draper84 Posted August 13, 2008 Share Posted August 13, 2008 i am currently in a coal slump. i have none:p and i'm thinking of trying cowboy natural charcoal. I was wondering if you can get it hot enough to forge weld with? i need to know for my next project. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finnr Posted August 13, 2008 Share Posted August 13, 2008 Yup. I've welded over the same brand. Takes a deeper fire to do it but it works. Finnr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
draper84 Posted August 13, 2008 Author Share Posted August 13, 2008 excellent, i have a very interesting project in mind, but for now it'll remain classified....not much really just big for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted August 13, 2008 Share Posted August 13, 2008 Charcoal was they fuel that all the viking/frankish blades were welded up with and what traditionally made japanese blades are welded up with to this day, (and they use softwood charcoal to boot!). As was mentioned a deeper fire and "softer" air imput is needed. I generally place a couple of firebricks in my forge along the sides of the firepot to contain and deepen the fire. If you are using a hand crank blower slow down. If it's electrically blown back way off on the air! Make sure the charcoal is not too large of chunks too, large ones should be cut/broken into smaller ones---helps to get higher heat and less oxidation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
draper84 Posted August 14, 2008 Author Share Posted August 14, 2008 thank you very much, i knew that i could find the answers here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outsider Posted August 16, 2008 Share Posted August 16, 2008 Well cool that answers my question w/out even having to ask, i just built a washtub forge (it's still wet even) and have a bag of cowboy ready for it. I do have a question about it though, i have a wagner heat gun (for old flooring, paint and shrink wrap stuff) and i am wondering if i use the heat would that be good or not? The heat gun has low volume and high volume settings and by luck it just fits the 1 1/4" to 1" reducer perfectly! Any comments would be helpful and sorry to hijack the thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnW Posted August 17, 2008 Share Posted August 17, 2008 The heat gun will get too hot in the pipe, and melt the plastic etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisB Posted August 17, 2008 Share Posted August 17, 2008 outsider what did you use for the clay? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arbalist Posted August 17, 2008 Share Posted August 17, 2008 Interesting Forge Outsider, how did you make it? Vic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabre Posted August 17, 2008 Share Posted August 17, 2008 heres a link for how to make it Charcoal Forge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arbalist Posted August 17, 2008 Share Posted August 17, 2008 Thanks for the link! :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabre Posted August 17, 2008 Share Posted August 17, 2008 np.............. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outsider Posted August 17, 2008 Share Posted August 17, 2008 heres a link for how to make it Charcoal Forge this is the same link i used, from livley knives but i didnt get the DVD they sell i just used what info they had there and used the %50 cheap kitty litter (the all clay stuff) and %50 landscaping sand (lowes) with a few handfuls or hardwood ash from my woodstove that i finally cleaned...LOL Now first mistake i see already is i put it too thick for first coat, should have applied in a cpl of layers i figure, kinda like drywall mud apply to think and it cracks like the adobe mix from the forge but i can fix the cracks with more mix and patch it up i assume. In retrospect it would have been a better idea to have either gotten the DVD (or the cheaper D/L at $14.95) or perhaps looked up "Adobe" in google and found a site that gives free info that might be more expansive on the topic. Also i guess that some fire bricks set in before the adobe would have been a grand idea but heck that for the next one and i'll prolly give this one to my Dad for when we work there. I'll be sure to keep ya'll informed about the progress of the forge and i'll post a pic of the cracking adobe for ya'lls viewing. Any further comments or questions please feel free. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outsider Posted August 17, 2008 Share Posted August 17, 2008 The heat gun will get too hot in the pipe, and melt the plastic etc. the plastic on the heat gun i assume but aside from that would the heat gun help my forge? I can rig some way to make it work, i'm pretty good like that, i can add an ext pipe to the 1 1/4 flair to keep the gun away from the forges heat. thx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Browne Posted August 17, 2008 Share Posted August 17, 2008 I don't think the "extra" heat form the gun would do anything significant to a forge fire which is so hot by comparison. Its much simpler to pump in cold air and let the fire do its thing rather than having to keep watch on heating elements in a blower. My two bobs worth :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psilogen Posted August 17, 2008 Share Posted August 17, 2008 plus, why waste the electricity. cold-air-fed charcoal gets hot enough to anything you could need Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outsider Posted August 17, 2008 Share Posted August 17, 2008 cool deal then guys, i appreciate the feedback, i'm always trying to get a lil more out of the things i do and thought it might help out. So i'll stick with the cold air intake and of course i'll be sure to post pix of the forge as it progresses. thx Rob and Psilogen for your input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnW Posted August 18, 2008 Share Posted August 18, 2008 Outsider, -I beieve TL's video is very good and I believe his main motive is to inform and promote. He says that adobe forges may crack at first, but don't worry just patch it. They get glazed after a short time and then they won't crack (or scarely ever). -I don't think you will notice any difference in using hot air and regular air, or at least I didn't. -Your forge looks very nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeaverDamForge Posted August 18, 2008 Share Posted August 18, 2008 My 2c. : Using the heater in the heat gun will help, but it's the expensive way to go. Maybe use it at first to help get up to temp. Straw in the mud (clay) will help prevent cracking, but don't use too much. Perlite is much better than ash for refractory. You can add so much ash the clay won't bond before you get to the effectiveness of 50% perlite. Good Luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psilogen Posted August 18, 2008 Share Posted August 18, 2008 Outsider, I understand and admire the spirit of getting as much as you can out of your setup. I used a blow dryer on my first extra-curricular forging, and while it did work, all the heating element did was constantly trip the circuit. Practical experience is highly valuable in transit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arbalist Posted August 18, 2008 Share Posted August 18, 2008 Thanks for sharing Outsider, look forward to hearing how you get on. I was wondering, would BBQ Briquettes work in a forge like this? Anyone know? :confused: I only ask as they are often easier to get hold of over here in the UK. Vic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnW Posted August 18, 2008 Share Posted August 18, 2008 Sure BBQ briquettes will work, but then lots of things will work. BBQ briquettes have no style. Buffulo chips have more style than BBQ briquettes. People might tell you lots of bad things about BBQ briquettes, like the bonding agent will gum up your steel, they don't get hot, or whatever. Actually, I think they will work just fine for you. Oh, by the way, (if you must use BBQ briquettes), I don't think you can get much milage from the fines. Coal fines are fine, but not BBQ briquettes fines, avoid pouring those into you forge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabre Posted August 18, 2008 Share Posted August 18, 2008 (edited) well bbq things dont get as hot and i heard they have somthing bad in them thats unhealthy.. i would stick to the actual charcoal or coal Johnw what do you mean coal and bricketts fines? Edited August 18, 2008 by Sabre Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Falzone Posted August 18, 2008 Share Posted August 18, 2008 Greetings all, I got really interested in this thread because I have experience with charcoal forging and I've even participated in several charcoal iron smelting experiments with a group here in Ontario. I use a charcoal forge in my spare time because I live in the city and I can't run coal (pollution bylaws) and I haven't made a propane forge yet. Coal and Charcoal fines are the dust and tiny bits and peices found at the bottom of the bag or pile. I find they burn up extremely quick and all you get is a shower of sparks for your troubles. For the question of lump charcoal or briquettes - stick with lump charcoal. The reason charcoal is such a good forging fuel is that it is almost completely pure carbon and burns really clean, the way coke burns cleaner than coal because all the junk has been cooked out of it. Briquettes are really just small bits of charcoal that are glued together with some kind of binder to give them a bigger shape. For forging, it's the binder in the briquettes that's the problem. The original question was regarding welding with charcoal. You can definitely weld with lump charcoal because it burns so clean - that gives you a clean weld. The junk in the briquettes reacts chemically with the steel and gives you really bad welds, if you get a weld at all. The finest swords ever made don't lie. A small part of their success is because of the fuel they used - clean burning lump charcoal. I've never heard of cowboy charcoal, we use Royal Oak in our smelts and forges, but any brand of good quality natural lump charcoal will do. For Outsider - great looking forge !!! Thanks for th link. Aeneas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arbalist Posted August 18, 2008 Share Posted August 18, 2008 Thanks for the input guys, very helpful Vic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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