walking the cup

[clw1985]

walking the cup......for me the most aggravating thing possible, im taking a refresher welding course..and for my cert i have to take a bunch of tig classes, 4 inch wide, by 6 inch long 1/4 in thick mild steel, included angle around 64 degrees give or take 1/16th inch root face polished up shiny shiny shiny.....then i go in the booth get out the torch and generate some nice shiny scrap.....i hold my torch at roughly 45-60 deg. angle, while im working the cup, i hold my filler rod at like 5-15 depending on how the puddle fills...as if it matters.....any one have any tips? im havin alot of suck back ive changed angle amps im runnin on dcen thats the correct polarity if any one has any hints or tips let me know.

[yesteryearforge]

use a different size or style cup or change how far out or in the tungsten is sticking out.

Mike Tanner

[looper567]

A little less heat or a little more speed, keep the filler wire consistent. If you are hesitating while walking it makes the suck back worse. I have found the easiest way to walk the cup is to not think about it. The more I seem to concentrate on the torch movements, the stiffer I become, and my grip as well. Try to keep a loose grip and a free head. Just go with it instead of trying to control it, you'll find the sweet spot. I also prefer a larger cup, it will mean less hand movement to progress with your weld bead. Last round of G6 weld tests on 2" S.S. pipe went smooth as glass. Open root, argon purge, went perfect. Hadn't welded pipe in a while and only ran 2 practice root passes. The trick I've found is don't stress over it...

[Glenn]

Please explain "walking the cup" for those not familiar with the process.

[Thomas Dean]

The cup rests on the pipe and you "walk" or rock the cup back and forth to progress up the pipe as you weld. If you don't relax it will work your tail off in short order.

As far as the suck back you are experiencing....speed up, lower your amps, or feed more wire. Any of these will/should remedy the problem. "looper567" is correct, reread his post. I use a #12 cup with a 1/8" tungstun. I don't walk the cup when welding titanium but will with everything else,...well, not on the 1/2" pipe open butts. When welding carbon steel the need of an argon purge is not necessary although it make the root look nice! The majority of the welding I do is TIG. We SMAW all carbon pipe, except 1 1/2" and under, that gets TIG'd also. Try some 1/2" sch. 10 Titanium...that'll test your nerves. Let us know how you make out.

[clw1985]

explaining walking the pipe for those that aren't familiar, i do, do it on pipe, but pipe is expensive so i usually practice on smaller 1/4" inch mild steel plates, you take the torch angle it foreward in to the bevel lay your filler rod into the gap and work the torch side ot side while doing a good constant feed to get full penetration.......thats how its supposed to be done, except i prefer to generate scrap it seems. thanks for all the input ill run those cup sizes and tung sizes to my instructor and see what we got lyin around. ill post how good or bad i did friday.

[Hillbillysmith]

Thomas Dean; I would love to see the TIG'd titanium!! I don't do pipe welding, yet, but I would like to start. I'm trying to get my teacher to show and let me run some with GTAW and/or SMAW. But you should post some pics of your titanium on the "Titanium" post that I have up.

http://www.iforgeiron.com/forum/f56/titanium-4677/

-Hillbilly

[HWooldridge]

Try larger size filler rod.

[Speeddy]

I use a # 12 Jumbo on 3" pipe or larger and #8 cup Both with Gas lens.

[Johnnie C.]

I am Union Pipe Welder and understand how agervating it can be. I usually use a #10 cup. Hold the cup at about a 45 degree angle with your tungston sticky out about a 1/16 of a in. When you grip the torch, grip it lightly ( I use my thumb, index finger, and my middle finger). Try not to put pressure on the cup. I believe you may be comming too far up on the egde of your bevil, which is causing your stringer to suck back. Try to stay on the filler wire, you just want to touch the egde of each side. I also like to put and a nickle land on metal. It seems like you can carry a little more heat to me. If you can get a spare torch, go home and practice while you watching tv. Sometimes when your in a boot you can get a little tence, at home you are relaxed and motion will come second nature when your in the boot. I hope this helps.

Edited July 30, 2008 by j@j metal works

[cami]

In my experience, suckback is a fact of life and adequate root reinforcement is the remedy. If your root goes in flush, then it'll be a mess after your next pass. If your root is good and heavy it should turn out fine. How much reinforcement are you allowed? 3/32" for the root and up to 1/8" for the cap has been acceptable for any test I've done, so stuff it in there!

[racer3j]

Haven't tigged since about 2001-but almost all of my Tig was on 4130 tubing, from ,065 to .083 and .095. From all of the years with OA and my most comfortable technique being the "keyhole," in a way I let the tig cup chase the rod. Yes, the rod feed dictated the torch movement. I did not walk the cup in literal contact with the weldment, but did introduce a very subtle "swing" and minute pull-back of the torch. So, as I chased the rod, the initial torch movement was a miniature "c" and a 1/16" pull back before touching the rod to the puddle. Except when constrained by a multi tube intersections, I also used a cup with 1/2" or the 9/16" mouth for broader gas shielding, just barely upping flow to get better shielding(Note-even on my mig I use a flowmeter-2 stage with floating ball and tube and analog round needle gauge)-- apparent average
bead width would be around 3/16" for the style of fabrication I describe.

My Dillon comes darn near tig control.They are not a gimmick. When I really need to limit heat area, I use the heat-stop "clays".mike