JPH

Here's a little something I hammered out and did up yesterday while killing a couple of hours.. 1095 and wrought iron flat lam 12" blade, leaf shaped with bronze grip panels...OAL 17 1/4". I think it turned out pretty good...This is destined for RPFS that starts in two weeks.... JPH

Hey All: Ok on the hard/soft layer thing..this was a theory for centuries...and only recently, in the last 20 years or so answered by the truth as far as carbon migration goes.. CAN one get both hard and soft layers in a Laminate? YES only IF you add a carbon barrier material like pure Ni (or something else that doesn't "absorb" carbon). Now I was as "guilty" (or mislead) as everyone else was, we simply didn't know better.....It wasn't until folks like Daryl Mier, Howard Clark, myself and a few others really started to look "into this stuff" that we found we were flat out WRONG about that. I even put it in print about the hard/soft layers in my first book...We didn't know that stuff back in the 1980's when we first started to really get into it... By the time the welding is done, and without the afore mentioned barrier, if you are using 1010 or wrought iron and 1095, all you are doing is making really expensive 1050.....the carbon has prety much difussed/migrated until it is more or less homogenous in the bar. All in all it was a decent article..no need to pick it apart..at least I don't think there is... JPH

geeze...just solder on a bezel and set the stone...it's not that hard people.....a bezel is a very thinn piece of sheet metal..usualy copper, silver or gold and you roll it over the edge of the stone...usually the stone is backed by sawdust and that covered by foil to give a reflective surface so the stone isn't too "dark" in appearence... JPH

Quench: Oh come on guys....the man is a living legend.. while anyone in blacksmithing has to have a basic understanding of metals and metallurgy, even if it is on a working level of knowledge...Mr Fogg has taken this way beyond that...WAY WAY BEYOND... Now a lot of folks, simply because he is self taught (as I am) would discount working knowledge and experience. If it was up to me I'd give him a PhD from the School of Hard Knocks. OK.... Granted I eventually got my sheepskin, and that's only cause I was really, really interested in what is going on INSIDE the steels while they are being worked. The "store bought" education only confirmed what I suspected was happening...I am dead sure Mr Fogg could do the same as I did and cause all sorts of problems for the instructors who probably never worked anything hotter than a cup of coffee. Ya know..a while back the folks at "The Fabricator" as well as the folks from ASM asked me to write a pattern welding article...maybe I should look them up... JPH

Da: yeah I know the type..usually they last until they get their first burn or run their knuckles into the grinder and then they vanish, never to be heard from again...YOu really need to have that hunger to learn and accept the failures as well as the successes...And believe me I have had more than my fair share of failures...I probaly made just about every mistake a mortal man could make doing this short of blowing myself up..(at least not yet)... It all comes down to the person actually doing it. A wise man once told me that experience is what you get when you don't get what you wanted.... Truer words were never uttered... JPH

Da: It's all done the same way you get to Carnegie Hall... Practice, practice and practice, but I will admit that I did learn from the best in the world, the late Mr Robert Engnath. Besides being a true "Grinder God" he was my best friend and I miss that man every day. His "personal best" if my memory serves was to grind out 139 blades in an 10 hour day. He was also one of the finest black and white scrimshanders that ever lived..besides he was almost as demented as I am...When he died a part of my soul died with him. He was the Godfather to my three children. A really GOOD man and he is sorely missed. No, I don't use any sort of jigs or anything..Although I do work from forgings which means my grind time is minimal, which is good cause I HATE to grind. I will be giving Frankengrinder the final phase in its testing next week when I start in on my yearly sword production. As it is right now I have cut about 1/3 of my grinding time and am getting about 50% more belt life ao I am pleased, very pleased with that... Once you get the "feel" for it, grinding is not all that difficult, you just need to do ALOT of it and with my production rate, I do... Still I am much happier swinging a hammer than standing in front of the grinder humming "I'm Henry the 8th I am.." over and over again..or if I am in a especially patriotic mood..the "Battle Hymn of the Republic"... JPH

