Today's forging. From a challenge from Peter Braspennix.  Tough to do in general, and harder in a gas forge

Looks like a challenge, how many welds?

Frosty The Lucky.

Two.  Would have been better executed in a coal forge, but mine isn't setup yet.

Well the puzzle challenge has my brain hurting at this hour. Lol. 

Larger square stock with two cuts up one side and two flipped one side? But where's the overhang parts if not cut off? Just mentally wrestled the youngest to sleep so maybe I'm not thinking right. 

Very cool piece. 

You are on the right track.  Starting stock is 4" of 1" square bar.  There are more than one solutions.

To me it looks like (and I'm totally guessing as I look):

-Twist the 4x1 in the middle so you have half that is 4x1 and half that is 1x4 (as in, one side vertical and one side horizontal) and forge to centre the transitions of twist.

-Split both sides into three with the cuts going just past centre

-Forge them out square from the centre bar to tidy up their transitions

-Bend them down and forge weld

-Taper to finish the welds

Am I close?

Cheers,

Jono.

 

Ooooh, now I'm not sure if you cut past centre and bent them forward, or cut short of centre and bent them back? This would affect how you forge the transitions on first twist.

 

Oh thank you Hefty, I'm sure you're close just no telling to what.  

My head hasn't spun once all day till now. 

Frosty The Lucky.

Hefty,

That is almost exactly what I first proposed as a solution, and I still believe that it is one option, just not the easiest one.  You are extremely close, just recall that the starting stock is 4" of 1" square (I didn't know that when I advanced the solution you listed)...

I have 4 inch of 1 inch square bar.  I think i may try this.  I should not have looked at this this morning, it's all I'll be thinking about at work.  Are there specific dimensions to this?  

I believe you that there are more than one way to do it. 

I think I figured it out. Maybe after more coffee I could sketch it out. I tried and it's a rough sketch lol. If I get some forge time I think I could make it. 

I'm thinking you take the bar and forge half the bar to half in. thick one way, turn a quarter and forge the other half to half in. thick the other way overlapping the center to make it half in. square. Then make the two cuts in each half. Spread it open and forge out the tines then fold the outers to the opposing ends and forge weld the ends. 

Lol Chad, me too.

I can envision that Das, I might have to get out the modeling clay. Thanks for letting me have my second cup of coffee before I saw your post. My eyes spinning opposite directions doesn't hurt so much with coffee.

Frosty The Lucky.

I need to bring some modeling clay to work lol. Or a forge and anvil. My boss wouldn't have a problem with it if I did. Funny enough we just mentioned it in passing this morning when talking about straightening a bent garage door arm. 

 

Sounds like your boss is half way to convinced to have a shop forge anvil and basic tools. Hmmmm?

Frosty The Lucky.

He Has been a commissioner of my art over the years lol. 

His latest ideas have to do with making a bbq pit with smoker attachment. 

I have changed my opinion to thinking the center of the bar is fullered before other work. Soon as the kids get to bed I might get a chance to try it. 

 

21 hours ago, Latticino said:

just recall that the starting stock is 4" of 1" square

Ah! I misread the earlier post (and didn't think about how disproportionally large my misinterpreted imperial measurements would be!)

Sounds, and looks, like Aric is all over it! With the correct dimensions in my head, I would have approached it the way he has (although I admit I would not have thought to fuller the centre in first. That's insightful.)

Cheers,

Jono.

By golly Aric, I believe you've got it!

I have to say I kind of like the demented caltrop preform almost as much as the finished example.

Frosty The Lucky.

Yes, that is basically the way I did it.  Of course part of the difficulty was getting it in and out of my 4" square forge opening once the "legs" were drawn out and keeping everything clean and symmetrical.

The technique I use when spreading segments of a forging interfere with getting it in and out of the forge is to spread only one thing enough to work on at a time. 

For example on this piece, after cutting the sections I'd work one swoopy arm on one end by spreading them like your fingers bend exposing the center piece rather than to a 90 from it.  After forging the other swoopy arm draw the center point out. Bend everything back in plane and repeat on the other end. Once everything is forged in the preform bend the arms around and forge weld them to the center points.

Otherwise the only good way I can think of to heat the piece like you did it is with a brick pile forge and take the forge off rather than put it in and take it out.

A solid fuel forge would make things a lot easier but I use propane and solve problems from that point of view.

Frosty The Lucky.

Frosty,

I could (and probably should) have used "convenience" bends to allow me to put the different legs into the forge opening more easily, but there were certain conveniences involved in having the opposing arms in line to allow clean drawing out.  I jiggered it around to heat sections, but it would have been so much easier with a solid fuel forge.  I definitely did the enhanced caltrops style like Alric, but put a lot of effort into radiuses and transitions to keep things proportional and relatively symmetrical.  Was very satisfying once I got it all bent up and could get it back into my forge further for the forge weld.  

I was just noodling how I'd go about it and hadn't thought much about the details. I'll have to remember, "convenience bend", I've used them as long as I was at the anvil but don't think I ever heard a term for the practice. 

Frosty The Lucky.

I am lightyears on the wrong (neophyte) side of trying such a project, but quite interested nonetheless. Now that I see & read about how it comes about, I'm extra perplexed by Latticino's earlier statement that there are only two welds. I get that the three legs are welded on each end, thus two "areas" of welds, but really it is four welds isn't it? (one for each external leg to the center leg)

--Larry

It was a tired attempt lol. The branch joints need tidied up. Also I used 3/4" as that's what I had handy without digging around. I was beat tired from the day so that is all the further I got. It isn't a clean attempt but I'm glad to have got it out of my head lol. Not sure when I will finish this but I'd like to figure a way to refine the joints of the arms. A couple things come to mind. It certainly is an awkward piece to maneuver. 

Latticino, I have a new appreciation for how clean your forging of this is. The only reason I see for a gas forge not being better for this is it's size and shape. Other than that it is also a bit of a challenge in my coal forge but I see the hardship of fitting it in a gas forge. 

Larry, I think it is more of getting the 3 ends lined up on each end and welding them together at one time. So sort of, but it would be 2 forge welds since each end would be forge welded at one time.