racer3j Posted June 21, 2008 Share Posted June 21, 2008 I tend to look at things and daydream about building or improving- unfortunately, often about things where I barely know "jack". Like blacksmithing. So, I have 1 1/2 propane forges, now have the parts to make 2-3 coal-coke forges. I say 1/2 because I paid $40 to a Best Offer Ebay Seller for shipping. My offer was for the forge and $40 for shipping. This is a new in box Whisper Baby. Based on the fact that if done priority as I asked and paid for, the forge should be here, the seller healed the $$ hit by cheap shipping me. Kind of makes me glad that I can leave truthful feedback- I take the position that instant payments, never modified or rejected, obligate a seller to leave good feedback. Full and honest payment is all that a seller can expect- Now, this is just my opinion and anyone who disagrees is just as correct as I am. I have tried to buy an Ellis kit(unwelded and no fuel delivery parts)- they are still recovering from their flood problem I guess. Since I am on the banks of the "Father of Waters," I understand. But I have some intriguing ideas and want a big forge. Well, sitting along my garage is a two chamber round smoker- kind with the fuel chamber fastened lower than the cooking/smoking chamber. I am lazy and use the Bradley Smoker. The 16" diameter barrel, 28" inches long and the fuel/smoking chamber, 16" and 16 inches long are just begging to be lined with some 2600* ceramic wool and high density brick floor. And the ITC products would make me a stockholder in the company. The burners can be mounted on the doors- one could be forging and one for unfluxed work.Of course, it is already on its "running gear." Recommendations for number and size of burners, anyone? I seem to recall that 350 cubic inches needs an efficient 3/4" conventional venturi burner. Well, if I could do math, I would have been a fuel(coal and coke) engineer like my Dad and his Dad before him. Actually, I would like your daydreams or hard won knowledge on any aspect. Thanks, jet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted June 22, 2008 Share Posted June 22, 2008 I've never heard such a thing Jet! A smith who designs things before he's good and set in his ways? Thinking up new and improved tools and equipment before he's used any? You should see the drawings I made of a treadle hammer before I knew what one should look like! The age old what's going to be big enough and what's going to be too big and what do I really need question. Eh? The general consensus of suggestions is what do you think you want to make? Then make it a little bigger. 350 cu/in gets a 3/4" naturally aspirated burner. (No venturi in them you know ) Figuring volume for a cylinder is pretty easy. Pi*r squared * L. or .7854 * d squared * L. Need some sketches to say what we think of your ideas. I visualize what I read but it's unlikely it'll be what you're actually describing. The attached pics are from my phone so they're not as clear as I'd like. The ones in the camera will have to wait on Deb to download. I finished the manifold and 3 more burners, less jets today. I still need to put a "U clamp on the manifold, trim the jets and tune the burners and it'll be ready to cook on all burners. If I need something bigger than this one I'll make a brick pile. Frosty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racer3j Posted June 22, 2008 Author Share Posted June 22, 2008 Frosty- It is things like your forge that get me going. Since I am ignorant, things like that,your recent as shown( thanks for the sketchup) get my attention. I have come up with a variation in construction that I believe everyone who uses a gas forge will find near irresistible if they try it. I am not quite a new lamb, but I appreciate your point- " what in the world makes this absolutely rookie idiot think he can improve something he has not extensively used?" A reasonable question- even irritation. Hey- I have a propane grill and I have heated up steel and welded it and shaped it// family background and gunsmithing experience helps a bit. Used to color case harden and heat treat on a small shop scale- we built some crude "forge/furnaces" and I understand Bernouli- and I will publically ask stupid questions here and you vets can help..jet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Mulholland - Tetnum Posted June 22, 2008 Share Posted June 22, 2008 jet i am not a fan of gas forges but if you must there is a forge simmlar to what your describeing but if it was me i would use the small barrel and get a 2inch pipe and a t jont put dumping ashgrate as frosty descirbed somewhare with a exaust cap on one end put on a flatbar on the other end of the t jont to act as a grate cut a hole int the bottom of the drum and the side so the pipe will fit through pack clay aroud the grate end in the drumto form a