Bruce: I just belly up to the beast and hold it in my hands..cuts smooth and even too!! It's just practice....that's all it is... Boy can I ever see the difference in the grind from my old 8" wheel and my new 14" wheel....much easier to maintain the distal taper on the 14" wheel than it was on the 8" one.... JPH

Hello! Well these are the first three blades off of Frankengrinder..and what a monster I created. 5 HP, 7000 SFM, 14" contact wheel... This puppy EATS steel (and fingers too, I found out... but oh well)..All three are welded cable, with my "bovine ivory" grips and bronze bolster and pommel plates with some file work to spiffy them up a bit. Hope the photo works.. Well back to work for me...got some war hammers to finish up.. JPH

Travis: You weld the "blade" section together, and usually you insert a pice of medium or high carbon steel at the edge and weld that closed. You do NOT weld the eye...it's rather simple really...Harder to explain that it is to actually do really.. JPH

Hello: Having made a couple of these..I have to ask..what kind of cable? I mean the grade of steel, the number of strands, the type of twist etc? Also, please explain your hardening and tempering process. I may be able to tell you what happened... JPH

Bruce: Yeah...more or less..Born in Sharon, raised in New Castle...right between Pittsburgh and Youngstown..closer a ways to YOungstown than Pittsburgh though. My family owned a lot of property, that they bought when they came from the "Old Countries" inclusing a small farm outside of town heading towards Ohio and a night club/bar/grill on East Washington. My Mum use to work for Shanango Pottery part time as a glazer. She worked on the place settings for Pres and Mrs. Eisenhower (so she told me..). So I am still what I would consider a Pennsylvania Farm Boy..even though I hate the cold and snow is the devil's doing.... JPH

Hello: In response..I am not sure Mr Hickory is still alive..I was like 12 at the time I met him, after reading a rather obscure book printed in I think 1770/1771ish in France by Jean J. Perret entitled "LaArte Du Le Coutlier" (I am going from memory here the title may be a bit off rough translation : "The Art of the Cutler") where Mon. Perret goes into great detail over the making of pattern welded steels. The one section that comes into mind is the chapters under the title "Maniere de Faire L'Acre de Falcon de Damas(cus?)" Rough translation: "Steel Making in the Damascus Style".. Now my French is terrible but some of my childhood friends could read it so they translated it for me at the time..I really bugged them about it too. So the information was out there in the 1960's and 1970's..if a 12 year old Pennsylvania farm boy could find an obscure book like that, well a grown man shouldn't have any problems..Anyway..... I took that book as the gospel incarnate as far as pattern welding and I ran with it from there for many years afterwards. Mon. Perret did the "Liberte" bar, a bar of steel when cut revealed the words "Liberte Equalite Fraternite" when cut into/on the centre axis of the bar. This was after the French Revolution, supposedly made around 1790ish or so. Again I am going from memory here. In fact it was his work that I based most of my research on at the time and well, like I said, I was a kid back then and had hardly any resources other than the New Castle, Pennsylvania Public Library and family/friends, most of which were still in the "Old Countries".. So I was able to find this book..took some wheeling and dealing but if I could get it..anyone could at the time.. I still have it around here someplace in my library..safe..so safe I don't even remember where it is safely stored at any more!! Now it's gonna bug me till I find it!! Anyway...the process was never lost..it's just that Bill Moran got all the press for "Ffinding it again" when it wasn't reeally "lost" to begin with!..Simple as that..and ya know what? That's OK with me 100%!!..it will all even out in the end..As long as the art stays alive and the traditional ways are not forgotten, personally, I don't care who gets what credit wise. It's all bigger than that... JPH

