TimB Posted August 5, 2009 Share Posted August 5, 2009 Well, I been content for now just banging away at hot metal, trying different things with my hammers, and generally getting the feel of the art. I took a 3/4" residential furnace blower shaft, upset the end a bit, drew out a 1/4" square handle, then flattened the upset end, into a 2" round, intending on bending it over a 1 1/8" trailer hitch ball. I had originally attempted to use the ball as the anvil, to form the dipper bowl as I worked the upset shaft end, but found that it wanted to stretch more length ways than width ways, so I took it back to the anvil and worked it out width ways with the cross pein, and the hammer edge. Once again I took it to the ball, but found the hot handle was twisting, before the ladle would wrap around the ball. I started heating the ladle only, leaving the handle cold where it meets the ladle,-- and wallah, now it is cracked, at the stress point, where the ladle would try to twist at the point it meets the handle. Evidently, I get to try my hand at forge welding soon, too. Wrapping a flat circle, around a sphere, results in some folds, which in my imagination, worked beautifully for a pour spout, but at my anvil...didn't. I would like some suggestions / comments, please. I assume there are more than I would think to ask for. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medieval Posted August 5, 2009 Share Posted August 5, 2009 I didn't understand the first part of that post, but if you forge a spoon, ladle, etc. it is easier to sink it rather than form it around a sphere. Sink it then planish it hot over the sphere, using light blows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragons lair Posted August 5, 2009 Share Posted August 5, 2009 Tim, May I suggest just get a Lee Pot always the same heat makes for better bullets. Yeah primitive is cool but modern methods give better results. Shoot a .32 and .45 Ken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
divermike Posted August 5, 2009 Share Posted August 5, 2009 I have a lot of empathy for you, that very issue has cropped up with me, so as not to lose all the work, mig it and grind it and then reforge and hammer to hide the weld, or you can try to forge weld it, but I wouldn't do it, too skinny for a beginner. it would likely burn up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JNewman Posted August 5, 2009 Share Posted August 5, 2009 I would say it is time to start over again. All is not lost though, you learned attempting the first. I don't know what the shaft was made of but it may have some extra carbon. I just bought 10' of 3/4" round yesterday and it was only $10. When you are making your lollypop use the pein on your hammer to draw the width out faster to keep it round. Obviously a swage block makes making a ladle shape must easier (Shameless plug). But you can use the hardy hole to sink into as long as the top corners are well rounded. You can also use a block of wood to sink into, hardwood works better but use what you can get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Ameling Posted August 5, 2009 Share Posted August 5, 2009 Simplest method is to forge it out FLAT and round. Then "sink" it down into a bowl form. I hammer down into a hollowed out spot on the end of an oak log. It does scorch/burn the wood, but that just evens out the bowl shape in the wood. And end-grain doesn't burn too much. The deeper your bowl depression in the wood, the easier it can be to dish your dipper more. Or hammer down into an iron ring laying on your anvil. The ring supports the outside while your hammer pushes the metal down into it. The old Vikings and Romans used a section of square bar bent into a circle as a "sinking" block. I've made a number of small bullet melting dippers from simple sheet iron - like 18 to 12 gauge. I cut out a "keyhole" shape, then hammer it cold down into that depression in a wood block. And the flared bottom end I hammer into a tapered cone for a handle, or to put a wood stick in to use it over a fire. 18 gauge works very well for cold forming, but 12 gauge goes faster/easier when hot. Yes, a ... flex point ... even in hot iron will get brittle and crack/break if you flex it enough times. If your bowl snaps off, then you can salvage it by forging up a separate handle and then attach it to the bowl - either by riveting it onto that bowl, or weld it on. Just another "character building experience" along the way. And another way that the "scrap pile" gets added to! Mikey - that grumpy ol' German blacksmith out in the Hinterlands Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drewed Posted August 5, 2009 Share Posted August 5, 2009 Make the bowl first, then worry about the handle. Most of the stuff I make gets all bent out of shape while working on it. I just straighten it up when I'm done with the hard stuff. Heck, sometimes I bend it on purpose to get into the hot part of the fire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimB Posted August 23, 2009 Author Share Posted August 23, 2009 Thanks all for your insights. A little update. Well, I finally made myself a lead dipper, and was casting some more bullets. My melting pot was an old sauce pan I had laying around in the garage, and I used my coal forge as a stove to heat it with. I made my forge from an old propane tank that I cut the top off of, about 2" deep. I took the valve out of it and screwed a piece of 3/4" pipe into where the valve was screwed in. I had a piece of 3/8" pipe