firepot or use firebrick set a shop vac to blow and fire it up o dont use anay galvnised pipe or fittings we all would miss your input grately Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archie Zietman Posted June 22, 2008 Share Posted June 22, 2008 (edited) I'd say work for a bit with what you have. We haven't seen much of your work. Get good at smithing before going to town on the tools. I spent 3 years building forges and barely did any forging (letalone finished a piece) in those 3 years. You already have a forge, it looks like, or will in a few days, which seems very good. Use it. Once you have got decent at smithing, you will know what is big enough. It's good that you are so enthusiastic, though! Edited June 22, 2008 by Archie Zietman edited for clarity Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ted T Posted June 22, 2008 Share Posted June 22, 2008 Racer3j I heard a saying that makes sense to me, and I would like to share it with you. "Nobody succeeds beyond his or her wildest expectations unless he or she begins with some wild expectations." --Ralph Charell I love the Idea that you are being creative. But please temper your enthusiasm with wisdom and knowledge. When you mess with gas and fire the results could be most unforgiving. I have seen the results a few times over the years. Several thoughtful people have expressed some views here in this post that I think are worth reading over again. Oh, by the way; I happen to be designing a new gas forge. I guess I had better re-read the other posts again myself! I will bet you come up with something interesting, please post photos, but please be safe! Ted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted June 22, 2008 Share Posted June 22, 2008 Frosty- It is things like your forge that get me going. Since I am ignorant, things like that,your recent as shown( thanks for the sketchup) get my attention. I have come up with a variation in construction that I believe everyone who uses a gas forge will find near irresistible if they try it. I am not quite a new lamb, but I appreciate your point- " what in the world makes this absolutely rookie idiot think he can improve something he has not extensively used?" - and I will publically ask stupid questions here and you vets can help..jet I wasn't trying to put you in "your place" or anything like it, far from it. I didn't do a very good job of saying it but I do the same thing. I've NEVER seen let alone used a tool, machine or other device without redesigning it at least in my head. Often on paper and on rare occasion in the physical world. I've done a VERY little off road racing myself and unless you've got more money than congress you have to be able to do failure analysis, design, fab, invent and improvise to name a few. Everybody with any creativity does it. You can't do anything without imagining it first, unless it's a reflexive action. A person who doesn't know what's needed MUST try imagining what's needed. A good example is the person who wants to forge swords. Swords are long so they imagine they need a long forge. Nope, it's counterintuitive but a sword can be forged with a much smaller forge than a hay hook. Heat treating one doesn't require a forge per-se, a long fire of charcoal briquettes will do just fine as you're only looking for critical temp. Anyway, I was only poking a little "join the club" fun at you and for taking me seriously I have to say you took it much better than I do when a button is pushed. So, show us a picture of what you have in mind so we can get down to seriously dissecting it. :cool: Frosty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 For a whopping big gas forge I'd suggest going with blown burners; dead simple to make and a lot easier to tune for heat/atmosphere. However I would also suggest not building one until it's needed. I recently visited a professional smith who needed a large gasser for a specific project. he took a length of kaowool and rolled it up and tied it with binder wire and had his large forge. Minimal fuss and effort and he could spend more time making stuff. I've know several folk make large forges and then they sit gathering dust as they are expensive to run and only needed rarely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted June 23, 2008 Share Posted June 23, 2008 Exactly so Thomas. Keeping a stack of fire brick to build a pile forge or lining a table top for a Kaowool roll away takes up a lot less space and is more versatile. I had a student who was always saving for the "Right" stuff to make his gasser. One session we did all our forging using a roll of Kaowool held together with chicken wire with a split fire brick for a floor. He had his gasser before our session the next weekend. Frosty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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