Hello: Knowing a little bit abouit this stuff..I was pattern welding back in 1972..Beau Hickory was pattern welding back in the 1950's.... Up until WWII several shotgun makers were offering pattern welded barrels, and some premium shotgun makers still offer nitro proofed welded barrles today. Why people say that the process was "lost" is beyond me..In fact the German cutlery makers were doing presentation daggers and swords for the Germans in WWII as well. In answer to your question...in regards to the US Civil War.. the answer would have to be yes. Given the fact that most steels used by smaller firms then were blister or shear steel, when etched, depending upon the level of refinement on the shear steel, you will get a "pattern" on the lesser refined materials, usually nothing more than straight line laminations. I do not think however that a smith would be manipulating the material for a "regonizable" pattern... JPH

Interesting... Hummm I seem to remember the old Queen Cutlery Company use to market a line of pocket knives that used what they called "Silver Steel"..which turned out to be the then "new" 440-C stainless... Chris: for a knife you would be looking for carbon in the 60 point to 100 popint ramge, generally speaking...I use a lot of 1095 and 1095 Electrite...I love that stuff... Well back to finishing up stuff for this weekend's show.. JPH

Hello: Why is it folks get these strange ideas about swords?? Geeze..what's next, gun barrels?? Watchman: Any chance you know of a place where I could get my grubby old hands on a chunk of that HE/HCP rail material?? I for some reason do not think that the local Union and Pacific and Southern Pacific folks would appreciate me torching out a piece on their lines... Back to swords...Swords were never designed to cut stone, or trees, gun barrels or anyting other than people and/or animals...as far as testing goes..I use the old British Army standard of 1792 of striking an oak block against the edge and back, the 60 degree flex back to true and cutting a 14 ga mild steel wire without the edge chipping out...There are a few more steps in the test but those are the most recognisable ones... JPH

Evryone.. Most folks who are in the custom knife industry that aren't long timers like myself and several other here, the name Jody Samsom is "new"...To those of us who have been around, know the name, many know the man. Jody Samson passed away Saturady, Dec 27 he collapsed at work, Albion Arms, doing what he loved best..creating knives, and was pronounced dead from pnuemonia. He was a true artist in many different mediums and a great friend and collegue of mine. In fact a lot of his work was featured in my first book. He fashioned the swords used in the "Conan" films and frankly, he taught me how to hollow grind and I showed him how to forge. I am truly saddened by this man's passing as a great light has been put out all too soon.... Walk with Tubal Jody, carve your work into the heavans and know that this humble man misses you...and treasures your memory and what you mean to anyone that made a blade... Dr Jim Hrisoulas Henderson, Nevada

Mike: Like I said there were questions raised and since I never really used that particular type of cable before I really didn't have anything other than a SWAG to give..I didn't think that there would be much of a problem other than holding it together and then I remembered my talk I had at length with the venerable Wayne Goddard when welded cable first "hit on the scene" back in the late 1970's early 1980's and he said he was welding up a bundle of 3/8" diameter stuff and going on from there. (geeze I am getting long in the tooth...) So I figured what the heck..the strands on what I have are about 3/8ths so I gave it a go..Welded up fine and the bottom swage "holds it still" and helps shape it right while you put the whammy on it... I am looking forward to seeing what kind of pattern distortion I get from this as in the all steel stuff I do I usually get repeated hexagons down the center of a double edged blade. I think this will probably be a bit of a jumble due to the fact that it is just "slapped together". But as in all things yet tried..we will see. I am really not all that keen on welded cable myself..but it is a great seller for me...The "Living Legend" Mr. Bill Bagwell swears by it..whereas I usually swear AT it so... I just hope I helped out the folks that asked about this a while back. On the Dr front..Just got back from PT and all is progressing quite good..I even got the "official release" to "light duty"...what ever that is... so I guess my 4# hammer is "light duty" cause it's only half the weight of my usual hammer?? JPH

