many old machines that were this way, just need to keep an oil can handy. Some folks like to use "way oil" or chainsaw oil because it's kinda "tacky" and stays on better. There does appear to be a "trough" reservoir in the top of the connecting rod. Edited October 9, 2009 by nakedanvil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Any idea where the lubrication points should be? All of the pivot point in the linkage should have little oil holes, plus the connecting rod, crank shaft, and ram guides. What kind of clutch do you have on this machine? Let's see some pictures! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Rebuilding: Main shaft bearing appear to be pressed in sleeve type, wouldn't worry about those unless you have a lot of slop there. Rod bearing can often be taken up by grinding the cap to close up the clearance a little. Really loose linkage pins can be replaced or the holes reamed out larger and over-size pins made. Tightening the guides will depend on the style of guides on the hammer. Take some pictures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farmer12888 Posted October 9, 2009 Author Share Posted October 9, 2009 The link that Unicorn posted to with the pictures is the hammer that I now own. I am not sure of the clutch design, but I think it is supposed to be superior to the Little Giant type. I need to learn all of these things about the machine. I will look for oil holes, but as you can see from the pictures in the link, the hammer is pretty greasy, so finding them will be a challenge until I can get it cleaned. The bushings for the shaft are bronze I believe. It just seems like they would have put grease fittings on there somewhere, but maybe everything that I think is grease on the machine may just be years of oil being squirted around. Do you mean chainsaw bar oil? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Oil was always the preferred lubricant, grease was for things that couldn't get regular attention. If you have the internal clutch and not the slack-belt you will want to keep that well oiled too. I know that doesn't sound right, but it's true. If you have the “box” style guides, check to see if there are any shims under the cover, otherwise you need to machine down the bolt surface of the cover to tighten the guides. Usually you have too much machined off so that it is a simple matter to shim it out for a nice running fit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farmer12888 Posted October 9, 2009 Author Share Posted October 9, 2009 Thanks for the info. It sounds as if I have some real looking over the machine to do, once I get it cleaned up a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimenickel Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 greasy is a good thing... at least someone cared in the past to keep it maintained.. mine has little oil holes here and there... just like previously mentioned... on the guides, it has little criss cross channels for the oil to follow the top bearings on mine have a weird sort of grease cup... you fill it with grease and turn the top to give the bearings a shot of lube.. i did chase all the oil galleries... as some of them were plugged solid with about 60years worth of crud... are you gonna keep it with the flat belt ? Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Oh, that IS your hammer! Well, looks like you have a slack-belt clutch. No, you don't oil that, of course. Fabric works, but real leather works the best. Make sure the motor is turning the right direction. The motor "pulls" on one side of the belt, and the idler needs to be on the other side. Seen a number of hammers set up wrong, makes a big difference. If the tight side is toward the idler, when it pulls tight it pushes the idler away, which requires more pressure on the treadle and takes away fine control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 dimenickle: What would he use if not the flat belt? They work really good for clutching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimenickel Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 (edited) that was my thinking.. i see alot of people switch out the flats for rubber v belts..... i had trouble setting mine up but after that i really like the way the flat belt works.. great machines.. ah now that i see what you mean about the slack belt clutch.... rubber would definitely be out of the question Edited October 9, 2009 by dimenickel had to reread it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farmer12888 Posted October 9, 2009 Author Share Posted October 9, 2009 More good info guys. Yes, that hammer is actually my hammer now. The flat belt leather appears to be in decent shape. It is quite old, however. I was thinking about the clutch in my mind, and of course you are correct. It works by creating slack on the belt. Is this setup good or not great? The motor and bracket were taken off for shipping, so I need to figure out how they had it mounted tomorrow, and that is why the clutch setup didn't immediately click to me. How did you chase the oil passages, and can you describe exactly where they are? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dimenickel Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Hi that was the fun part... basically pb blaster till it loosens up... use a wire with a flat hammered on the end and try to loosen it up... by diggin in the gallery did the same with the grease fitting on mine.... worked out the old solid grease and ran 80/90 oil through it for a couple days while running it... then refilled with new grease.. i got some pic's of mine... ofcourse its a different brand of hammer but it'll give you an idea Greg notice the hole ontop of the guide.... it lead internally to the v on the channel and has a hole to the back of the guide.... i fill em up with 80/90 at the start of the day... the hammer works nice n easy now... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkrankow Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Is trying to set up automatic oiling more work than it is worth? Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkunkler Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 One advantage of manual oiling any machine is that as you oil the lube points you can get in the habit of visually and manualy inspecting for wear and parts working loose or other damage. You can catch a problem before things start flying apart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Dimenickle: O.K. you have a different layout and clutch. Farmer has a slack-belt clutch where flat leather works best, besides he'd have to take the hammer apart to put in "v" belts with that inboard wheel. I find Slack-belt clutches to be nearly the best, your mileage may vary. Too many little linkage points to even think about auto oiling. It's really quite easy once you get used to it. There's kind of a "Zen" quality to that kind of TLC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
farmer12888 Posted October 9, 2009 Author Share Posted October 9, 2009 I have been working on the hammer more this morning. My clutch does appear to work by slack/tension on the belt, but there is also a mechanism inside the pulley/flywheel that is applying tension by some type of shoes or something expanding and contracting in there. Should this be disassembled and checked? All of the lubrication sites on the hammer appear to be oil holes. There are often two at each location. There are two grease fittings on the motor shaft bearings, but that is it for grease fittings. I have taken a bunch of pictures, and I will try to figure out how to post some of them this evening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nakedanvil - Grant Sarver Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 That would be the brake. Because it's cast iron against cast iron you can keep it oiled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcraigl Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 The mechanism inside the flywheel may be a brake? Never run this type of hammer so not sure, but a brake is a real nice thing to have. Doh! Grant beat me to it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Judson Yaggy Posted October 9, 2009 Share Posted October 9, 2009 Grant is correct, it is indeed a brake. See my post in your other thread on Fairbanks hammers for an adjustment tip. If you've been working on it all day you've probably found all the oil points, but probably the 2 that are most prone to being missed are the one in the idler wheel (centered on the curved working face of the pulley, perpendicular to the axle) and the ones in the top of the ram where the ram keys into the guides on the frame of the hammer. As someone else already noted these are for lubing the ram guides, but as they are both critical and hard to spot I thought I'd mention 'em again. Happy hammering! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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