Jack Evers

Here are some pictures of the Trenton plus an 85 lb Tyler that I carry in my horseshoeing truck (I got it second hand about 35 years ago, think that the guy I got it from bought it new.so perhaps 50 years old) I've seen a couple like it, anyone know anything about Tyler? The real reason I put the picture was to show a truly sharp horn. Farriers typically mark right and left shoes with a punch mark in the outside branch. About 10 years ago, an apprentice of mine started using that horn point as his punch. Set the shoe against it, and hit the back side of the shoe with a hammer. I've continued to do it and that horn is still sharp enough to mark a shoe cold. Must have gotten a good heat treatment on it. To answer one of my own questions, the excess rounding of the edges at the heel of the Trenton carries about 1/4" further on one edge, so Mr Grinder Man rather than the Factory.

Here are some pictures of the Trenton plus an 85 lb Tyler that I carry in my horseshoeing truck (I got it second hand about 35 years ago, think that the guy I got it from bought it new.so perhaps 50 years old) I've seen a couple like it, anyone know anything about Tyler? The real reason I put the picture was to show a truly sharp horn. Farriers typically mark right and left shoes with a punch mark in the outside branch. About 10 years ago, an apprentice of mine started using that horn point as his punch. Set the shoe against it, and hit the back side of the shoe with a hammer. I've continued to do it and that horn is still sharp enough to mark a shoe cold. Must have gotten a good heat treatment on it. To answer one of my own questions, the excess rounding of the edges at the heel of the Trenton carries about 1/4" further on one edge, so Mr Grinder Man rather than the Factory.

I really can't see it being over 300 pounds. My 250 pound Vulcan which is a much blockier anvil has a table almost as big.

Well, close to an 1800's anvil then

I've acquired a 101 pound Trenton (stamped weight and my bathroom scale agrees), serial # A15420, hourglass depression on the bottom. Stamped "solid wrought" and "USA" When was it manufactured? - I understand the hourglass suggests prior to 1910. The face and edges are in quite good shape, a couple inches at the heel are rounded significantly, perhaps a 3/4' radius. Would this have been factory or smith addition? The point of the horn is quite flattened - Could I heat it (torch) and forge more of a point? I can take pics if you'd like,

Bellota rasps (Spanish) are the hardest I've seen. The problem with a hard rasp rather than case hardened is the likelyhood of breaking if you drop it on the ground and it gets stepped on. I've also seen farriers break a Bellota hitting a horse with it, but they deserved to learn a lesson by breaking a $25 rasp. Most of us prefer the case hardened ones.

As an addendum, OSHS only lists "qualified instructors". I'm much more comfortable with a place like Heartland or KHS where Mitch and Chris put their name out front.

Google Kentucky Horseshoeing School - Mitch Taylor. Ranks right up there with Heartland and Chris Gregory. Can't fault either school.

Just in the way of information, saddle horse nails are around size 5, drafts around size 10. A 14 is used by gaited horse shoers to reach through thos thick pad stacks.

Since few of us have a way to quantitatively test hardness, let me suggest a simple experiment to show what heat treatment can do to even mild steel. Hardness is linearly related to bending strength. Take a convenient piece of steel, say 1 inch by 1/4 or 3/8. Clamp it in in your vice with a foot or two sticking out, hook a spring scale to the end and note the maximum scale reading as you bend it. Now straighten it out (either hot or cold) heat to an orange and quench. Now repeat the experiment. It will be much harder to bend. Reheat it, cool in ashes or vermiculite and repeat the experiment. It will be even easier than it was in the as received state. I just did the first two on a piece of 1" by 1/4" cold rolled with the scale hooked 24 inches from the vice. 32 pounds bending strength as received, 52 pounds after heat and quench. A 60 % increase in strength and if I had a way to measure hardness it would have increased about the same. I reheated and allowed the piece to cool slowly in the forge, bending pull was 24 pounds, 75% of as received. I reheated again and allowed it to cool lying on my anvil, bending strength was 30 pounds, about the same as received. Since the bend will be near the clamped end, It is not necessary to heat treat the entire bar. the first eight or ten inches protruding from the vice is enough. Also note that bending moment is what's important. If I'd have only left a foot sticking out my pulls would have doubled.

A welder friend of mine built one into his basement to save space. It was quite narrow. He then took out the regular stairs to gain space. A few years later he sold the house. Said to me, I wonder how long it will take the new owners to figure out why I left the washer and dryer in the basement. Whoops!

Back in my 20's (50 years ago), I built a stock rack for my pickup using galvanized pipe and an O/A torch. I still remember how sick I was and haven't repeated the exposure since. Sure, I've done a bit of heating on zinc containing materials, but only with good ventilation and caution. Remember that brass is a mixture of zinc and copper.and can give off fumes. A common horseshoeing application is to apply drill tec ( a mix of braze metal and tungsten carbide particles) for enhanced wear and/or traction. I do this in my gas forge and see the white zinc oxide build up around the door, but I don't have my face into it like I would using a torch. To second Southshoresmith,about bits of bronze (more likely a braze metal containing zinc - bronze is copper and and tin and brittle) in his forge causing problems with heating steel later, I remember a forging contest where I beat one of the nations good competitors because he couldn't get his forge weld. He said it was because he'd been doing some brazing and still had traces of it in his forge. Probably correct.

