chichi Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 Frosty referred to a Sen in a recent topic and it reminded me of my poor experience with the Sen I made. My Sen looks good and seems to be properly hardened but I have no idea what the edge bevel angle should be. I tried blunt and sharp and had poor performance with both. Is there anyone who has had good results with a SEN.If so, please describe the edge angle, hardening process and use of this tool. Is it better than a large file? Similar questions re a metal scraper used to true up a flat surface. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Hale Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 If you think about it a sen will have one edge, and if prperly done will remove metal. A file has a whole lot of cutting edges. I would go for the file,,(and have),However if I did fullers on blades I might make a sen in the proper shape and use it to clean up after forging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Budd Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 I have never got around to making a proper sen, but I've made some quickly by grinding off the teeth (carefully) from a half round file, leaving sharp D-shaped edges on both sides of the bar. Rich is right that a file removes more pieces of metal, but a sen can take off much larger pieces with each stroke. I'm removed curls of metal 0.7mm thick and 5mm wide and upto about 20mm long quite easily. And by shaping the blade to a slight curve, you can remove a focussed area that a file can't reach (such as the fuller or even just a gentl hollowing in targetted areas. I still use files in preference myself, but I think its partly down to my lack of experiece with making the sen just right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Salvati Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 Did you hollow grind the back of your sen? This makes a huge difference in how it performs. I love the one I made for myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 Did you hollow grind the back of your sen? This makes a huge difference in how it performs. I love the one I made for myself. Pics Sam, we need pics! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Salvati Posted September 24, 2011 Share Posted September 24, 2011 OK early next week i'll be back home, i'll snap some then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chichi Posted September 24, 2011 Author Share Posted September 24, 2011 Re Sam's question,I did not hollow grind the back of the Sen. It would seem that would make a weak edge. But,what do I know other than what I have works poorly. I will wait for pictures so I get it right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Salvati Posted September 25, 2011 Share Posted September 25, 2011 45 degree on the top, hollow ground on the back right up to the edge, you don't go deep like a knife. I did mine on a 5 inch wheel, and the sen itself was 5/16" thick, LOL that's not a weak edge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
basher Posted October 13, 2011 Share Posted October 13, 2011 I have made a couple of sen and used them initally and then not at all. they are a tool designed for tamagane , in that material I think they would work well. I find their action which is somewhat akin to a shaper or milling machine tends to work harden the modern steel I use. Files seem to work better and a belt grinder best!! If you like having every tool then go and make one if not i would not bother. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wesley Chambers Posted October 13, 2011 Share Posted October 13, 2011 found this not sure if its any help http://www.dfoggknives.com/photogallery/MakingSen/makingsen.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigfootnampa Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 That looks good Wesley! I have no experience with them but others have said that even moderately well made ones will shave metal faster than files. I think it likely to be true. I want to make one for myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wesley Chambers Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 As much praise as they get there must be something to it so I also need to try one out, I have read of everything being used to make them, springs, files, planer blades and so on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 One aspect is that scale eats files. If you can remove the scale with an easily sharpened item then your sharp files will stay sharp much longer! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wesley Chambers Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 I did see a lot of talk about using them just for scale removal, personally I use a wire wheel.. takes like2 minutes... maybe I'm not understanding something or maybe my scale is not as thick.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
son_of_bluegrass Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 For scale, I soak in vinegar overnight. Besides removing scale, it makes me take a break so I don't work tired. I do have a sen that I made from a half round file. I did find the angle it's sharpened it makes a big difference in how it works. ron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThomasPowers Posted October 14, 2011 Share Posted October 14, 2011 Not everyone works in a powered shop or wants to for that matter. I tend to use an angle grinder myself and do a bit of careful "hogging" before switching to the file. This is based on having *1* extension cord heading across the lawn to my smithy. When/If I get full electrical service then the bader and powerhammers and electric heat treat oven and *lights* will finally have their day! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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