Sam Thompson Posted June 16, 2009 Share Posted June 16, 2009 I've been asked to restore/extend some Victorian railings which have been leaded into a stone coping on a low wall. Does anyone have any idea how to get the posts out without damaging anything? The holes look to be about 6'' deep and the posts are 1.75'' sq. the lead is about 3/8'' wide. Is there an alternative to lead for re fixing them? I've used lead a few times and found it difficult and dangerous. All of the high-tec gunges that builders use are too thick or viscous and wouldn't go down the gap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlotte Posted June 16, 2009 Share Posted June 16, 2009 Sam, for getting out i think heat is the only solution. Heat the steel with a big torch untill you can shake it and then stop heating and keep shaking until it is cold enough that the lead doesn't melt. I worry about heating the rock. Putting back. hammer and chisel the lead out in chunks I'm afraid. It may have taken lead 100 years ago but that was poured in and the lead chilled. You could buy a cheap drillbit and try drilling the lead out with the certainty that the drillbit was disposable. But that doesn't sound like much fun. I'd use one of the epoxy putties or the gray stuff they anchor machinery these days. "Grout" Comes in several different formulations some of which take a few minutes to set up and can be packed in with a dowel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thingmaker3 Posted June 16, 2009 Share Posted June 16, 2009 For a replacement, would lead-free pewter (tin, antimony, & silver) be suitable? Might not be affordable... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigfootnampa Posted June 16, 2009 Share Posted June 16, 2009 I can't help you with removing them but this stuff, while not cheap, will seal them back in for the rest of your lifetime. It is very THIN and will run into hairline cracks with ease. You'll have to seal carefully to keep it in and then use small batches to seal the cracks before the final cast. It is incredibly tough stuff! Great for setting handles too (NOT hammer handles though... too hard for that... it does make a good finish for hammer handles).Home Page Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigjohn Posted June 17, 2009 Share Posted June 17, 2009 The best product I've used to set railings is called Garonite, it is a hydraulic cement. You can mix it thin enough to pour in to small openings. Heating the lead to get it out works best for me. If the mounts are far apart then you may have to drill and chisel them out. Lead is nice and soft and has a low melting point so it should be easy to accomplish this feat. Try not to band on the stone so much , it may rattle the mortar loose. Good Luck and be patient Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Knife-Scales Posted June 17, 2009 Share Posted June 17, 2009 The best product I've used to set railings is called Garonite, it is a hydraulic cement. You can mix it thin enough to pour in to small openings. Heating the lead to get it out works best for me. If the mounts are far apart then you may have to drill and chisel them out. Lead is nice and soft and has a low melting point so it should be easy to accomplish this feat. Try not to band on the stone so much , it may rattle the mortar loose. Good Luck and be patient Thanks for your information. BTW where to buy hydraulic cement? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Thompson Posted June 17, 2009 Author Share Posted June 17, 2009 I'm not too worried about the stones coming loose, they have got to be re-set anyway. My current plan is to try and melt it out with oxy-propane (there isn't space for a drill) and set them back with lead. I've decided on this because it hardens quickly and will go down the narrow gaps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GobblerForge Posted June 17, 2009 Share Posted June 17, 2009 Time has proven that lead is a wonderful way to seal the railings back in. It doesn't degrade or need maintained at all. Perhaps getting the upward pressure and heat will be difficult if more than one post needs to be freed at the same time. If the stones need to be reset anyway, then maybe you could pull the rail with the stones attached, support the post, then heat each post until the stone falls off. Gobbler Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Thompson Posted June 17, 2009 Author Share Posted June 17, 2009 Yes, that's the general idea. It will be possible to remove one post at a time as the whole lot seems to have been built up from a combination of WI and CI parts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frosty Posted June 17, 2009 Share Posted June 17, 2009 Seating posts with lead didn't necessarily mean molten lead. Often lead packing (foil) was hammered in and the finished product looks like it was poured. It takes patience but it can be removed with a hooked pick. If you can pour lead you can pour epoxy which is safer on all fronts. $0.02 Frosty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Thompson Posted June 17, 2009 Author Share Posted June 17, 2009 I always seem to make a mess when I use epoxy. I'm like a kid who can't wait for it to set; at least I can cut the excess lead off with a chisel. I could end up with my arm stuck to the side of the house:(. It's more than 100 yards to the pub. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigjohn Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 Sam, the Garonite is available at Garonproducts.com It was available locally till the business closed. They make really outstanding stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blksmth Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 You probably already know this, but the real danger of using molten lead is that if there is any moisture in the hole or even if the rock is moist inside, the lead will explode out of the hole when the lead is being poured into the hole. My father had his eyesight barely saved as he was wearing glasses when some lead exploded out of a hole. He was installing a metal railing on a cement porch. I don't remember for sure, as I was just a little feller helping him, but I think the molten lead flew several feet into the air. Just thought this was worth mentioning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devon blacksmith Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 Hi Sam we nearly always use chem set an epoxy resin.But if lead is specified ,IE on a listed building then we cold caulk with lead sheet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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