Hey!! that salt air (and sailing ship) that makes it to Alberta is pretty mean stuff.

At 73 years old. 5' 7". 160 pounds I'm happy that I can move my 280 pounder from stand to tailgate. If it's on the ground, I call for help.

I used thumb up consistently for many years, but in my late 60's with my hands getting arthritic (don't now if it was connected or not), I switched to thumb down for heavy hitting and often return to thumb up for control., I do like a longer slender rounded rectangle section hammer handle. Frank mentioned a divot under the thumb. I do use one on my rounding hammers that have symmetrical heads. If I can feel the divot, the round face is down.without looking.

Back in my college days (late 50's) we had a hostage situation on RR property. City, state , county and RR police were there. The hostage taker walked by a window with a RR cop outside and received both barrels from a 12 gauge. I was struck then that if it had been one of the other jurisdictions, there would have been an investigation into at least use of excessive force although it seemed a good end with no innocents hurt. For the RR cop it was back to business the next day, no questions asked.

I used to raise Quarter Horses, while my neighbors did cattle. When they had a horse or two to brand, many of them would have me do it because they tended to botch a horse brand. Horses and cattle are that different. Cattle were, hold them down, burn through the hair to hide and let them up. Their hide is tougher and the branding irons (and any enclosed spaces)are bigger. My cattle iron is about twice as big as that horse iron. I'd brand a horse standing up. Clip the hair short at the brand site, Scotch hobble (tie a hind leg up) on the branding side so I don't get kicked, apply a blindfold and a twitch to distract him, then press the end of a 2x4 into the site until he quits reacting to the pressure. Grab a hot iron and apply it. As said before, when he jumps, he's branded. One or two seconds of contact time.

Not true. What happens is the heat can build up in a closed area, the entire area is burned, but doesn't initially appear to be. A few days later the inside slips, but it's due to the initial burn. You just need to be careful and not leave it in contact too long. A damp hide is particularly bad because of steam buildup. Look at post 12 - the closed iron on the left was used on quite a number of horses W/O problem, but very short contact time. As I used to say "when he jumps, he's branded" Cows need a longer burn time., but heck, one of the big local ranches was the AA brand W/O problems.

That type of construction didn't end for a few hundred year, although nails became readily available. My Dad and his older brother arrived in Wyoming in 1908 (Yes, I'm old and he was in his 50's when I was born) to build mine houses for a railroad coal mine. He said they (the two of them) were building two houses a week with hand tools and none were still standing. I do think that back then a 40 hour week ended with lunch on Wednesday, then you went back to work. He was never real proud of his start in the construction business, but it was a start.

A few years ago an elementary school here was doing a - to fill in. I did what I do best, horseshoes. It seemed to go well, forging plus punching, but this is a rural ranching area and that was a school that received a lot of ranch kids. I could talk about when machine made shoes came in, how that influenced the Civil War, etc.

A few years ago an elementary school here was doing a Pioneer Crafts thing. The blacksmith got hurt just before and called me - a mostly farrier with nothing prepared - to fill in. I did what I do best, horseshoes. It seemed to go well, forging plus punching, but this is a rural ranching area and that was a school that received a lot of ranch kids. I could talk about when machine made shoes came in, how that influenced the Civil War, etc.

Looks like you've got it, but I don't quite get your numbers from the table that I referenced. The first acid (acetic)had a formula wt or molecular weight of 60.052 and a sp gr (density)of 1.05 at 99.5% acid so one liter would weigh 1050 grams and 1050 x 99.5 = 1045 grams of that would be acid That would be 1045/60.052 = 17.4 moles/liter. Notice none of the entries show 100% acid since it's difficult (and unreasonably expensive) to form "pure" substances. With phosphoric using the table values, I calculate 14.9 molarity rather than 14.8 (1710 gr/liter times .855/97.995 = 14.9 moles/liter) but probably just round off. Close enough. If you could get pure phosphoric, your number of 17.3 would be about right.

Sorry, my bad. I wasn't looking at the voltage carefully.

Agreed that it has little or nothing to do with the thread,but for my info, once we have a voltage load, say 220 - 50A, I can see progressing from 3 wire to 4 wire, I can even understand modifying the crowfoot into one with a distinct neutral, but why have five different standard plugs within that 3 wire, 220 - 50A class?

I've used most of the options, I have a Lincoln 225 (almost 50 years old now) My shop is wired for it, but I have a 100 foot extension cord so I can work outside the shop, near the house or even at friend's houses. I usually plug into a stove outlet (50 amp)I also have a 6500 watt generator (which set me back the $500 you mentioned). It works fine to carry the welder around the ranch but it's a gas guzzler, I'd rather be plugged in.