What's The Point Of Stabalizing????

[Muttt]

I have never heard of stabalizing wood until I started reading the forging and knife making forums. I don't think I have every heard that term used. I have alot of knowledge of woodworking and have always just stained and polyurythaned my woods. Have never had anything crack warp or split. A nicely stained piece of mahogany or oak and several coats of poly makes it harder than hell. Wood you consider polyurythane over oil stain as a form of stabalization????

Mutt

[Rob Browne]

I always read it as seasoned.

[yea3114u]

Quote from Wood Stabilizing Specialists LLC

"We use a unique, proprietary process combined with a special blend of monomers and acrylics to stabilize, process, and dye a wide variety of hardwoods and softwoods for a superior product for artisans and manufacturers requiring extra durable material.

This process is the result of over 15 years of research, development, testing, and production. We do not laminate; we achieve complete penetration and stabilize materials in original form, with no change other than color/figure enhancement and a high degree of permanent durability.

This results in material that is resistant to temperature changes, humidity extremes, UV rays and saltwater as well as many acids and solvents commonly encountered in day-in-day-out use."

I think that this gives the wood a plastic like appearance and prefer and oil finish like linseed more. But i have also seen some gorgeous work with stabilized product.

Edit: Also if you are thinking of possibly trying something like this at home I have researched it a bit and come to the conclusion that it is a very nasty process that usually ends up in lack-luster results. This is probably something best left to the pros. And no I'm not affiliated with that link, simply the first on google.

Edited September 2, 2009 by yea3114u

[Muttt]

So basically,

Stabalization is like turning your wood into a product more similar to micartar block (I think that's the way you spell it). If I am going to put wood on a handle, it's gonna stay wood (maybe stain, oiled or polyurathaned) it appears that stabalized wood is more of a plasticized product. I'm not saying I don't like the way it looks, I'm just saying I will just stick with wood. If I want a plasticized product, I'd use micartar or plastic. Why ruin perfectly good wood and wood grain.

Mutt

[bnewberry]

As I understand it, wood that isn't as tough, durable or, well, stable as you would want a knife handle is sometimes stabilized through a process that infuses the wood fibers with what amounts to plastic or other substances that ensure that the wood will not come apart in use.

This is often used in a variety of burl woods that have interesting and convoluted grain paterns, but which also might more easily separate under hard use.

I think that some woods that might be too soft, but which can be colored or which have interesting grain patterns are also stabilized to make them suitable for knife handles or other uses.

I also prefer "real" wood, desert ironwood (non-burl), rosewood, osage orange etc. which tend to be tough enough to use without needing stabilization. That said, I can see why a maker would use stabilized wood. it allows a comfort level knowing that the wood is as tough as possible so that the customer is satisfied with the product.

[chuckster2.0]

Basically, stabilizing wood is replacing any water, resin, or air inside the wood with a plastic. The wood does not look any different than if you oiled it. The difference here is that the wood never needs to be reoiled/retreated. Coming from Colorado, that is an incredible statement. If I have finished wood that I intend to use I have to retreat it once or twice a year because it is so dry. It never warps, expands, cracks, fades, or yellow. If it gets scratched, you can buff out the scratch. If you want the knife to have wood on the handle and wish it to last as long as possible get it stabilized.

[mcraigl]

So basically,

Stabalization is like turning your wood into a product more similar to micartar block (I think that's the way you spell it). If I am going to put wood on a handle, it's gonna stay wood (maybe stain, oiled or polyurathaned) it appears that stabalized wood is more of a plasticized product. I'm not saying I don't like the way it looks, I'm just saying I will just stick with wood. If I want a plasticized product, I'd use micartar or plastic. Why ruin perfectly good wood and wood grain.

Mutt

I don't really understand your position. If I have it right, you're saying that you'll put polyureathane on the outside of your wood to cover up the grain etc., where it WILL get scratched and allow moisture exchange, but you don't want wood that has been saturated with a poly like substance (though much thinner and thus less affecting the "feel" of the grain), which can never get scratched off, and thus never allow moisture exchange?

Usually by the point in time of worrying about a finish for the handle, I've already got 20+ hours into a knife. The last thing I want to worry about is whether the wood will absorb moisture and swell when a customer/user takes it to the coast/humid environment, or that it will dry and crack when same person takes it then to a dry climate. Stabilized wood don't need a heavy coat of polyurethane on it to protect it, and thus in my mind actually retains the organic "feel" of wood better than plain wood protected with a surface finish. As said previously, feels a lot like wood with a nice tung oil finish on it to me.

