lochness Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Another strange question: I live 'bout 100-plus miles from the nearest Wal-Mart, movie theater, hospital, etc, and some folks here want to start a recycling program. Well, it involves hauling, which is expensive. As a confirmed scrounger, I said, "why don't we keep the resources close to home? Let's melt down our own steel cans, aluminum cans, etc, and use the resource for ourselves, instead of paying someone to haul away a valuable resource." Of course, I don't have the slightest idea about how to build a furnace that could melt these things. It'd have to burn coal or wood- the gas would be as expensive as hauling the stuff outta town. Any ideas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt87 Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Aluminium is easy enough; it has a manageable melting point. Check out backyardmetalcasting.com for some good ideas. Mild steel like in a can is not so feasible; it melts at a much higher temperature and at that temperature oxidises with some gusto (sparklers) unless in a somewhat inert atmosphere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 A blast furnace turns iron ore into cast iron; this is not what you seem to want to do. You want to make a melting furnace. For cast iron and bronze you can use a cupola, fairly easy to build and run Lindsay Books has some good ones on it. For melting Al and Brass/Bronze a charcoal fired or propane fired furnace is easy to build and run. Melting and casting steel is a whole nother kettle of fish and is not likely to be worth while on a small scale. Now the energy expense will be pretty high and unless you have a very expensive machine to accurate determine what you are getting; the end product will have some use restrictions. (a good method is to melt items that were cast to begin with so you at least have a castable alloy to start with) If you can find a need that you can fill with the level of casting you can do locally then you *may* be ahead. Economies of scale have a big impact in this area and you may find that driving 100 miles and buying commercial product may be *cheaper* than making your own. Lindsay books has a whole series on the back yard foundry and using it to build a series of machine tools: Lathe, Shaper, Mill, etc. Again buy old scrapped machines may be cheaper in time and money but if you want the skills to replace parts that don't exist commercially anymore doing it yourself will provide training. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Do you have an abundant source of cheap fuel? If not hauling may be the better alternative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quenchcrack Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 Keep in mind that the scrap dealers will rely on the product to determine which aluminum alloy you are selling. If you melt it all down and pour bubbly little ingots, expect the scrap dealer to either decline the purchase or pay you the minimum. Buy a can crusher instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orgtwister Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 if you make a reverberatory furnace were you melt the metal in the furnace (no crucible)you can use a becket stlye burner and run diesel in it it will melt aluminum and brass and bronze with no problem we have melted 15 pounds of bronze in about an hour used a gallon of diesel for a aluminum you can melt a furnace full about 10 pounds or so in 15 min Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tech413 Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 orgtwister, where did you get plans for building your furnace? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orgtwister Posted February 4, 2009 Share Posted February 4, 2009 really no plans my buddy and me looked at different types of furnaces and had some diferent types and then modified one he had to fit a becket burner its nothing more then a round bottom furnace about 10-12 inches round and about 12 inches deep with a 3inch thick top that swings its just like a crucible furnace just a round bottom with the burner hole on top on a down wered angle and you tilt the furnace to pore it if your looking to make a big one stephen chastain sells plans for one like we made just BIGGER its out of a 55 gallon drum that has a tilting meckanisum you can seach his name they sell the book in different places like ebay and so on just remember that casting metal is and old art and dont take much to do it and if your going to make one i would sujest using high temp refractory and not home made i just found its not worth try to cheap out in this area Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awalker Posted February 7, 2009 Share Posted February 7, 2009 Storing the material until you have enough for semi loads, or shipping containers is what would be most practicle. RR cars would be good if there is a siding close by to keep a car on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awalker Posted February 7, 2009 Share Posted February 7, 2009 I didn't notice, you are in Scotland. All bets are off then. I still think storing it until you have enough to hire a lorry would be the best idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damascus Mike Posted April 12, 2009 Share Posted April 12, 2009 (edited) wasnt the question about plans to build a furnice that uses wood?i wanna actualy do the same and i see that no body posted info on how to make the actual furnace :( Edited April 12, 2009 by Damascus Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bentiron1946 Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 With the current costs of fuel it is going to be costly to melt down much of your scrap. Steel is not practical at all on the local level except in very large quantities unless you are going into the reinforcing bar manufacturing business then just save it up and haul it out. Same goes for cast iron. Aluminum can be processed locally in to ingots but here again as already mentioned commercial recyclers want to know what they are buying and if it is an unknown alloy they may or may not buy you ingots. However if you want to cast sculpture locally you can use whatever alloy you want or have on hand. Brass is like aluminum in that there are standard alloys and then not so standard. Are you saving up old sink and water supply fittings? Some are cast and some extruded? Different alloy for different manufacturing processes. And your saving copper too? You have wire that has insulation on it plus bare wire, pipe, electrics? I applaud your willingness to recycle but you need to go about it so that you aren't making more of a mess then you are by just hauling it out. Take the insulated wire for example, how are you going to get a large quantity of insulation of without burning it off? just sit on your butt for hours and strip it off? How much fuel and how many man hours are you going to spend breaking up cast iron waste pipe, sinks, tubs, before you can melt them into pigs? Who is going to pay the medical care of an injured volunteer? Are you going to be collecting glass, cardboard and paper too? Who is going to pay for the fire protection, insurance and storage of these products or are you only interested in metals only? My personal opinion is that if you are go to recycle is to ask for help from the local government for bins to place these materials in a let them pay the costs.:cool: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damascus Mike Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 (edited) no no no you dont understand i wanna melt things like coke tins,gun shells,brass fittings etc.stuff like that 4 MY OWN USE not to sell or give away.i just thought that it could also be fun to do.i know its dangerous but so is walking across a road Edited April 13, 2009 by Damascus Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matt87 Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 If you read the suggestions earlier in this thread and used the 'search' function on this forum and on Google you would find all the resources you need. This website mainly focuses on the forging aspect of metalworking, not casting and so pointers to more appropriate websites have been given. Crossing the road may have its dangers but at least these are obvious, and children are taught about correct procedures from when they are old enough to understand. Getting smashed by a 1-ton car going 50MPH is one thing; getting the flesh melted off your bones by a drop of moisture in a crucible is quite another. What I am about to say I do so not to be rude and not just to you but to everyone: Your frustration at the lack of replies to certain threads is likely due to those questions having already been answered. There are a number of highly talented men and women willing to give their valuable time for free, it's bad manners to not at least make some effort to research what has already been said and expect them to spend more time . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GNJC Posted April 13, 2009 Share Posted April 13, 2009 Hello, have a look on the biggest search engine; if you enter 'cupola furnaces' & 'almohandes' in the same search you should be able to find all the info' you need. G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damascus Mike Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 Hello, have a look on the biggest search engine; if you enter 'cupola furnaces' & 'almohandes' in the same search you should be able to find all the info' you need. G what do you mean the biggest search engine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 "wood fired furnaces" are actually charcoal furnaces where you are making the charcoal on the spot. Much easier to seperate the two processes and make your charcoal and then use it in a furnace. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodge Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 what do you mean the biggest search engine? Biggest search engines I know of are Google and Yahoo. Google has a lot less advertising... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damascus Mike Posted April 16, 2009 Share Posted April 16, 2009 oh ok cool Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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