Hello: A while back in the chatroom (as well as here on the boards) some folks brought up welding cable and what to do if you get some with a fibre/sisal or plastic core. Well having stumbled recently over some 1 1/4" dia Ximp PS steel wth the firbre core myself I decided to go against my Dr's wishes and try to see if I could actually do ANYTHING and I figured I would do some "investigation" of sorts and solve the cable dilemma. Well, no need to worry about the fiber core..just remove it. Simply take the cable strand apart, remove the fibre, clean out as much of the asphaltum lube as you can and bundle it back together as best as you can into a "cable like shape". Now I used bailing wire to hold everything together while I welded the ends. Now here is the tricky part. Having tried several pieces the use of a bottom "V" swage makes all the difference in the world while welding it up. This "holds" the strands together and helps form them into a solid bar. Weld both ends first and then twist like other cable then weld down the length. It went together just fine, and while you do not have as much material as you would in a non-fibre cored piece the size left for 1 1/4" is just under 1" solid round bar and that is still a healthy amount of material. Actually the hardest part for me was using the hammer. Looks like I am down to a 4#r for a while until I can get up to my usual 8#r again. Boy I felt it and I am "good" for only about an hour of hammer time even at that light of weight...But I am certain that it'll be just a little while longer and I should be back into "full swing". Just thought I would share my "reflections on fibred cable"...since there was some interest a while back. Hope this helps. JPH

Hello All: Geeze..I find the extact opposite..in fact I use cable as a confidence builder when teaching folks to weld. Then again I cheat and use a "V" bottom swage which really helps a whole lot. Twist is at a welding heat and you can get a good start on welding the whole mess together...below is something I welded up in about 45 minutes (just the welding not the whole project) out of 1 1/4" XXImp PS cable..plus a little Ni to break it up a bit pattern wise... Maybe I am working differently but for me cable just sticks together real easy.. JPH

Charlie: Actually it is a method of composite blade constuction, usually applied to Japanese blades. In the simplest definition it is a piece of hardenable (higher C steel) between two pieces of lower C or non-hardenable steel, in a "sandwhich" sort of arrangement. This is the most basic explanation, and there are variations on this.....the old "Morseth" blades out of Sweden used this method of lamination if my old memory serves... Hope this helps.. JPH

Hello: Hope no one minds...most of the GOOD brands of old planer blades are usually F-8, with around 130 pts C, 4% Cr, 8% W and 25 pts V..Boy are they a real bugger to hand work..but they do cut when properly heat treated.....And the thermal treatment is a bit tricky... JPH

Falconer: I am for the sake of the others reading this thread, going to totally forget I read this, because this thread could get really personal and before I come down hard on you I would rather just let this slide (geeze that concussion must of really rattled my brain). Since you put my credentials in question here is my signature block (that I seldom use). There are many, many more than what is listed here.... Dr JP Hrisoulas, Col. NANG (ret) Metallographer, Bladesmith, Reasearcher, Author: "The Complete Bladesmith" "The Master Bladesmith" "The Pattern Welded Blade" soon to be in print:"Custom Bladesmithing: Tools and Techniques for Craftsmen"

Hope no ones minds my tuppence... Steve: You may as well just give up now, cause from the sounds of it Falconer is one of those who feel that the Japanese swords are/were the be all end all of swords. He probably doesn't even realize that the Europeans were doing much more elaborate forge work some 1000 years before the Japanese picked up on it from the Chinese and Koreans. To answer the original question..I would forgo the forge welding until you are much more intimate with the proceses involved...Rather I would suggest that you get some 5160 which makes a really decent sword. Then again..that's my opinion and I have made a couple of swords in my time...and that is what I use to this day mostly... JPH

Hello: Scrap pile?? What's a scrap pile?? I have a pile of what I call "modification raey material".. After all I am way too chea....ummmmm frugal..yeah that's the word..frugal to make much scrap... Besides..after a few years ox experience you'd be surprised at what you can "save" from the "pile"..once you figure out what you are doing that is... JPH I see someone's been reading my books and quoting the obscure Zoroastrian poet Atar Bakhtar...hummmmm

Hello: I don't twist mine at all..just flatten it out, do a bit of shaping and then I do the blade. I think it gives a better "overall feel" to the blade when using it plus it allows for more "personalization" by the end user, like rawhide or wire rapping..tect.. Just my take on it..Then again I am usually the odd duck in the group.. JPH