[Rich Hale]

Knife making is sooo cool, you can look at all the choices you have for materials, shapes, sizes etc and make just wot you wish and just how you want it with just the materials you like. It is just as easy as that. And that is just wot I do. One thing you may want to do along the way is keep one eye open for things to make or things to use. I do that at shows or club meetings. And that is how I became aware of stabilized handle material. Folks that used it made better looking knives than I did. Easy choice for me. You decide for you.

[brucegodlesky]

To play the devils advocate, why are high end shotgun stocks not stabilized. I mean, if you have a $10,000 Parker , why not stabilize the stock?

Edited September 4, 2009 by brucegodlesky

[nonjic]

To play the devils advocate, why are high end shotgun stocks not stabilized. I mean, if you have a $10,000 Parker , why not stabilize the stock?

bigger lump of wood more stable as it self supports ? less surface area for the mass?, just a guess.

[yea3114u]

To play the devils advocate, why are high end shotgun stocks not stabilized. I mean, if you have a $10,000 Parker , why not stabilize the stock?

I would think that weight might be an issue as well. Every ounce counts when its something you will possibly be lugging through a field for hours and must be able to quickly put to your shoulder quickly. Just a speculation though.

[mcraigl]

The last parker shotgun was made in 1942, maybe they didnt have the technology back then? Many modern gunstocks are stabilized Ie. the proliferation of laminated and synthetic stocks...?

[wd&mlteach]

I have worked with stabilized wood for a number of years and it is wonderful stuff. It is strong, durable, waterproof, machines easily, and what I find the greatest is that it is extremely predictable. I use it mostly for turning game calls and pens. Stabilizing is not the same as a top coat finish like poly, lacquer, or shellac or an oil finish like Tung, linseed, or Danish. In fact it is not a finish but more of a process where wood is infused with a polymer. I think it is acrylic under intense pressure and maybe heat which forces it through every fiber of the wood or material. It is great for woods that are soft and punky or full of burls and bark inclusions. I have a couple of corn cobs done like this for pens they look cool.

There is a local company near me that came to my woodturner's club. They charge per inch and the piece to be stabilized cannot be over 2" thick and completely rotten. Other than that they will try to do it. If you are looking for another product there are some pretty cool layered woods out there. I buy all of my turning stuff and the stuff for school from a company called Hut Products. Check out the Dymondwood section. All of the layers are 1/16" poplar dyed different colors and glued under high pressure. Hope this helps.

[Muttt]

Yes, everybodies input helps alot. Now I think I understand stabalized wood a little better. Maybe I'll give it a shot. If I don't like it I can try other items instead. Thanks for all the input. Wasn't trying to get things heated ..... sorry if I sounded that way. Anyway, no I know what stabablized wood is.

Thanks

Mutt

[Muttt]

Well ....... I figured I would go over to the "Dark Side" and I went ahead and ordered some of the DymondWood from HUT. It looked pretty cool in the pics. And hey, it was pretty cheap. 20 bucks for a 2x2 inch 12 inch long piece (enough for 2 or 3 knifes). I'll let ya all know what I think of it when I get some. I've always been a die hard "natural wood" person in the past. We shall see if I actually "turn" to the dark side ...... LOL

Mutt

[wd&mlteach]

What kind did you end up purchasing?

[Muttt]

Sportsmans Camo and Tequila Sunrise. I bought I piece of each. They are 2 x 2 inches and 12 inches long. Well see how they work out.

[wd&mlteach]

Muttt I think you will be pleased and your knives will look great! Just in case you are wondering here is a picture of the two products side by side. It is a couple of old call parts I turned a few years ago. The stopper is made from the Field & Stream Dymondwood Pattern and the larger, tone chamber, is Spalted Stabilized Oak. You can really see the difference in the Spalted Oak, it has no open grain, they have all been filled during the stabilization process. Both of these products are from Hut as pre-drilled call kits. He does sell this stuff any size you want and un-drilled.

Someday I hope to make it to the knife making process when I do this is the first place I will go for supplies. He always has great stuff and he is always cheaper than Woodcraft.

[julian]

stabilized wood is just more ideal for a functional knife in many aspects opposed to wood that isn't stabilized.

You get a TON of function. It won't warp, crack, rot, expand/shrink, etc. When it comes to the finer points in a knife, if you have handle material that expands or shrinks as much as a centimeter it will ruin it.

But I'm sure you'll figure these things out one way or another ;)