screwed into a "Tee" in the 3/4" pipe, which my PSI regulator and compressor hose hooked onto. This apparatus formed the duct for the forge combustion air to force up into the coal bed in the inverted propane tank lid. The other side of the "Tee" had another length of 3/4" pipe screwed into it to form the stand. So anyways, I set my metal sauce pan of lead on this forge, and my dipper was working pretty well, until the lead in the pan started getting cool, (Generally a sign that a clinker is forming over the air inlet, but this time, because I turned the air down) so I turned up the air, higher than before, to heat up the lead faster, before my mold cooled off too much. It worked pretty good, till supper, when I shut it down. Curious thing though, my forge was peculating, probably because the liquid clinker forming at the air inlet was so hot and big by now. Tonight I go out there to fire up my forge and the air doesn't work. I got it all working right but air just wont flow through the forge. Fast Forward... I had to get the lead out. Evidently the pot I was using to melt the lead in was aluminum, and I hadn't realized it, but I burned a hole in the bottom of it and the lead drained out and filled my air duct solid. Note to self...don't use an aluminum pan to melt lead in over a coal fire.:rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimB Posted August 23, 2009 Author Share Posted August 23, 2009 Tim, May I suggest just get a Lee Pot always the same heat makes for better bullets. Yeah primitive is cool but modern methods give better results. Shoot a .32 and .45 .45 Colt ? I'ld like to get a lee pot, but right now I don't have the money. Maybe some day. Maybe sooner after my latest adventure :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfDuck Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 Tim any metal container that is .........STEEL.......will work, but it would have been funnier to watch your face if it happened right in front of you; instead of when you went in the house. Thanks for the new material for the comic strip! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragons lair Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 Tim, not colt .32 and .45 round and maxi balls for my TC Cherokee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimB Posted August 23, 2009 Author Share Posted August 23, 2009 There ya go! .54 CVA here, 410 gr. minnie ball, but I'd like to get a .45 mold. Probbably a 255 gr. for both my colt and acp, if I can find some reload info for a .255 cast for ACP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimB Posted August 23, 2009 Author Share Posted August 23, 2009 Thanks for the new material for the comic strip! Any time amigo! In fact, pretty much exactly that, --any time. I pretty regularly have $100K AFV winners, just no one around video taping the moment is all. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimmy seale Posted August 23, 2009 Share Posted August 23, 2009 i don't know about a colt 45.but a 45 auto. is .451 diamiter and heaviest i have seen is 230 gr. a lot of castors use a 154 ? grn.i think. but please check dia.so you don't blow up a weapon and hurt yourself. remind me and i have a book with cast bullit data, maybe i can help you out,jimmy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welder19 Posted August 24, 2009 Share Posted August 24, 2009 Find your self a hot plate, a single elec. stove burner, they work good for melting lead and you get an even and consistent heat, don't have to worry about overheating it. Also a warning for anyone who doesn't know, melting lead gives off toxic fumes that can be very, very bad for your health, it is best done outside and/or with a respirator. welder19 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
divermike Posted August 24, 2009 Share Posted August 24, 2009 Tim, it's great to hear stories like yours, encouraging in fact!! Thanks for sharing, I know that misery loves company, and my goofups sometimes leave me in a state of awe, and to hear others admit to them is just a real prod to get out and screw something else up!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimB Posted August 25, 2009 Author Share Posted August 25, 2009 LOL!!!:D:D Hey, if I can't be a good example, at least I can be a good bad example. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimB Posted August 25, 2009 Author Share Posted August 25, 2009 i don't know about a colt 45.but a 45 auto. is .451 diamiter and heaviest i have seen is 230 gr. a lot of castors use a 154 ? grn.i think. but please check dia.so you don't blow up a weapon and hurt yourself. remind me and i have a book with cast bullit data, maybe i can help you out,jimmy That's what I was thinking too. Some molds I've seen advertise their 255gr. bullet as for .45 colt and ACP, which I thought would be handy to get one mold for both--though it's a little lighter than I wanted for the colt, and a little heavy for the Auto--but I wasn't convinced it would work out that way. The ones I've seen tended to be .452". Though I've done a lot of reloading for the auto with 230's, (store bought lead) I don't recall seeing any data for 255's ever. Thanks for the input. I been thinking about getting back into reloading, after about 10 years away from it. I know I've seen my books around here recently, but I can't seem to track them down when I want to. :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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